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Old 16-08-2014, 04:08   #31
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

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Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
Ö Where as, it's pretty much mandatory to have one's furling line be as strong as your sheets.

Why, you ask? Well, how's the load on the furling line any less than that on the jib sheet when you're sailing with the jib rolled up 1/3 of the way?
I agree about all the benfits of going with spectra, however the furling drum is normally a bigger diameter than the foil, typically at least twice the diameter and often more. This reduces the load on the firling line by the same ratio. So if I have a 40mm foil and a 80mm drum I have at least a 2:1 mechanical advantage and the furling line loads are half what the sheet loads are. Still most furling line and gear seems woefully undersized given the consequence of any failures.

Sounds like an interesting project you have turning a racer into a cruiser. Any details.

Cheers
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Old 16-08-2014, 05:43   #32
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

We will furl with minimum tension on the sheets the sail partly backwinded. No tight wraps.

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Old 16-08-2014, 13:43   #33
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

Wow! Firstly, let me thank everyone so far who has contributed to this discussion. The concepts and ideas offered have been serious, intelligent, experienced based and to the point. So, in summary . . . I have never been a fan of roller furling although I have used it on my present boat for the last 19 years. It has never been a problem in moderate conditions but always when the wind is 20 plus. And since we sail regularly in those conditions now, as we did in the past, there is always the problem with wildly flogging sheets and the unavoidable "death wrap" of the furling. There is no headstay wrap or sag, the bearings were replaced in the drum and the halyard swivel last year. The furling line is perfectly matched to the drum and the foils are in the correct postition to the locking collar and swage at the top of the mast. The halyard restrainer is properly aligned. We have attempted furling downwind and have found that you must keep slight tension on the leeward sheet to avoid the sail from blowing past the forestay(forward) and out of control. However, it also creates a cupping effect which, in turn, makes the sail more difficult to control and furl. One respondent even mentioned that I was carrying to much sail to which I would respond . . . there are two things in life you should never tell a man: 1.) how much sail to carry and 2.) how many times a week he should have sex with his wife/girlfriend. I will re-read the following posts, reanalzye and continue my quest for a perfect, heavy wind furl . . . Thanks again to everyone. By the way . . . did you hear the one about the 80 year old man and his twenty year old girlfriend ?. . . More to follow.
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Old 18-08-2014, 13:58   #34
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

"Just head downwind to furl, let out the working genoa sheet until the clew is a few feet aft of the stay, and furling will be exponentially easier right up to the finish. Less apparent wind, less pressure on the sail, sail is full so no sail flogging, no whipping sheets" Suijin

Suijin,
When you say let out the genoa sheet "until the clew is a few feet aft of the stay, " do you mean dead downwind or as I think Barnakiel has suggested to furl when the sail is "partially backwinded" -which I interpret to mean with the furled sail's leeward shape(the back side of the genoa to the wind) "backwinded" to the wind? Can you both clarify? Also, as others have suggested, I am also going to retry a slight easing of the jib halyard and cranking down a bit more on the split backstay. I am convinced there is no mechanical problem with the system as I have said previously since it works flawlessy in moderate winds. I am going to retry the downwind furl with the suggested advice and experiment further. Thanks to everyone again for the great responses.
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Old 18-08-2014, 14:48   #35
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

Barnakiel's:

'backwinded' - done when the boat is beating, fore-reaching or beam reaching.

Meaning when the sail is eased and so its fore part is no longer pulling and may/will develop a reversed belly profile in the luff portion of the sail.

When broad reaching or running the genoa can be simply blanketed and then are no tight wraps.

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Old 18-08-2014, 15:28   #36
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

"reversed belly profile in the luff portion of the sail." Barnakiel


This is what I thought. . . meaning the "backwinded" pressure would create a positive effect when furling since the pressure would accelerate/ease the furl rather that fight against the furl when it is cupped from windward. Is this correct?
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Old 18-08-2014, 17:22   #37
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

The forward portion of the sail is no longer pulling.

The difficult part is to ease the sail enough to make furling easier but not enough to let it flog.

This is a two man job doable solo once you manage to control the sheet and the furling line at once.

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Old 21-08-2014, 22:30   #38
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Re: Tight Wraps/Big Winds

On furling, has anyone mentioned the obvious? Meaning, just head up until the jib starts to luff lightly, & roll it in while maintaining a bit of tension on one of the sheets.
Thus there's little load on the sail, as you're close to head to wind. And if you need a bit of load, fall off a few degrees. Plus, no flogging to eat up your sail life, or high loads on the roller furling line. KISS
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