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Old 13-08-2016, 00:09   #1
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Sta-lok and insurance

Just looking at options to re-rig my masts and am considering doing it myself using sta-lok. Insurance company says the rigging needs to be signed off by a professional rigger in order for the rig to be covered by insurance.
Professional riggers won't sign off unless they install and the whole reason I'm considering doing it myself is to save quite a bit of money.

Does anyone have experience of getting insurance on the rig with a non-professionally installed start-lok system?

Has anyone had a successful insurance claim with sta-lok rigging?
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Old 13-08-2016, 01:46   #2
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Perhaps it's time for a different insurer? And it could be worth politely, but firmly asking them for documented failures of mechanical rigging terminals, & the forensic engineering reports which prove how the terminals failed & why.
Not that they're going to change their policies if you tell them to back up their stance, but.

Don't know if this will work. And it would depend on finding the right rigger. But you could perhaps have them show you how to do a few terminals, then do a few under supervision. Plus possibly several more on some short wire ends, or old wire. And take them to the rigger for inspection. Followed by doing your rig for the rigger's certification.

There are ones who'll work with you. Perhaps the above would work if you split the difference in price with them, between a fully professionally done job & a DIY one?
And it helps to personally know the local waterfront/marine provider mafia. Bribery works too; Scotch, Beer, Sports Tickets...

Good luck in sorting this out.
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Old 13-08-2016, 04:10   #3
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Most insurance companies want a good survey done every 5 years, if they arent happy with that give them heave ho and go else where. We do 98% of all our work, never had an insurance company baulk at that.
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Old 13-08-2016, 10:30   #4
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

I'd look for another rigger. A rig survey was required to get it insured by Markel. The local rigger did the inspection and my installed Norsemans were not an issue.
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Old 13-08-2016, 10:50   #5
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Use the Sta-Loks and do it yourself. It won't fail and if it does they would baulk at paying no matter who did it. No rigger in their right mind would certify work they didn't do them self and anyone that tells you different is delusional. You could also measure and order ready made rigging and install it yourself. That would save the lions share of the labor.
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Old 13-08-2016, 11:44   #6
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

How many riggers that work in boat yards are certified?
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Old 13-08-2016, 12:10   #7
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

I think you have a nit picky insurer and need to change.
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Old 13-08-2016, 13:35   #8
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

You need to stop asking your insurer "may I?" Or "How"? They're paper pushers and statistician, not riggers or engineers. I can't imagine a situation where I would get into a conversation with my insurance underwriter about what kind of rigging terminals to use.

I would Just do it. Mechanical fittings are well proven and you should have no problems passing a survey. Also, you don't need a rigger for an insurance survey. You could replace the rig, and if needed you could hire a certified marine surveyor to inspect your work and give you a letter - I can't imagine that would cost more than $500.

Perhaps this is also a good time to shop around for a new insurance carrier. You might save enough to pay for a survey this year, and save money on premiums next year.
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Old 13-08-2016, 14:06   #9
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Quote:
Originally Posted by cha0s View Post

(...)

the whole reason I'm considering doing it myself is to save quite a bit of money.

(...)
You may want to look up Sta-lok price lists again before you go any further.

Swaged terminals made by your rigger may come out way cheaper than Sta-loks (unless you have any special source of inexpensive Sta-loks).

E.g. 6mm Sta is at least 35 EUR here while a swaged terminal is about 25 EUR including the swage job.

Sta is 40% more expensive, as a minimum, here.

b.
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Old 14-08-2016, 00:51   #10
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Sure Sta-Loks are not cheap, but they ARE re-useable, so they pay for themselves, over time.

Ann, 30 plus yr. Sta-Lok fan.
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Old 14-08-2016, 01:09   #11
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Thr staloks are expensive but I can buy a whole lot of wire rope at trade price and staloks and put it all together myself. The rigger won't let me provide my own wire for him to do the swaging. So he sells me wire rope at rrp and swaged fittings at rrp and then charges me $170 an hr for 2 guys to fit them. So it's lots cheaper for me to do myself. If I could find a place in Australia to get the whole lot made up for me and just install it myself I would be happy to do that. So far I'm not having the whole lot of success with that. It seems the riggers near me operate on an all or nothing basis.
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Old 15-08-2016, 16:02   #12
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Cha0s,

Well, I am aware of one very greedy Aussie rigger. You may have to find someone else in the area. Their problem is that if they don't do the work themselves, how do they know you did it right? Your plan of having them do it for you, but using the sta-loks, not the swage machine, might be your road of least resistance.

Your physical location will have some bearing on this. If it is germane, send me a PM if it is Brisbane. There is one rigger there whom we trust.

Ann
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Old 15-08-2016, 16:47   #13
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
Sure Sta-Loks are not cheap, but they ARE re-useable, so they pay for themselves, over time.

Ann, 30 plus yr. Sta-Lok fan.
How many people keep a boat that long?
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Old 15-08-2016, 21:18   #14
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

kmacdonald,

You're right, most people don't. We've had Sta-loks, and Norseman (no longer available), have been cruising over 30 yrs. Just my opinion, but the ability to have wire shipped to you and do your own rigging of it was really useful in Vanuatu after our forestay broke.

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Old 15-08-2016, 22:29   #15
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Re: Sta-lok and insurance

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Originally Posted by kmacdonald View Post
How many people keep a boat that long?
They're both a selling point, & a buying point, given their reusability. So, call them an "investment". Plus they creating standing rigging which is both longer lived, & user servicable.
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