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Old 21-05-2015, 12:02   #31
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

So I trashed the first, practice one, and will now try to do a couple for real. Splice around the Barton ring at one end, and eye splice on the other end suitable to cow hitch to a padeye.
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Old 21-05-2015, 12:08   #32
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

see if this video is of help in regards tapering

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Old 22-05-2015, 01:25   #33
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

Sorry, I make this rope for a living,
The Brummel lock splice is what you should use, and also make your taper very gradual, in testing it will break at the start of the taper so make the taper very gradual.
Refer Nautilus Braids web site it has all the instructions.
If you only tuck the tail inside it will pull out in load cycling.
Cheers.
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Old 22-05-2015, 03:13   #34
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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Originally Posted by CRANBERRY View Post
Sorry, I make this rope for a living,
The Brummel lock splice is what you should use, and also make your taper very gradual, in testing it will break at the start of the taper so make the taper very gradual.
Refer Nautilus Braids web site it has all the instructions.
If you only tuck the tail inside it will pull out in load cycling.
Cheers.
Hi Cranberry
Welcome to CF .

Have a closer look at Dockhead's link. I think it is simply a Brummel lock with a tapered long bury, but achieved a different way (it can be done via several methods).
A Brummel lock is just the standing part going through the working end plus the working end going through the standing (the twisted side seems optional). Dockhead's link achieves that as far as I can see (there is a twist in one hole anyway).

SWL

Edited to add: Maybe the idea is to twist the sides to allow just the working end to be used and then ideally to manoeuvre it to remove the twist? I haven't quite figured out if it is beneficial to have a twist or it it decreases strength and you should aim not to have one.
If no twist is ideal, the easiest way to splice this is simply to use both ends of the line to feed through and avoid the use of any twist at all (only impractical if you have dozens of metres to work with).
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Old 22-05-2015, 03:22   #35
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

Well, my second one turned out much better. Was very straightforward to do after just one practice splice.

The only thing I don't like about it is I haven't been able to get the loop around the low friction ring quite tight. It won't matter that much in use, but it would be nice if it were nice and tight. Anyone know how to do this?

I bought a lot of new cordage from a guy in Gosport before setting off, and had him splice three low friction rings into three ropes I bought from him. Absolutely beautiful work, and for only 15 pounds for like 16 different splices/whipping.


One thing which surprised me was the amount of cordage which is consumed in doing these things. I bought 3 meters of 6mm Dyneema and made two strops, and there's not enough left for a third. I'm going to have to go back and buy a bunch more.
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Old 22-05-2015, 03:55   #36
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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The only thing I don't like about it is I haven't been able to get the loop around the low friction ring quite tight. It won't matter that much in use, but it would be nice if it were nice and tight. Anyone know how to do this?
When you have made the initial loop using your method, pull it as tightly as you can around the ring, then insert the fid into the standing end close to the ring. They do suggest skipping two holes though and they are not working with a ring. Maybe tightening around a ring puts undue stress at the locking point and this will create a weak spot? Something to consider anyway.

If it wasn't essential for this to be tight, I would not tighten it simply for aesthetics.

SWL
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Old 22-05-2015, 03:59   #37
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass View Post
When you have made the initial loop using your method, pull it as tightly as you can around the ring, then insert the fid into the standing end close to the ring. They do suggest skipping two holes though and they are not working with a ring. Maybe tightening around a ring puts undue stress at the locking point and this will create a weak spot? Something to consider anyway.

If it wasn't essential for this to be tight, I would not tighten it simply for aesthetics.

SWL
Yes, you might be right. Making it tight would certainly worsen the geometry. Sure does look nice, though. For functional purposes, you are only concerned that it is not so loose that it will fall off. The way the Barton rings are made, with deep lips, this won't happen before it's really very loose.


The point of insertion of the tail does not determine how tight the loop around the ring is -- it is how tight you pull the tail through.
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Old 22-05-2015, 04:15   #38
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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The point of insertion of the tail does not determine how tight the loop around the ring is -- it is how tight you pull the tail through.
I don't quite understand this. After making the initial loop and tightening it up, in your instructions the working end is poked all the way through the standing part at 45 degrees. Doesn't this determine how much the initial loop can expand?
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Old 22-05-2015, 04:22   #39
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

Inverted Brummel splice is the one you want. I replaced all my ss rigging with dynex Dux. You can make some great soft shackles with the leftovers. I found the colligo marine instructions on doing the inverted Brummel splice the best.


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Old 22-05-2015, 04:29   #40
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

Dock, what you are doing will work fine . . . . but it is in fact not the 'best practice' splice for this application.

This is the real max strength 'pro way' to do it:

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0899.JPG
Views:	149
Size:	21.6 KB
ID:	102520

Its an "end to end' splice which also cleverly captures the ring - gives the longest bury's and the best geometry.
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Old 22-05-2015, 04:43   #41
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

Evans, I have a query about the Brummel. Is the twist in the holes detrimental? Some methods leave the twist in, others work to kink it out, and the method of using both ends to work with avoids it altogether. What is best?

Also in some methods the working end goes through the standing part first and in others vice versa. Is one preferable?
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Old 22-05-2015, 04:46   #42
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Dock, what you are doing will work fine . . . . but it is in fact not the 'best practice' splice for this application.

This is the real max strength 'pro way' to do it:

Attachment 102520

Its an "end to end' splice which also cleverly captures the ring - gives the longest bury's and the best geometry.
That looks great!!

I don't need anywhere maximum strength for my application, but still -- what is in your picture is actually what I wanted in the first place. How is it done? How is the ring "cleverly captured"? Maybe I'll do the rest of them like that.
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Old 22-05-2015, 04:49   #43
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass View Post
I don't quite understand this. After making the initial loop and tightening it up, in your instructions the working end is poked all the way through the standing part at 45 degrees. Doesn't this determine how much the initial loop can expand?
Not nearly as much as how tight everything is at the point when it all locks up.

The problem is that slack develops as you are doing the rest of the splice.
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Old 22-05-2015, 04:52   #44
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Dock, what you are doing will work fine . . . . but it is in fact not the 'best practice' splice for this application.

This is the real max strength 'pro way' to do it:

Attachment 102520

Its an "end to end' splice which also cleverly captures the ring - gives the longest bury's and the best geometry.
sorry for my inexperience but what is end product used for ?
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Old 22-05-2015, 05:02   #45
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Re: Splicing Advice -- Dyneema

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Originally Posted by arsenelupiga View Post
sorry for my inexperience but what is end product used for ?
Sheet leads, barber haulers, just about anywhere you'd use a block.

The low friction rings are stronger than blocks, simpler, cheaper, have nothing to snag on, nothing to break, and work just as well if not better. Wave of the future.

I am using them as sheet leads or twings for my new blade jib, rigged for triple purchase. I rigged them temporarily by tying them to the padeyes on the rail. They are magnificent -- smooth, light action. I am making these strops -- need four of them -- so that I can cow hitch them to the padeyes, instead of tying them.

I will also be using them for my new dinghy lift system -- also rigged for triple purchase.

On modern race boats, you see more of these than you do regular blocks.
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