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Old 14-09-2008, 16:41   #16
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Maybe I could pad the shackles?
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Old 14-09-2008, 16:45   #17
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Give it a try....I still would not be anywhere near that clew when you tack nor expect it to not bang against the mast. I still don't see the problem with using one continuous sheet and a larks head knot.
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Old 14-09-2008, 17:21   #18
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I still don't see the problem with using one continuous sheet and a larks head knot.
^ This, I like.

However, this is most practical if you are not changing sails regularly, or, indeed, changing sail tracks regularly. For most cruisers with a (single) furling headsail, being able to quickly attach / unattach sheets from the clew is not a big priority.

We still race our boat, and have 4 headsails that we use regularly (#1 light, #1 reg, #2, #3). We generally peel (i.e pull up a new headsail before dropping the old one) and even with a change-sheet, you need to be able to swap sheets quickly. We also have 2 tracks each side for headsail cars - the standard, which is used hard on the breeze and the outside track for cracked-sheets. Add to the mix the practice using the brace for broader reaching and you have 3 potential sheeting lines and 4 potential sails.... j-locks, in this situation, are good.
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Old 14-09-2008, 17:25   #19
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No furling headsail. My motivation is to compensate for that a bit.
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Old 14-09-2008, 17:48   #20
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Depending..

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I prefer a Larks Head or whats called a Cow Hitch. It cant shake loose and it has minimal chance of snagging compared to a bowline. It has less mass than a flogging bowline as well.

Depending on your clew style these can slip as one did in a race just two weeks ago. They work best on large grommits rather than sewn in ring type clews. I have used larks heads successfully for years but on some sails they just don't hold as well..

If it works they are the least head banging knot to use!!
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Old 14-09-2008, 17:54   #21
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Maybe I could pad the shackles?

Jack you'll spend more time padding shackles than the 5-6 seconds it takes to tie a bowline. We do head sail changes while racing all the time and we use bowlines on about 75% of the sail inventory the others have their own sheets already attached some bowline some larks head.. If a fore deck guy can't untie and re-tie the sheets in less than abut 30-40 seconds you need new crew or a refresher course in bowlines....

Please, please, please for you own safety or your crews safety DO NOT use snap shackles or any more metal than the clew already has. A bowline hurts bad enough TRUST ME!!
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Old 14-09-2008, 17:58   #22
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Jack, Are you racing this boat? Because in our 17 years of cruising the headsail has been changed about three times so I don't understand your need to constantly change sails and redo the sheets even if they are hanked on.
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Old 14-09-2008, 18:06   #23
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We tie bowlines on our genoa. We use two differrent color sheets (green and red) becasue we have lots of newbies on board and it makes it easy for them.

On the J24 we single sheet with a cow's hitch. Never slipped yet.

I understand the concern about a flying shackle but there are lot's of things that can whang you on a boat. We had a lead car explode and the wheel went by my head with a half inch to spare.

Also all the spinnaker gear I have seen has snap shackles, so what's the difference?

I know - why add more dangerous stuff.

The biggest reason I won't shackle the genny is I have seen snap shackles snag and open. I also don't want that very hard snap shackle dragging across the shrouds, inner forestay and banging on the aluminum mast.

Finally if you leave one headsail in place for a "long" time. The day you need to unsnap the shackles they will be bound up with corrosion and salt and then you will be looking for a pair of pliers (BTDT).

So Jack - My advice is tie the sheets on, although for differing reasons.
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Old 14-09-2008, 18:33   #24
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Having lost the shackle off the jib clew day before yesterday, it is preferable to me to eliminate this piece of hardware. Looking at other boats in the marina, we concluded that knotting the sheets would work just as good, with a bit less convenience in changing sails. Much safer!
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Old 14-09-2008, 19:14   #25
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I won't be doing sail changes terribly often- this is for cruising- I leave for Mexico in just a couple weeks! (woot)

But without roller reefing I want to be able to do my 150 to storm transition at an "oh ****" pace should the need arise.
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Old 14-09-2008, 19:35   #26
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I was taught and thought that if you think you should reef/change sails it should have already been done!!!!!

Unless you are racing that is!!!!!
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Old 14-09-2008, 19:40   #27
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Quote:
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I won't be doing sail changes terribly often- this is for cruising- I leave for Mexico in just a couple weeks! (woot)

But without roller reefing I want to be able to do my 150 to storm transition at an "oh ****" pace should the need arise.
The time spent tying the two bowlines is pretty small in the total time.

But I guess every second could count.
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Old 14-09-2008, 20:23   #28
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For what it is worth, it is often recommended that your storm jib have sheets permanently attached.
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Old 14-09-2008, 21:13   #29
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For what it is worth, it is often recommended that your storm jib have sheets permanently attached.
Yup - I don't know how your Genny is sheeted or if you have separate lead cars. I presume your headsails are hanked on (no foil) so...

I would have the sheets attached to a the storm sail - or whatever sail you will fly in the bad stuff.

Our jib would be run through forward lead cars so we'd have to run them anyway.
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Old 14-09-2008, 21:47   #30
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try these

from Precourt, I hope the photo comes through.....:-)
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