Partially furl the Genoa?

[guyrj33]

The 10M has relatively small main sail and usually benefits from a larger jib. A larger jib then is typical on boats with a smaller J/E ratios that is. E on the 10M is 11, J is 14.2.
We have a 125% genoa that we use in the spring and fall here on Boston's North Shore and a 145% that goes on for the dog days of summer. Both sail have foam luffs and do still work when rolled up by about 10%. Much beyond 10% reduction in area and you really notice the loss of pointing ability.
Yes I would have rolled up the 150% to bring the 10M back up on her lines, they sail much better upright than they do with the rail in the water.
Guy
Puffin 10M #6

[meirriba]

By all means reef the genoa. Do it gradually until you find the proper amount of reefing for a particular wind strength and state of main reefing.
Than mark this place for future reference.
Do this in different wind forces and identify 2-3 points that correspond to 1st and 2nd reef of the main.
You will find the proper amount of roll when e.g. the mainsail is at 1st reef stage and the jib is rolled to an extent that the boat sails properly (i.e.) very slight tendency to try and turn upwind.
Mark the points on the sail and forget most of the advices above - while basically the advices are correct, you are not on a racing boat. All you want is some fun on the water so no need to go into the finer points of sail reefing and maintenance.

[hamburking]

You can partially furl. Your friend is letting the tail wag the dog.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by YPSILANTI

yes, it is safe to do so. Id heard this same debate and I recently asked a rigging expert the same question. His reply was emphatic, yes its safe to do so and it wont cause any damage or place any undue stress on your rigging. To the contrary.

Not your rigging, of course, but using a larger overlapping genoa - especially if it's a light air sail of light material - reefed down in strong wind, will bugger it! Not immediately, maybe, but it stretches and bags those sails out!

It's really much better to try to use furling headsails without reefing them. Having smaller sails for stronger conditions is highly recommended! Of course reef if you have to - don't sail overpowered - bit it's really worth trying to have the right headsail up for the conditions! And reef the main first!

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by sagablu

My buddy who is a life long sailor told me not too as my genny was not designed for this. If it was he said, it would have marks on it to indicate 130%, 100%, etc. So the question is, is it safe to furl in a little to reduce power without damaging the genny? Harken roller furler.!

Furl on! Furl around! Furl up!
Furl, furl, furl!

If its not designed to furl then an idiot designed it.

Not only that but experiment part reefing the genoa BEFORE you reef the main. Depending on the boat it loves it.

☺️☺️☺️

[jkindredpdx]

As my old mentor would say... "Don't let perfect be the enemy of good enough". Of course the furled 150% won't have optimal shape, but unless you are a racer, crossing oceans, have more money than you want, and have space below deck that needs to be filled up... "why borrow trouble?"

[Scrimshaw4]

I second what sapient sue said about having a foam luff put into the genoa. It helps retain sail shape when "reefing". Your sailmaker can add them and also mark your foot to show the "reef" points. I've had it done to all my genoas over the past 30 years and it works great! JMHO

[SaltyMetals]

If the 130-150% genoa does not have a foam luff then it becomes rather useless when partially furled. Either have a foam luff added or use a smaller sail. Forget about using a genoa without a foam luff when partially furled.

When a foam luff has been added there are usually some marks on the foot for 1/3, 2/3 etc but this gives a point at which you need to move the genoa fairleads forward to a pre-marked position on your track that you will have found to be correct from beforehand.
Andrew
"Genial Bee"

[Djarraluda]

Originally Posted by sapient sue

Sagablu

We had a special foam luff inserted in our genoa so that when partially furled a better shape is retained. We have done this to the last 2 genoas we have had made and the system works really well. When it gets up to 18knts we put one reef on the main, above 20knts we put 2 reefs in the main and partially furl the genoa. Above 25knts the genoa is totally furled and we use the stay sail to maintain the balance of the boat.

cheers Sue

Problem with the foam is that it wrecks the airflow when the sail is not furled.
Advice I have had from several sailmakers is to use it with caution. Old sails can be recut to be flatter, cheaper than foam inserts and better performance. New sails - why destroy the efficiency?
Yes, for a cheaper cruiser with one headsail only, by all means but be aware of the performance loss.
Roger

[Snowpetrel]

I had a high cut 120% lidgard Chameleon radial cut genoa with a foam luff on Snow Petrel 1. It worked very well over a pretty large wind range. Even to windward heavily rolled up performance was still pretty good although the shape was rather ordinary when deeply rolled away to spitfire jib size in 35 knots or so.

I also had a solent stay and a good bulletproof no4 jib, but to be honest I didn't find the performance difference a worth while trade off for having exactly the right amount of sail set.

[Jannie Radiance]

Originally Posted by sagablu

Hello All,

I was sailing this past weekend on my 1976 Pearson 10M in fairly high winds 20+ and gusts a lot higher. I had two reefs in the main and the main sheet was let out but still felt out of control on the gusts.

My genny is 150% so I thought I should furl it in a little. My buddy who is a life long sailor told me not too as my genny was not designed for this. If it was he said, it would have marks on it to indicate 130%, 100%, etc. So the question is, is it safe to furl in a little to reduce power without damaging the genny? Harken roller furler.

Thanks!

My Genoa has reefing indicating lines on....I sail in Cape Town SA in 20kts+ all the time.

[jrbogie]

markings to show percent furled???? never heard of it. as a life long sailor it's fair for me to say that life long sailors often know little of what they speak. what does knowing the precise fore triangle percentage do for you? 150 135 100 133 33 129???? who cares as long as the boat is powered properly. you have an infinite amount of sail you can shorten to so use whatever it takes. as a life long sailor and professional pilot, in both endeavors we have a concept known as THAR or that looks about right. it ain't about numbers it's about physics and physics don't know math.

that said, always shorten sail fore to aft. reef or change down headsails first, then reef the main to keep her balanced with minimum weather helm. and before you reef the main try a little twist by hauling the traveler IN not OUT and then easing the main sheet. you'll then ease more before flogging and you'll keep the lower part of the sail driving where you gain pointing ability and at the same time you'll spill air out of the upper portion thereby reducing healing moment. i know seems backwards, huh, but easing the traveler in a gust to keep her on her feet is one thing but if it's more than a gust and sailing conditions have changed it's time to retrim not just let everything out.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

You might consider shopping for a used smaller sail, in good condition. As often they can be had quite reasonably. And many used sail shops allow for an inspection period, & return if you don't find it to be satisfactory. Be they local, or half a continent away.

I have a similar sized yacht and indeed this is what I have done too. A smaller jib came up on e bay for £50. Bit of a gamble but turned out to be lovely and crisp and no obvious signs it has been used. I suspect its from one of those keel yacht classes which "must have" the newest sails to think they can win the class races.

Popped into my sail maker with it who pronounced it a bargain and about 80%. Little smaller than I might have chosen but for the price........

[Jannie Radiance]

Originally Posted by jkindredpdx

As my old mentor would say... "Don't let perfect be the enemy of good enough". Of course the furled 150% won't have optimal shape, but unless you are a racer, crossing oceans, have more money than you want, and have space below deck that needs to be filled up... "why borrow trouble?"

100% agree. and I am from racing stock.

[Jannie Radiance]

Originally Posted by jrbogie

markings to show percent furled???? never heard of it. as a life long sailor it's fair for me to say that life long sailors often know little of what they speak. what does knowing the precise fore triangle percentage do for you? 150 135 100 133 33 129???? who cares as long as the boat is powered properly. you have an infinite amount of sail you can shorten to so use whatever it takes. as a life long sailor and professional pilot, in both endeavors we have a concept known as THAR or that looks about right. it ain't about numbers it's about physics and physics don't know math.

that said, always shorten sail fore to aft. reef or change down headsails first, then reef the main to keep her balanced with minimum weather helm. and before you reef the main try a little twist by hauling the traveler IN not OUT and then easing the main sheet. you'll then ease more before flogging and you'll keep the lower part of the sail driving where you gain pointing ability and at the same time you'll spill air out of the upper portion thereby reducing healing moment. i know seems backwards, huh, but easing the traveler in a gust to keep her on her feet is one thing but if it's more than a gust and sailing conditions have changed it's time to retrim not just let everything out.

What a pleasure to teach an old yachtie new things. North Sails and Ullman sails put them in. It is awesome. Now you can furl to the first vertical line on the foot and repeat that setting next time in similar conditions. Beautiful guide.