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Old 14-10-2011, 10:26   #1
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Opinions on Rod Rigging

the replacement mast i am about to stand up is complete with very (very very) new rod rigging.

i was under the impression that whenever i did the standing rigging next, i could just replace the rod with cable but yesterday i was lead to believe that it isnt as easy as just adding a terminal to cable but some major modification of some kind.

the mast is a bit bendy so i was entertaining the notion of converting to cable in a few years when i stop sailing around SF bay and sail down the west coast, thru the canal and up the east.

any thoughts / opinions?

-steve
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Old 14-10-2011, 10:41   #2
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

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Originally Posted by ssanzone View Post
i was lead to believe that it isnt as easy as just adding a terminal to cable but some major modification of some kind.
Was there a reason why it would be difficult? It should be straightforward.

What sort of end terminals are on the rod? You should be able to get wires with the same end terminals.

But there's nothing wrong with rod for cruising. We went RTW with rod on our Shannon, and a few years ago switched the headstay on Hawk from wire to rod.
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Old 14-10-2011, 11:38   #3
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

i dont really know... the terminals are the 'standard' bulbs that are common on rod rigging.

like i said, i expected i could just attach the same terminal on cable (crimp or weld or whatever) or find a turnbuckle with a turnbuckle on one side or something.

this was a 'blah blah blah.... i am not expert but... blah blah blah..... bendy mast.... blah blah.... cruising.... rod .... 4 or 5K blah blah'

it is my inclination to dismiss this and move forward as in 5 days the new stick (with rod rigging) is scheduled to be stepped at 12% of the suggested retail price, but it was certainly worth asking what others have learned / experienced.

-steve
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Old 14-10-2011, 12:18   #4
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

There are a great many C&C's on the Great lakes (and in many saltwater locations) and all which came with rod-rigging. In my case, that rigging has been subjected to the freeze/thaw cycles of almost 30 lake Superior winters (-30' F to 100' F), has been closely inspected yearly, and is still in great shape. I know i'm pushing it and fully plan to change it out "soon" but wow, 30 years on standing rod rigging on a boat that's not babied!
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Old 14-10-2011, 12:26   #5
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

Rod rigging is fine and can be reheaded once. You should be able to get a whole bunch of years out of the rod rigging if it is very low time. Don't remember the exact interval but rod rigging is supposed to be reheaded/replaced after a specific number of years. That may be an insurance requirement but probably not a bad precedent to follow.

No problem with switching over to wire as long as the fittings on the mast will work with Norseman/StaLok or wire swage fittings. Get the fittings and check it out. My wire supported mast has to have swage fittings. Norseman/StaLok terminals won't fit in the tangs. As far as the turnbuckles, you should be able to buy toggle and/or stud fittings to match wire as well as rod terminals.
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Old 14-10-2011, 12:27   #6
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

There are a lot of issues when moving from rod to wire. What are you trying to accomplish by changing? To go to wire you should do some engineering on the rig or discuss with the mast maker. The rod is much stronger and has much less stretch. You will need to upsize the cable significantly to get the same strength and stretch as the rod. This will add significant weight and windage to the rig. Not a good thing. By the time you replace all the end fitting for the rod to go to wire, you will probably find that the cost is not cheaper or only a very little cheaper than replacing the rod with new.
Rod on a cruising boat is fine. Valiant 40's have had rod for long time.It has a lot of advantages, not the least of which is that it is less susceptible to pollution and corrosion. The down side is that you can replace a stay in the field, like you can with wire and manual terminals. For a cruiser, it is good to have some spectra line available to make temporary stays on a rod rigged boat.
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Old 14-10-2011, 13:34   #7
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

you guys are excellent! this is what i was thinking originally and hoping to hear.

-steve
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Old 14-10-2011, 13:52   #8
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

Yeah, if it had rod rigging I would stay with it. There are some negatives, but not many.

I have heard people say if it ever does break it will be "catastrophic" not gradual, but I am not aware of any case of rod rigging breaking (without hitting something).
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Old 14-10-2011, 13:59   #9
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

my last boat had rod rigging that was fine after 22 years use

when I researched it the only recommendation was to replace the screws every 10 years, nothing about a recommended reheading

if my current boat had rod rigging I would be happy about it
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Old 14-10-2011, 15:13   #10
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

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I have heard people say if it ever does break it will be "catastrophic" not gradual, but I am not aware of any case of rod rigging breaking (without hitting something).
Most standing rigging failures are catastrophic. Most are in the fittings not the wire or rod. You are being overly optimistic if you think that rod heads don't crack. They do. They can be pretty well inspected - see the Navtec site.
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Old 14-10-2011, 15:41   #11
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

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my last boat had rod rigging that was fine after 22 years use

when I researched it the only recommendation was to replace the screws every 10 years, nothing about a recommended reheading

if my current boat had rod rigging I would be happy about it

DL...The "screws"? What screws?
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Old 14-10-2011, 16:54   #12
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

23 years with rod rigging on my CS36M. So far so good. The only down side is when taking the mast down for the winter. That rod rigging goes where it wants.
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Old 15-10-2011, 13:51   #13
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

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Most standing rigging failures are catastrophic. Most are in the fittings not the wire or rod. You are being overly optimistic if you think that rod heads don't crack. They do. They can be pretty well inspected - see the Navtec site.
I am sure the fittings can give way, and the Chainplate is still the most dangerous point. But Ibelieve the rod itself is virtually impervious to failure. I am not a mettalurgist though.
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Old 16-10-2011, 08:47   #14
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

For the OP: You might want to refer to the Navtec website for their advice on care and maintenance of rod rigging. They recommend a "class C" inspection (disassembly of all components, inspection by x-ray or dye penetrant and reheading) every 6 years or 40K miles. Further, and somewhat more disturbing, they seem to advise replacing the "T-hooks" (in both rod and cable rigs) EVERY YEAR!!! Wow! How many of us do that?

Anyhow, their advice is full of hedges, but they certainly don't advise using their stuff for the periods mentioned in the earlier posts.

I'm sure that they practice CYA big-time, but it's kinda scary to me.

Cheers,

Jim
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Old 16-10-2011, 09:55   #15
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Re: Opinions on Rod Rigging

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Further, and somewhat more disturbing, they seem to advise replacing the "T-hooks" (in both rod and cable rigs) EVERY YEAR!!! Wow! How many of us do that?
Sounds like CYA recommendation. Kinda like the surveyor casually recommending "rebed all deck hardware".
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