New Jib Sheets! What are These?

[Kenomac]

This is the year I planned to replace our jib sheets for the Yankee and staysail, simply because they're getting too stiff and difficult to lock in the #64 Lewmar winch.

When behold my good luck! Going through our stern locker to make davit repairs, I found what appears to be a brand new, unused set of Yankee and staysail sheets all made up with this locking gizmo on the end with a rubber ring. Apparently the previous owner had purchased them as spares. I can't believe it took five years to discover them.

Here's my first question:

Is it OK to use them with the metal locking mechanism? I've always tied bowlines for attachment to the jib.

Second question:

What's the rubber ring for? Or were these lines originally intended for another purpose and somehow the prior owner obtained them from another boat to be used as jib sheets?

They kind of look like halyard lines off a 75ft Oyster, approximately 90-100 feet long. There's also a smaller pair which can be used with the staysail.

[savoir]

I don't know the size and grade of rope so I can't be sure but those are old spinnaker guys or sheets.

Guys would be cored with something low stretch such as dyneema or kevlar and sheets would be regular double braid. 100 feet is too short to be the halyard on a 75ft Oyster which would have a halyard something like 190ft. Similarly, 100 feet is too long to be staysail sheets on an Oyster 53 which should be around 50 ft long. There is no thimble shown so I'm guessing spinnaker sheets.

The black things are to stop the beak of the spinnaker pole from jamming on the snap shackle. If you use these as yankee sheets then you won't be needing the black donuts.

[.Paul.]

Kenomac,

They appear to be spinnaker after guys. The metal snap shackles attach to the clews on the spinnaker. The line runs through the spinnaker pole end fitting, back through a block on deck and to a winch. The black ring prevents the shackle from getting into the fitting on the end of the pole.

Paul

[SV Bacchus]

Holy Moly Ken, what other surprises lurk undiscovered?

[puffcard]

The only thing they can be, are after-guys. You need to cut the snap shackles off if using as headsail sheets. Just imagine those things flogging against everything while tacking. I would never have a quick release shackle on a jib sheet. The fittings are of value and design so you're able to blow a chute while under a load with a fid. I have seen the Gibb types let go also while flogging, lucky we still have the lazy sheet.

The smaller pair may be light air sheets. Are they the same length and smaller diameter or shorter.

[savoir]

One more thing - those snap shackles would be fine for a staysail but not strong enough for a jib. I don't know the size of your yankee but suspect they would be too small for it as well.

[bsurvey]

spinnaker guys with trigger shackles. there should be a fid around that will trigger the opening of the shackle, most times used during the take down of the spinnaker. very nice shackles and expensive take good care of them

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by puffcard

The only thing they can be, are after-guys. You need to cut the snap shackles off if using as headsail sheets. Just imagine those things flogging against everything while tacking. I would never have a quick release shackle on a jib sheet. The fittings are of value and design so you're able to blow a chute while under a load with a fid. I have seen the Gibb types let go also while flogging, lucky we still have the lazy sheet.

The smaller pair may be light air sheets. Are they the same length and smaller diameter or shorter.

Yes, there are two sets of apparently spinnaker after guys. One pair much lighter than the other.

[Kenomac]

Yo gang...

I was under the impression my spinnaker is an asymmetric type, and last season I added a Bymar top down furling mechanism which worked great.

Now I have a spinnaker pole, so along with these enormous after guys I just found, how are they used with a pole? Should I be using the spinnaker with the pole so it doesn't collapse in on itself at times?

We don't intend to do any racing or using the spinnaker in windy conditions with just the two of us onboard.

[svHyLyte]

The lighter set are the sheets, the heavier set are the guys. Usually they are "bundled" together a longer light line a shorter, heavy line that becomes the "lazy guy" when the sheet's employed. In "the day" most fellows carried a folding knife that had a blade on one end and a folding fid on the other to "pull the trigger" on the shackles.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by svHyLyte

The lighter set are the sheets, the heavier set are the guys. Usually they are "bundled" together a longer light line a shorter, heavy line that becomes the "lazy guy" when the sheet's employed. In "the day" most fellows carried a folding knife that had a blade on one end and a folding fid on the other to "pull the trigger" on the shackles.

I don't understand. Do you know of a diagram that can illustrate this setup?

[Kenomac]

OK I found this.

Is it possible what I have isn't an asymmetric, but instead a downwind type symmetric? On the Baymar, it's long enough to come all the way down to where it's supposed to and has a large clew attachment at that point.

What's the proper way to use this thing?

[Kenomac]

Here's the spinnaker in use:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xAmZYKTOWcU

[nigel1]

Difficult to tell from the video Ken, but it kind of looks a symmetrical spin.
One way to tell for sure is to compare the length of the leeches.

[UNCIVILIZED]

You can use both types of spin's on a pole, asym's & sym's, but you'll have to take it off of the furler. So you may wish to get a sock/snuffer for it. The upside is that it'll let you steer deeper wind angles.

As to how to rig the lines, you clip your "new" guys (afterguys) to the clews of the sail. And clip the sheets through the bails of the guy shackles.

NOTE: Folks, news flash, the clew of ANY sail can be dangerous. Shackles on it or not. It's not the metal bits that create the danger, but rather the fact that the clew of a flogging sail IS the business end of a bull whip. As long as you're situationally aware, & don't do anything foolish, there's little enough danger.

Shackles actually make it safer to corral an out of control sail then when you don't have them. As you only have to stabilize the flogging clew but for a second, in order to clip on a shackle. Where as to tie on a bowline, or secure a soft shackle to it, requires 2 hands to tie the knot/secure the soft shackle. And quite a bit of time comparably. All while someone else has to try & hold the sail still. A sail which most likely has metal clew rings.

Ever have to go out to the end of the spin pole (when it's in mid-air) while surfing along at 15-20kts & connect another line to it. Guess which type of connector is easier to use; shackle or soft shackle? And yes, while you're out there/up there, you're definitely using one of your hands, if not both, to hang on much of the time.