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Old 09-04-2006, 18:17   #31
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A jib is loose footed. Any main can be loose footed. A boom does not control sail depth. A mast controls sail depth.

Delamry, our main is 1000 sq ft and is loose footed. Go to a good sailmaker. North, UK, Doyle,,,, They will build the correct sail for you.
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Old 09-04-2006, 18:22   #32
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And Wahoo, I don't like hollow in the main, I barely like it in the genny's but your kinda stuck there. For a few batten you give up way to much in sail area and performance to ever do that to a main sail unless you have in mast roller furling. And even there options are available.
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Old 09-04-2006, 19:59   #33
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Gord

my experience in racing is also old but everything you say rings true to me. As far as racing boats I sailed on plenty of them where the boom section was considerably larger than the mast section. I have never heard that the boom has control over flattening the sail except for this -- when sailing up wind cranking the vang on has an effect on mast bend b/c the vang will push the boom into the mast thus inducing mast bend.

Wheels:

advantages of a non-rigid boom is simplicity. Price. Easy to fix since it is just a block and tackle. A non-rigid boom requires a topping lift on the boom or else when reefing the boom will fall when the main halyard is lowered to reef.

advantages of a rigid boom: No topping lift required. Boom always in a lifted posiition. You can lift the boom in light air conditions to take load off the leech. they are expensive.

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Old 09-04-2006, 22:43   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joli
And Wahoo, I don't like hollow in the main, I barely like it in the genny's but your kinda stuck there. For a few batten you give up way to much in sail area and performance to ever do that to a main sail unless you have in mast roller furling.

Funny, the logic in this statement escapes me. Are you saying that if you have in mast roller furling you dont take the performance hit? ;-)

Seems to me that hollow leeches are universally decried unless it is for a fancy piece of gear :-p
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Old 10-04-2006, 16:47   #35
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One other advantage of having a loose footed main, which is very situational, and most sailors will probably never have to use, s that it facillitates what is known as a "letterbox drop":

If you are carrying a shy spinnaker in very strong breeze, you can fire the brace from the beak, smoke the halyard and pull the kite into the cockpit using the lazy brace, through the gap between the foot of the main and the boom (i.e. the"letterbox"). This requires less crew up forward (so less weight on the bow), is safer (less people on the foredeck of a heeling boat is good), and dragging the kite through the slot will act rather like a "snuffer".

Just for the record, my 40 footer has a loose foot main, fully battened with a substantial headboard. The rig is 66' high off the deck, and the boom is too long to pass inside the running backstays.
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Old 11-04-2006, 00:40   #36
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So is there any major difference in the sail design between loose foot and non.
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Old 11-04-2006, 15:34   #37
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AdamY Wrote:
Quote:
Are you saying that if you have in mast roller furling you dont take the performance hit? ;-)
Of course you take a performace hit with a hollow leach main so why take that hit if you do not have in mast roller furling. Some in mast roller furling can be fitted with vertical battens so you can have roach but it adds to the bulk of the sail and it may not fit in the mast.

Alan, The only reason I have found to have a foot on the main is so the kids can lay in the boom when sailing. Can't do that with the loose footed main casue the kids fall through. Shape, durability, price,,,,it does not matter which way you go.

Weyalan your like me, too many miles and too many years racing. We liked to keep the guy at the pole and blow the halyard taking the kite under the genny and into the main cabin. Always a leap of faith that you wouldn't shrimp but if you did not ease the guy you never did.
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Old 11-04-2006, 17:49   #38
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Weyalan your like me, too many miles and too many years racing. We liked to keep the guy at the pole and blow the halyard taking the kite under the genny and into the main cabin. Always a leap of faith that you wouldn't shrimp but if you did not ease the guy you never did.
Did you run a brace and a sheet on both clews?
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Old 11-04-2006, 18:22   #39
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This is clearly some of the "Best Of" cruisersfourm. Almost as good as being out sailing!

The wind has been blowing strong these past few days down here at the "fat" end of the Chesapeake. It's warmer and I am so anxious to get out there.
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Old 11-04-2006, 20:48   #40
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Hey Weyalan, Guessing your term brace is our lazy guy.

On our last boat we ran lazy sheets and guys over twenty but under that we just went with sheets and twings. The boat was not that big (35') and the kite was maybe only 1200 sq ft so easily managed. We always end for ended the pole on the boat regardless of using lazy sheets or not.

With the current boat we always run lazy sheets and guys unless we are flying the assy kite.

How do you like the new boat?
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Old 11-04-2006, 21:21   #41
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Brace

A brace is the guy. If you are running two lines to each side you could have a lazy brace and sheet, depending which board your are on. Sounds like Ozzy talk.
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Old 11-04-2006, 21:42   #42
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Yeah, BC Mike C has it right. Where I sail:

1.The line that goes through the "beak" at the end of the spinnaker pole and then onto the "fixed" clew is called the "brace".

2. The line that goes onto the "free" clew is called the "sheet".

3. We have a brace and a sheet attached to each clew. The sheet that is attached to the clew that is curreently "fixed" is called the "lazy sheet" and the brace that is attached to the "free" clew is called the "lazy brace".

We jibe by dip-poling, but my racing experience is mostly on 38' to 30' yachts where end-for-ending is not really practical (nor safe). We can also slide the inner end of the pole up & down the mast, which makes for easier dip-poling.

Just out of interest, what, specifically, do you guys call sheets and braces? Also, do you have different terms for
Topper (spinnaker pole topping lift)
Kicker? (spinnaker pole down-haul)
Tweaker? (spinnaker sheet down-haul)
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Old 12-04-2006, 07:58   #43
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Our guy is your brace.
Sheet is sheet.
Pole down is your kicker
Topping lift is your topper
Tweaker is tweaker.

We always jibed end for end, tough to dip with a short crew.

Here is a sistership of a boat we raced for a few years. As you can see from the photo, center bridle is set up for end for end jibes and tweakers for light air so no lazy sheets or guys, really anything under twenty did not require lazy's.

Fun boat, good to race or cruise.

http://www.onedesigncharter.com/schock35.htm

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Old 12-04-2006, 08:21   #44
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Hi Weylan:

in California kicker is called the foreguy. Also the down fu#4er andtopping lift is called the up fu#$er. We tried end for ending an IOR Farr 40 during Transpac. Worked great until we popped the Spin one time. The Bridal was too short and put an excessive load on the pole and bent it into a bow. we tried to straighten it good luck but set the spare up for Dip Pole. Dip Pole Gybing with six people and running back stays in 30 knots in the middle of the Pacific is not for the faint of heart.

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Old 12-04-2006, 09:42   #45
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Around here it is the guy and sheet, pole up pole down and the tweakers are barber hauls. We also use brace and sheet on Aussie Rules the Laser 28, as well as tweakers. The Ozzy skipper has a bunch of other names for stuff that everyone ignors. We also use topping lift and down haul, but the line that hols the boom up is also a topping lift and the line that pulls down the head sails is also the down haul. Some folks call the boom vang the kicking strap, halyard can be spelled halliard, but the last two are mostly British folk who get over it. Some also use the California pole up and down words. The boats up to about 30 feet end for end the pole, and we do not tie off the chute for launching. I use two guys and sheets on windy days. The Laser 28 is about 4000 pounds and I am 7400 pounds.
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