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Old 12-10-2013, 08:32   #1
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jib boom

Having just come from a soggy day at the Annapolis Sailboat show, and looked at the Hoyt jib boom on the Alerion Express 28 for the umpteenth time, it begs the question, "why don't we see booms on jibs?"

On a recent trip down the Chesapeake, I saw a few cutters with booms on their inner stay-sail, but not on the fore-sail.

If I extend my thought process a little further, couldn't a boomed jib even have reef points?

I'm obviously missing something here as there doesn't seem to be any modern examples of boomed jibs, aside (perhaps) from the Hoyt design.

Jerry
Warrenton VA
M-23 cutter
out of Port Kinsale VA
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:44   #2
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Re: jib boom

Boomed jibs are only usable on 80-100% sized sails. And typically used with fractional rigs having large, roachy mainsails. There is also that "sweeps the deck" issue that many do not like.

So masthead rigs and overlapping headsails rule out jib booms for most, except on stay sails.

Yes, reef points are possible, but most of the Hoyt implementations are roller-furled.

We have a variation on our catamaran called a "Camber Spar", which is a half-wishbone boom contained in a pocket in the jib. We love it - self-tacking, perfect sail shape, wing-on-wing downwind, self-vanging and doesn't sweep the deck when tacking (it goes overhead).

The Hoyt jib boom has those features as well, except for the last one.

However, we are a catamaran with a 3/4 fractional rig and a very large roach main, so being limited to a 90% jib is not much limiting - particularly with our large code 0 for light winds.

Mark
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Old 13-10-2013, 05:57   #3
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Re: jib boom

Mark, I'm not sure I understand your first point about a [smaller] jib on a boom typically being used on "fractional rigs with large roachy mainsails...."

I read this to be a sail balance thing - I think.

Jerry
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Old 13-10-2013, 08:39   #4
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Re: jib boom

I meant to convey that a jib boom prevents one from using a headsail larger than ~90%. So sail area is usually made up in the mainsail, which will be large and roachy. These designs are also typically fractional rigs, which give more sail shape and control possibilities to the mainsail.

Sail balance will come from positioning of the mast in the design and from control of the main shape and area. The jib will be a smaller component of that, although a jib boom will help because it will provide vanging and a better shape for some points of sail where a normal jib starts to fail.

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Old 13-10-2013, 09:08   #5
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Re: jib boom

Got it.

My boat is not a fractional rig. See
Montgomery Sailboats Owners Group

I am a new sailor, having learned on a home-built 8' Bolger "Nymph" catboat, I graduated to a boat with a lot more strings to pull and am slowing understanding balance/trim, at least as it applies to my boat.

I rarely fly all 3 sails, as I find the inner stay-sail not worth the work when tacking. The combination stay-sail and reefed main, however, is a terrific heavy weather combo.

My foresail is 100% hanked-on and the little stay-sail has a wire luff.

Reading Lechter's "self steering for small sailboats" - I note the he used a boom on his foresail, which provided (through some tackle) the mechanical means to control his tiller when the wind is from the aft quarter.

My boat will self-steer before the wind easily (tiller lashed) with the little stay-sail & reefed main. With the 100% foresail and main, the self steering balance (before the wind) seems a little more difficult. It might be my imagination, but I find that when using my 100% fore-sail, the boat is better balanced with one tuck on the main. It might just be because it's sailing flatter (and a little slower)

I caveat all this by repeating the fact that I'm a new sailor and may not have yet grasped all the finer points of sail trimming! This sure is different than an 8' catboat!

Thanks for your answers!
Jerry
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Old 13-10-2013, 09:15   #6
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Re: jib boom

Sweet boat, but it doesn't use a jib boom for its jib - and could not because of the staysail stay would block it. Also, your boat was designed to get more out of its staysail than most with staysails. Yes, a reef in the main moves the CE forward a bit and takes out weather helm when just using your 100% jib.

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Old 13-10-2013, 09:40   #7
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Re: jib boom

Thanks, it IS a sweet boat! Most of the time, the stay-sail remains in its bag, below decks! It's kind of an either/or thing. I run either the 100% or the stay-sail.

Thanks for the education!
jerry
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Old 21-10-2013, 22:08   #8
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Re: jib boom

try to play with a remote control sailboat

they have bermudian sloop rigs with headsail booms

kind of neat and fun and you can see what it would do. They do self tack amazingly well
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Old 21-10-2013, 22:41   #9
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Re: jib boomi

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr-canada View Post
try to play with a remote control sailboat

they have bermudian sloop rigs with headsail booms

kind of neat and fun and you can see what it would do. They do self tack amazingly well
That piece of lumber is called a boom for a reason. Had the stitches to prove it. Always in the way on the foredeck for using the windlass as we'll as any other work that needed to be done up there. Traditionally rigged boomed jib/ staysail results In a lousy setting sail, unless vanged down,'off the wind. That defeats the only valid reason to have one.

Made a couple of deliveries on Westsail 32's while we were building ours, learned to hate the damn things. Ditched the staysail boom on our boat and never regretted it. Found short tacking with the loose footed staysail to be an easy operation single handed.
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Old 21-10-2013, 22:57   #10
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Re: jib boom

My only real experince with staysails, was with a staysail ketch. I found that the staysail with the mizzen, was a great stout wind set up! With a furled main or at least a reefed main. In winds of 20mph or higher, it was our go to set up! Furled genny, full staysail, and either full or single reefed mizzen and furled main! Made for easy sailing for the wife and I on the 51 ft ketch we just sold! just turn the pilot on and kick back !! Jib and Jigger all the way
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