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Old 14-07-2017, 00:27   #61
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

Threads frequently head off on useful tangents .

The above twin stopper design has a severe limitation that it can't be pushed through a narrow opening, so even if I come up with something that has a high strength, its uses will be restricted. Also lots of people state they don't need stronger designs of soft shackles (it is easy to increase strength by simply going up in line size, or fully wrapping the shackle around an additional time before securing), which makes application even more limited. I am still curious to see how the limits can be pushed.

Still on the subject of dyneema, but diversing a bit :

Dockhead, are you still using dyneema loops with LF rings lashed on?

Unlike twin stopper soft shackles, the applications for the Bullseye weave are tremendous.

This weave removes the issue of horrifically high tearing forces when a LF ring is clenched at the base. The ring is held snuggly, but with manipulating the lines in a specific sequence the ring can still be removed. The weave is also much quicker to do than lashing or whipping. It literally takes seconds.

I used the weave in a high load application last summer and it stood up beautifully. It was a limited trial, but not insignificant. The weave compressed, but sprung back to look completely normal with a tiny bit of wriggling. The base of the Diamond was melting at that point, as was the dyneema at the apex of the LF ring interestingly, so loads were not insignificant.

Strops with rings are being both made and sold using a Brummel lock or whipping or lashing. With whipping and a Brummel lock, tearing force up to nearly 40% of the applied load occurs at the base of the LF ring if secured so the ring cannot slip out (I now know this figure to be correct). This must drop the longevity of these strops dramatically when they are used for a prolonged time at close to SWL.

In my opinion, there is huge potential in the applications for the Bullseye. I am hoping to have it load tested shortly so it can be used with confidence.

SWL
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Old 14-07-2017, 00:38   #62
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass View Post
. . .Dockhead, are you still using dyneema loops with LF rings lashed on?

Unlike twin stopper soft shackles, the applications for the Bullseye weave, are tremendous.

This weave removes the issue of horrifically high tearing forces when a LF ring is clenched at the base. The ring is held snuggly, but with manipulating the lines in a specific sequence the ring can still be removed. The weave is also much quicker to do than lashing or whipping. It literally takes seconds.

I used the weave in a high load application last summer and it stood up beautifully. It was a limited trial, but not insignificant. The weave compressed, but sprung back to look completely normal with a tiny bit of wriggling. The base of the Diamond was melting at that point, as was the dyneema at the apex of the LF ring interestingly, so loads were not insignificant.

Strops with rings are being both made and sold using a Brummel lock or whipping or lashing. Tearing force up to nearly 40% of the applied load occurs at the base of the LF ring if secured so the ring cannot slip out (I now know this figure to be correct). This must drop the longevity of these strops dramatically when they are used for a prolonged time at close to SWL.

In my opinion, there is huge potential in the applications for the Bullseye. I am hoping to have it load tested shortly so it can be used with confidence.

SWL
Yes, it's on my list to try your weaving technique. I haven't changed anything about my strops since last year.

I had been having a lot of trouble with them due to the "tearing force" you speak of. I use four of these strops with low friction eyes for my jib twings, and they are subject to huge loads.

I haven't been "lashing" them; rather whipping the legs together to retain the ring. Eventually I started lacing the whipping to add bulk between the legs (this sounds Freudian) to reduce the angle. This worked very well, and the last ones I did like that have held up well. I still have some early ones to redo, but I am way behind with all this make and mend stuff as I am extremely busy with my work now. Eventually I will change them all for something like your much more elegant woven ones, but there are a lot of more urgent things on the list, like putting an eye splice in my new mainsheet, mending a chafed jib sheet, and a ton of other stuff like that, which just never seems to end
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Old 14-07-2017, 00:50   #63
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
Yes, it's on my list to try your weaving technique. I haven't changed anything about my strops since last year.

I had been having a lot of trouble with them due to the "tearing force" you speak of. I use four of these strops with low friction eyes for my jib twings, and they are subject to huge loads.

I haven't been "lashing" them; rather whipping the legs together to retain the ring. Eventually I started lacing the whipping to add bulk between the legs (this sounds Freudian) to reduce the angle. This worked very well, and the last ones I did like that have held up well. I still have some early ones to redo, but I am way behind with all this make and mend stuff as I am extremely busy with my work now. Eventually I will change them all for something like your much more elegant woven ones, but there are a lot of more urgent things on the list, like putting an eye splice in my new mainsheet, mending a chafed jib sheet, and a ton of other stuff like that, which just never seems to end
I meant lacing, not lashing. Not a Freudian slip though .

Would you like me to send you a Bullseye loop strop? If so, is it 8mm dyneema that you are using with a 28mm ring? With a little manipulation the ring can be inserted after the strop is made. I have been moving my rings between various strops while I was trialling them. The weave does need to be made to fit a specific size of ring though.

SWL
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Old 14-07-2017, 01:24   #64
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass View Post
I meant lacing, not lashing. Not a Freudian slip though .

Would you like me to send you a Bullseye loop strop? If so, is it 8mm dyneema that you are using with a 28mm ring? With a little manipulation the ring can be inserted after the strop is made. I have been moving my rings between various strops while I was trialling them. The weave does need to be made to fit a specific size of ring though.

SWL
Yes, please!

Yes, 8mm dyneema and 28mm rings is what I have.
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Old 14-07-2017, 01:26   #65
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

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Yes, please!

Yes, 8mm dyneema and 28mm rings is what I have.
Just send me a PM with the address and it will be on its way next week .

SWL
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Old 14-07-2017, 01:35   #66
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

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Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass View Post
Just send me a PM with the address and it will be on its way next week .

SWL
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Old 15-07-2017, 08:29   #67
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

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Dunno if this helps but a long way back in the day when I was assisting with some load testing of stitching on aviation cargo nets, we always did 10 but most of the time, the spread was under 10%. We pretty well knew after the first three, what the rest would be. We needed the ten to "prove" what we sorta knew.



Increasing the load slowly is easy enough, my problem is the release point. The "snap back" shock load of a low stretch line breaking is much higher than that of a stretchy line - or so it is as I understand it from someone who should know.



Proper load testing equipment is usually mechanical rather than hydraulic


An instron is hydraulic. And with a load cell and a logger you will know what exactly is going on
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Old 19-07-2017, 06:05   #68
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

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YES! instructions for the diamond knot similar to your button knot instructions would be wonderful! i had tried sever other instructions and even some youtube videos for the button knot and none of them got me there. yours did. and after doing 50 or so of them, now i also can do them with my eyes closed.
I have just posted instructions for you on how to tie a Diamond knot:

How to tie a Diamond Knot

The key is to learn to tie a Carrick bend first. Spend an hour repeatedly tying these and you will become super comfortable with the bend. Then there is simply one more easy step involved for a Diamond. Just wind each tail around the adjacent standing leg and up through the middle and tighten.

Have fun .

SWL
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Old 08-08-2017, 11:04   #69
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Re: Introducing the "Crown Jewels Soft Shackle"

I need to share this knot with you since I made it as a result of wondering how far one can go in making asymmetric stopper knots. It is not even a stopper knot any more but a handle. And I don't believe that asymmetric stopper knots would really be the best (generic) option for soft shackles, because of the risk of slipping when the knot turns into an unwanted angle. Anyway, here's the handle.

Picture 1 has two loops at the two working ends. Picture 2 adds some smaller loops around the ropes. Picture 3 adds an overhand knot between the two halves, and the working ends have been tucked inside the loops. Picture 4 shows the tightened handle.

The basic idea of the knot is to lead the standing end ropes as quickly as possible to the underside of the handle. This way they will be tensioned, and will keep the handle in shape also under heavy load. The upper parts of the handle (the small loops and the overhand knot) are there just to provide some material that will not compress under load. And of course they are there to provide a good grip for your hand.
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