Hoyt Booms

[Dockhead]

If these are so great, then why are they not on every yacht?

I recently visited the KM Yachts yard in Holland, and had a look around the owner's personal yacht, which had one of these -- but actually -- it had a hydraulic vang on it.

The arguments seem overwhelming -- especially, the question of angle of attack. I'm now using a three-dimensional sheet lead system (designed and made by me, but shameless copied from a mini-transat boat) which gives me a little control over the inboard-outboard position of the sheet lead, and it is a revelation. It is no less effective as a sail control then the traveler is for the main.

So why not a Hoyt boom? At least, one with a vang of some kind, not the ghastly fixed ones like we see on some boats from a recently bankrupted builder. This takes that -- inboard-outboard control of sheeting angle -- to a completely different level. The clew can be put right out far over the rail, in fact.

For running, you can spread the canvas out to the wind just like a square-rigger.

What's the catch? There must be one. I'm not seeing it, however.

[a64pilot]

I don't understand, what do you mean by fixed?


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[barnakiel]

Only till you get hit by one.

b.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I don't understand, what do you mean by fixed?

The boom angle is fixed. As in the original Hoyt patent. The Hoyt Boom was originally designed that way.

[Jim_W]

They are good for day sailing pretty hard to put a dinghy on deck for cruising. you also can't use a big genoa

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

The boom angle is fixed. As in the original Hoyt patent. The Hoyt Boom was originally designed that way.

Mine isn't and came that way Circa 1987. If for example I wanted to put a dinghy on deck all I have to do is remove the pin that attaches the sheet lines and hoist up the lanyard, the pole will lay right alongside of the Staysail. It has a simple bolt and a clamp that it articulates on. Now the newer ones do have that bend in them and appear to be fixed, I have always wondered why.

But for running down wind I'm seriously considering twin headsails, as opposed to running the Staysail out on its boom, boom is of course a pole so to speak, but I think the larger headsail would give more drive.

But then I am still learning, some have removed the boom as it's easy to remove, but I keep thinking, if there is no advantage, then why was it there?


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[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

The boom angle is fixed. As in the original Hoyt patent. The Hoyt Boom was originally designed that way.

Mine isn't and came that way Circa 1987. If for example I wanted to put a dinghy on deck all I have to do is remove the pin that attaches the sheet lines and hoist up the lanyard, the pole will lay right alongside of the Staysail. It has a simple bolt and a clamp that it articulates on. Now the newer ones do have that bend in them and appear to be fixed, I have always wondered why.

But for running down wind I'm seriously considering twin headsails, as opposed to running the Staysail out on its boom, boom is of course a pole so to speak, but I think the larger headsail would give more drive.

But then I am still learning, some have removed the boom as it's easy to remove, but I keep thinking, if there is no advantage, then why was it there?


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[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Jim_W

They are good for day sailing pretty hard to put a dinghy on deck for cruising. you also can't use a big genoa

I run a 135% Genoa, largest I can without new tracks, without any issue, to carry a dinghy on deck takes about 1 min to pull the pin and raise the pole, but you do then lose use of the Staysail, but then your just a Sloop, nothing much wrong with that?


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[cal40john]

I'm confused. I know what a Hoyt boom is, and I know what a club footed sail is. It seems to me part of the definition of a Hoyt boom is that it doesn't require a vang.

Why is what you described not a club foot with a vang added?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by cal40john

I'm confused. I know what a Hoyt boom is, and I know what a club footed sail is. It seems to me part of the definition of a Hoyt boom is that it doesn't require a vang.

Why is what you described not a club foot with a vang added?

It may very well be. I will be glad to be corrected on the terminology, if there are better or more precise terms. The design of this boat called it a "Hoyt boom", but maybe it would really be better just to call it a "jib boom", since it is different from the Hoyt design in some ways.

[a64pilot]

Read post #7 here, is this similar to what your considering?

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...boom-1333.html

[a64pilot]

I found an image on the net, not my boat and I assume it's OK to post as it has the copyright on it.
But anyway as you can see the pole is straight, no curve and the part that attaches to deck has a bolt that the pole pivots on, the pole can be at any angle even straight up alongside of the furled staysail. This is just like mine, and it has the Hoyt Logo on it, so I assume it is a Hoyt boom
The funny bend and fixed angle came later I believe.
Remove that one bolt and the one pin at the other end of the pole, and the pole is removed. Or if you like pull the pin and run the pole straight up alongside of the furled Staysail

[cal40john]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

It may very well be. I will be glad to be corrected on the terminology, if there are better or more precise terms. The design of this boat called it a "Hoyt boom", but maybe it would really be better just to call it a "jib boom", since it is different from the Hoyt design in some ways.

I see some people on the web are calling a club foot a jib boom, but traditionally that term already has been taken as an extension to the bowsprit. Or is it so obsolete that folks started using it for something different?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jibboom

I've sailed on a friend's CT 41 that had been modified with a square course and a square topsail on the main mast, and had 3 jibs, the outermost was tacked on the end of a jibboom (traditional usage of word, as in wiki linked.)

[cal40john]

He patented this idea in 1995.
Jib Boom Data Sheet
John G. Hoyt Inventions, Patents and Patent Applications - Justia Patents Search

Island Packet included the "self vanging" Hoyt boom in its 320 as described in a 1998 article
Island Packet 320

Is what you're talking about older or newer than that?

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I found an image on the net, not my boat and I assume it's OK to post as it has the copyright on it.
But anyway as you can see the pole is straight, no curve and the part that attaches to deck has a bolt that the pole pivots on, the pole can be at any angle even straight up alongside of the furled staysail. This is just like mine, and it has the Hoyt Logo on it, so I assume it is a Hoyt boom
The funny bend and fixed angle came later I believe.
Remove that one bolt and the one pin at the other end of the pole, and the pole is removed. Or if you like pull the pin and run the pole straight up alongside of the furled Staysail

[Kenomac]

I could never work on our cutter, either the staysail will be in the way or the inner-forestay. The jibs would need to be way too small.