How to tie a Diamond Knot

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

Thanks for this. Now all day, whenever someone catches me with a silly grin on my face, & asks why, my answer will be "interesting". To say the least.
"Hello, my name is... & I'm a Spectra addict".

Also thanks for the "assembly line" tips. And for those new to soft shackles & such, one can make them (the legs) long enough to loop around/through the items to be secured, twice (at least), should you so desire, in order to make shackles made from small diameter cordage X times stronger. Where X is the number of times the shackle is looped around/through things, prior to cinching it down.

Good tip . This is also one way of increasing strength without going to a stronger stopper.

One comment about the vast number of knot related threads I have started. Some people believe the adage "Those who can do, those who can't, teach". I think that is rubbish. If someone has skills that can be shared to improve the lives of others, I believe it is selfish not to do so. As an anonymous contributor on CF, I have nothing to gain (except the satisfaction that I may be helping someone) when I take the time to post instructions for ropework others may be struggling with (or share recipes etc).

Others here give their time in a similar way, with helpful posts when members seek advice. There are always the "bad eggs" who do nothing other than put others down, or post in a rude unhelpful manner, but in general the sailing community is a good one .

SWL

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

I'll have to look up that "unknot", sounds interesting. And when it comes to soft shackle options, if somethings going to be in place for a long time, I "cheat", & either use strops or lashings. Both of which, like soft shackles are usually reusable, as well as being KISS. And take rediculously high loads with zero problems.

Yes, I agree with this -- simple spliced dyneema loops are fantastically useful things. I use lots of them for different purposes.

I've always used lashings, and you don't need dyneema for that. In fact I think lashings are probably better in polyester since there is so much more friction. I have a couple of miles of small stuff on board for different purposes including lashings. I bought a whole sea bag full of miscellaneous small stuff at the Southampton Boat Show years ago -- as a fellow ropeoholic I know you'll understand how I treasure it


The Starzinger "unknot" shackle is the easiest to make I know, and it works very well. But it is cruder and not as pretty as the ones done with diamond and button knots, and is probably marginally less secure since the "knob" is not perfectly round. But I sure liked it when I needed to manufacture a quantity of soft shackles last summer in a hurry.

[hpeer]

Any links to the unknot?

Looks like bethandevans is gone.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by hpeer

Any links to the unknot?

Looks like bethandevans is gone.

Bummer.

He calls it the "Loop Stopper", and I found it in Wayback Machine.

Maybe there are some other links?

[bravenewworld]

You guys, what a bunch of palabora! there are a half dozen easier, faster and very dependable alternatives that can be broken and untied faster as well. Why all the techno spider webs?

[Cu Mor Glas]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

Yes, Knotaholics Anonymous .

I am posting these instructions by specific request though (at least that's my excuse ).


SWL

I would say that in this forum she kinda already has created a self help group for us.....

and as the requestor i wish to say thank you very much!! i know what tomorow's lunch break will be spent doing!!

[Cu Mor Glas]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

Good tip . This is also one way of increasing strength without going to a stronger stopper.

One comment about the vast number of knot related threads I have started. Some people believe the adage "Those who can do, those who can't, teach". I think that is rubbish. If someone has skills that can be shared to improve the lives of others, I believe it is selfish not to do so. As an anonymous contributor on CF, I have nothing to gain (except the satisfaction that I may be helping someone) when I take the time to post instructions for ropework others may be struggling with (or share recipes etc).

Others here give their time in a similar way, with helpful posts when members seek advice. There are always the "bad eggs" who do nothing other than put others down, or post in a rude unhelpful manner, but in general the sailing community is a good one .

SWL

at a point earlier in my life, i spent a lot of time with doctors in their residency. they had a thing they called "see one, do one, teach one" the actual number was almost always greater than one in practice, but the premise was that mastery of something takes more than just doing it. and that there is something to be gained in your own understanding by teaching what you have recently learned to others.

it's something i incorporated in my work life and my home life with my children (who aren't exactly children anymore even though they will always be my children). it was really funny a couple weeks ago when i employed that method with one of those very doctors right after she finished her first brummel splice in some 2.2mm uhmwpe line. she caught me at it when I was suggesting that she now teach it to another member of our party......

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by Cu Mor Glas

at a point earlier in my life, i spent a lot of time with doctors in their residency. they had a thing they called "see one, do one, teach one" the actual number was almost always greater than one in practice, but the premise was that mastery of something takes more than just doing it. and that there is something to be gained in your own understanding by teaching what you have recently learned to others.

it's something i incorporated in my work life and my home life with my children (who aren't exactly children anymore even though they will always be my children). it was really funny a couple weeks ago when i employed that method with one of those very doctors right after she finished her first brummel splice in some 2.2mm uhmwpe line. she caught me at it when I was suggesting that she now teach it to another member of our party......

Yes, I spoke hastily. I have actually learned a tremendous amount myself just putting things in writing. It does give a much deeper understanding and I do sometimes tweak the technique in the process. It occasionally even makes a light bulb turn on in my head and leas to better things . Also, the pleasure of helping others is not to be underestimated. I have gained plenty .

Have fun learning to tie the Carrick bend and Diamond knot. They are both classics, even if you don't use the Diamond for soft shackles (the Button still wins hands down ).

SWL

[Cu Mor Glas]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

Yes, I spoke hastily. I have actually learned a tremendous amount myself just putting things in writing. It does give a much deeper understanding and I do sometimes tweak the technique in the process. It occasionally even makes a light bulb turn on in my head and leas to better things . Also, the pleasure of helping others is not to be underestimated. I have gained plenty .

Have fun learning to tie the Carrick bend and Diamond knot. They are both classics, even if you don't use the Diamond for soft shackles (the Button still wins hands down ).

SWL

Agreed on all counts! helping others is a pleasure that can't be explained to people who don't derive that same pleasure and needs not be explained to those that do.

I will. thanks again!!!!

[Seaworthy Lass]

I wrote earlier that there are 4 ways you can start a Carrick with the blue line (with the bend ending up aligned one way). I made a mistake. Thinking about it there are eight.

I have photographed these (the tape indicates the standing end).

The first four (first two rows) start with the tail starting under the loop. All four can lead to a Diamond.
Started as in the first row, both tails continuously move anticlockwise (this is easy to see from the loops made).
Started as in the second row, both tails continuously move clockwise.

If you start a Carrick with the tail over the initial loop, as in rows three and four, you cannot form a Diamond.

Neat, isn't it .

I suggest practising tying the Carrick all 8 ways. That way you will become super familiar with the bend, you will know which of the 8 ways you can use for a Diamond, and then performing one extra step to form a Diamond will be a breeze.

SWL

[ImaginaryNumber]

A couple more quick ways to make soft shackles, using the diamond stopper knot and kernmantle-type line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEsugNBTJi4

[Menlim3]

Can you show maybe how these knots are used in action on a boat?

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by Menlim3

Can you show maybe how these knots are used in action on a boat?

There are a zillion ways of using soft shackles on board (only a slight exaggeration ).

They can be used to replace just about any stainless steel shackle. These are super lightweight, relatively inexpensive, don't bang on the deck or the crew, are easy to open and close without any tools ......

They are particularly good where stainless steel shackles are not suitable, for example attaching sheets to the headsails, or snubber to chain.

A photo of one in use on our snubber is attached (this particular one is a high strength one with a Button stopper, but we used standard ones with Diamond knot stoppers for a couple of years prior to that).

[NevisDog]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

There are a zillion ways of using soft shackles on board (only a slight exaggeration )...

Two weeks ago I didn't know what a soft shackle was; now I see them everywhere; I'm hooked - single headsail sheet attachment, attaching the main halliard to the dinghy slings... uses are endless, where a steel shackle would be dangerous. Thanks so much for introducing me to this worthy evening pastime - now I can bake one up in a couple of hours whenever I find a new use for one.

But, tell me, why use a diamond knot when the button knot seems stronger, neater, and just as easy to make?

[StuM]

Originally Posted by NevisDog

But, tell me, why use a diamond knot when the button knot seems stronger, neater, and just as easy to make?

Yep, IMNSHO:
Button knot is stronger.- the shackle loop runs around four legs rather than two giving a wider turning radius.
Button knot is neater - no exposed ends.
Button knot is more secure - tails buried in legs.