How terrible is it to run a mast cable not in a conduit?

[carlheintz]

My problem is internal halyards. I've got the mast down now and am re-thinking the nice looking but not so practical situation... with 6 electrical wires + 8 instrument wires+ 3 halyards + antenna coax. The P/O just had everything loose and the clanking was distracting... to say the least.

[Sailshabby]

Slip a foam collar on the cable.

[Don C L]

Do you have internal halyards? It does depend on how much other stuff is in the way as you pull a cable through. If there are not too many screws or bolts poking through to block it, I'd recommend what I have done twice on two masts (that don't have internal halyards, but I think it would still work if I did)... wrap the wires every couple feet or so with a few inches of foam pipe insulation. I taped the upper end of the foam tight to the cable and the foam kind of splayed out like a skirt. That way as I pulled the bundle through the mast the foam sections were less likely to snag on a screw poking through. Sometimes I had to rotate the mast (laying horizontal) or shake the cables a bit as I pulled, to get them to move through. It's easy, light and does not add to the holes, screws, bolts or rivets in the mast and no more slapping. Works for me. (I'm a little anal about weight aloft too.) HOWEVER my good ol' friend who is a rigger recommends installing conduit to keep cables separate and held firm, safely away from anything else going on inside the mast, and that is what he does for his customers.

[JPA Cate]

Generally speaking, the reason for putting the cable inside the conduit is to keep it away from the screw ends that also penetrate the mast and could damage it; quieting the "bell" is a secondary benefit.

Have never tried the "zip tie" method of shock absorbing for a cable, so not qualified to discuss it.

One time when we didn't have room in the conduit for a radar cable, we secured the cable to the inside of the mast, using a method of seizing wire. Drill two parallel holes about every 6 feet, push the wire in, snag the cable, fuss around getting the other end of the wire out, wind the two ends together, and so on. On the way down, Jim put silicon seal over the twisted together ends. Never had a problem with it, but that mast is now at the bottom of the Tasman, and that's another story.

Ann

[hamburking]

Originally Posted by the_alpine

Don't do it. Unless you don't mind the incessant slapping noise.

And the slapping noise never stops. Never. Ever.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by epiic

I ran the radar cable thru the mast for my B&B 4G radar last weekend while the mast is off to get the boat ready for shipping.



I am unable to see if there is conduit all the way up my mast.



What is this "zip-tie method" that you guys are referring to?

Did you get an answer?
If not it's zip tie three usually zip ties in a star pattern, that way the long legs of the zip ties will keep the cable from ever hitting the mast, and since they take up so little room unlikely they will interfere with halyards.

[a64pilot]

None of my mast wires are in a conduit, nor are they foam covered, have zip ties etc.
I will fix that when the mast comes down to replace the standing rigging and chain plates next year. It is annoying, especially as My head when I am sleeping is within 6" of the mast.

[Dulcesuenos]

They absorb moisture ?

Sent from my STUDIO 5.5 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Dulcesuenos

They absorb moisture ?

Sent from my STUDIO 5.5 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

The foam? Zip ties? No. Not sure what else you may be asking about.

[foufou]

Is it possible to snake a plastic tube (conduit) up the mast by removing a turning block at the bottom of the mast and sending the tube like pex which is more flexible than most conduit up through that opening? Then using the zip tie idea to secure the tube.

[Djarraluda]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Did you get an answer?
If not it's zip tie three usually zip ties in a star pattern, that way the long legs of the zip ties will keep the cable from ever hitting the mast, and since they take up so little room unlikely they will interfere with halyards.

Just in case someone did not fully get this - the cable ties attach to the cable and radiate out in the star pattern. Your cable, with the stars attached is then fed inside the mast.
They do not secure the cable to the mast, the intent is they locate the cable inside the mast and thus stop it getting near the sides.
One problem here is the load on the cable. That is why some folk talk of using a catenary wire to take the weight. Too much stretch on a cable will damage it, so a heavy cable, over time will fail. Catenary takes that load and saves the cable stretching. Particularly important if we have high voltage or if we use a screened cable, such as a coax.
Roger

[Old Swampy]

On the Cape Dory 36, 'Diapensia,' we had we soon tired of the rattle in the mast. The next haulout I found that the extrusion had a track (I think it was on the forward side of the mast) for which slugs were available. With slugs every 30 inches tied to the cable with cable ties, there was no more noise. This technique is not possible without taking the mast out, unless you have a big door in the bottom of the mast.

[ramblinrod]

Originally Posted by dstrout

I have spoken to two riggers now who are convinced that the only way to install my radar is to pull the mast so that they can put in a new conduit for the cable. Apparently, if I don't run it in a conduit, it will warp my soul, curve my spine, and lose the war for the allies.

But really, is it that bad? It's the B&G 4G radar, so its not a high-voltage cable, and it's only 20-ish feet up (just above the steaming light, not at the spreaders). If I put some foam pipe insulation or use the long zip-tie trick, is this going to be a horrible mistake?

thanks,
Dave.

While cable slap is a minor annoyance, expensive cable destruction and radar failure at the most opportune time, is the real concern. For little boats with external halyards the mast is a conduit. Either place electrical tie wraps in a 3 point star pattern every twelve inches, or run the cable
Up through 1/2" pipe insulation. For masts with internal halyards, held taught between uppper and lower sheaves, the cable better be in conduit, else it will come in contact with the halyard.

[senormechanico]

Originally Posted by Jesse

I've tried to think of a reason why foam peanuts are a bad idea,-----------I got nuthin.

The foam peanut solution has merit. But most trucks are welded to the masthead leaving little or no access to pour them in,neat idea though.

When I bought my boat and shipped it back from ONE year in Mexico, when we stepped the mast the original conduit fell out of the mast in a million pieces looking like broken beer bottle glass.

Except it was plastic.

The boat was only five years old.
We lived with the clanking sound for a couple of years and finally replaced the conduit.

AHHH ! Silence.

BTW, my mast is stepped on deck but has a solid post in the middle so the internal halyards exit slightly below deck level and go into tunnels to the cockpit to avoid deck mess.
The peanut idea would have resulted in a ground up peanut mess every time we used a halyard !
If the halyards are internal, no matter where your mast is stepped, it's going to eventually result in "peanut" butter at the due to halyard chafe.
Edit: Ramblinrod, minor annoyance? You must be kidding. I suppose it's only minor if you can turn off your hearing aids.
If you don't have any, maybe you need 'em ! lol

[Lawrence]

Lots of good advice here to quieten the possible noise,but the most important protection is to relieve the stress at the top of the cable assembly from which hangs 20 feet of cable. The constant movement can work harden the copper core and result in breakage. Make sure the cable weight is transferred to an attached line or stainless cable.