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Old 13-05-2016, 13:52   #16
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Re: Furling Lines

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
I totally agree. Except probably I would do Selden electric ones. But furling lines are basically wrong for sails of this size.
For your future boat or when you decide to go with a mechanical system. Reckmann hydraulic is the way to go. The reason is simple electric vs hydraulic..... nothing good ever comes from having anything with an electric motor mounted at the bow where it can get splashed or submerged in seawater.
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Old 13-05-2016, 17:35   #17
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Re: Furling Lines

I'm with Cheechako. Just get whatever 10mm base level poly rope is available in your area. One with a matt finish would be better for the hands. I quite happily use justplain Samson LS and it is 12 years old. The only matt finish European ropes that I know of are Liros Top Grip and Seastar. No doubt there are others.

Anything with Dyneema in it is overkill.
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Old 13-05-2016, 17:38   #18
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Re: Furling Lines

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Dock head,

There are a couple of blended lines. Salsa being the most common example. It's really designed for hand worked main sheets and has one of the best hands of any line I have ever used. I probably wouldn't use it for a furling line brought to a winch however.

For your furling line I would probably use a pretty small diameter endurabraid. You could taper it if you want to gain room on the drum but if you aren't worried about space there is no need to do so. The other option is to splice amsteel into a tenex cover. The amsteel carries all the load, and the tenex just adds to the size. In my case the run between the drum and the last block is raw amsteel (when fully reefed). So you ever touch just the dyneema.
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Your going to like the smaller diameter line. Much less friction in the system. Easier to keep clean. My mizzen is out of the boat right now and new halyards are being installed. In the case of halyards I kept the large diameter line for the psychological comfort when going aloft but absent that I would go with a smaller size on that as well. Like you I am disgusted with the life of my sheets...2 years? Not okay...all being replaced.
Samsons MLX is a dyneema blend that has some good strength and low stretch. I have been looking at it for my more critical control lines like mainsheet, traveler, and furler lines. It has a good price as well. My halyards are Endura and they are nice on the hands but are pricey and I don't think you need the strength of Endura for furler lines.

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Old 13-05-2016, 20:05   #19
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Re: Furling Lines

I agree that endurabraid is rediculiously expensive, that's why I use dyneema and core tenex with it. The tenex is almost throw away cheap, but the splicing would get expensive if you don't do the work yourself.
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Old 13-05-2016, 20:15   #20
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Re: Furling Lines

I don't reef my jib, don't even have the foam insert in the luff, but I am a 64' boat and yet can furl the jib by hand even in a storm. I don't use a winch.

The line is a 3/8" polyester doublebraid from New England Ropes or Samsom or Yale. I buy from any of these three. The furler is Furlex.


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Old 14-05-2016, 06:17   #21
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Re: Furling Lines

I reef the jib. I consider the furling line to be one of the most critical peices of rope on the boat. If it fails in a blow I am in big trouble. On my old 33 footer I used 10mm doublebraid she had an oversize drum so it could all spool on, including a good margin of extra turns for when the sail rolled on tightly. On a 60 footer we used 10mm spectra with the cover removed so it would spool onto the ridiculously small drum cleanly.

Its also worth making a furling handle out of a bit of wood or alloy sized to slide between the clew lashing and the foil and at the right length so you can rotate the foil by hand if need be. Ideally it can be slid over slightly and be long enough to jamb in against the pulpit to lock the foil off. This is very useful if the line breaks, jambs or the bearings fail.

For a few weeks we set, and furled a 62 footers headsail with a stick like this due to the lower bearing failing. It worked pretty well.

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Old 14-05-2016, 07:06   #22
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Re: Furling Lines

If my furling line breaks I'll just lower the jib with the halyard. Did that for 20 years with hank-on sails, never failed.


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Old 14-05-2016, 07:33   #23
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Re: Furling Lines

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If my furling line breaks I'll just lower the jib with the halyard. Did that for 20 years with hank-on sails, never failed.


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You make it sound so easy!
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Old 14-05-2016, 08:14   #24
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Re: Furling Lines

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Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post
If my furling line breaks I'll just lower the jib with the halyard. Did that for 20 years with hank-on sails, never failed.


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Hank-on jibs have much less friction than roller furling ones, and besides that -- wrestling the loose jib on the foredeck in a blow??

I've only had one broken furling line, in a bad blow, and what I did was different -- sheeted out, turned right downwind to reduce the strain, crawled to the foredeck with a line, bent it on to the broken stub with a sheet bend, and then crawled back to a winch and furled the sail.
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Old 14-05-2016, 08:15   #25
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Re: Furling Lines

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Originally Posted by Snowpetrel View Post
. . .
Its also worth making a furling handle out of a bit of wood or alloy sized to slide between the clew lashing and the foil and at the right length so you can rotate the foil by hand if need be. Ideally it can be slid over slightly and be long enough to jamb in against the pulpit to lock the foil off. This is very useful if the line breaks, jambs or the bearings fail.

For a few weeks we set, and furled a 62 footers headsail with a stick like this due to the lower bearing failing. It worked pretty well.
Hot tip; thanks!
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Old 14-05-2016, 11:23   #26
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Re: Furling Lines

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
Hank-on jibs have much less friction than roller furling ones, and besides that -- wrestling the loose jib on the foredeck in a blow??

I've only had one broken furling line, in a bad blow, and what I did was different -- sheeted out, turned right downwind to reduce the strain, crawled to the foredeck with a line, bent it on to the broken stub with a sheet bend, and then crawled back to a winch and furled the sail.
True, hanks have very little friction, but when I let my halyard go, the jib comes down by itself. I just open the hatch of the sail locker and dump the jib in there.
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Old 14-05-2016, 11:44   #27
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Re: Furling Lines

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
Hank-on jibs have much less friction than roller furling ones, and besides that -- wrestling the loose jib on the foredeck in a blow??

I've only had one broken furling line, in a bad blow, and what I did was different -- sheeted out, turned right downwind to reduce the strain, crawled to the foredeck with a line, bent it on to the broken stub with a sheet bend, and then crawled back to a winch and furled the sail.
Two years ago when I had that horrible cascade of events with the drunkard onboard off Garrucha, I sailed into the harbor in 25 knots with a jammed staysail furling drum and no engine. Staysail alone.

It really wasn't difficult at all to bang a u turn, come up into the wind alongside the dock and lower the sail by hand..... by myself. The drunken knucklehead had jumped off the boat and onto the dock holding the stern line, basically doing the opposite of what I'd told him to do. I'd instructed the idiot to drop a loop from midship over a cleat. That was his only job... "drop the loop over the cleat when I tell you to." He couldn't handle that simple task.
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Old 14-05-2016, 12:59   #28
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Re: Furling Lines

all this sounds to me like massive over-analysis. Sta set works fine and if you think it is stretching just take another turn on the winch. But I bet that doesnt happen very often
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Old 14-05-2016, 15:02   #29
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Re: Furling Lines

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all this sounds to me like massive over-analysis. Sta set works fine and if you think it is stretching just take another turn on the winch. But I bet that doesnt happen very often
Exactly how does an additional turn on the winch obviate stretching in the furling line?

But, despite that quibble, I agree that the very small amount of stretch that I observe during the very few times we've used a reefed headsail is not a big worry to me. Being able to use a smaller diameter line is an advantage for those furlers with small drums, though. We have a marginal situation for getting enough turns on to allow full furling when it is wrapped tightly, and will likely go to some form of partially stripped spectra line next time.

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Old 14-05-2016, 16:31   #30
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Re: Furling Lines

Jim,

That was exactly my problem. Staset was fine generally but the drum wasn't large enough to hold enough wraps once we went from a 135 to a 155 jib. By switching to dyneema with a cover on the worked portion I was able to use far smaller line on the drum, and keep something large enough to get a handle on for the worked potion.
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