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Old 14-10-2015, 22:02   #31
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

GILow,

Think of the future, when you decide you want a mainsail with more roach, more area, better light air performance!

Anyhow, another "yes" for the traveler, we use ours a lot. Easing the traveler is one of the quickest ways to reduce heel angle, and lots less cranking than dumping the main sheet. As mentioned above, it retains the sail shape, just eases, makes life easier on ship and crew.

Ann
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Old 14-10-2015, 22:55   #32
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

I find that both the traveler and the vang are required, the traveler set to windward to allow the boom to be pulled towards the centre line when going to windward in light to medium airs and the vang to keep the main flattened and off the shrouds when going down wind.
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Old 15-10-2015, 00:11   #33
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

You can't pull the mainsheet to windward with a vang! Makes all the difference in the world in mainsail performance in light air.
Definitely look into Garhauer -- they will custom drill mounting holes to match your existing track for no extra charge!
On my 24-footer, their smallest size looks more suited for a 30-footer...
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Old 15-10-2015, 00:25   #34
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

All this underlines one of the weaknesses of the Swanson 42. I am reading this and thinking about how I have stopped playing with sail shape because it is so hard to tell the difference. Our acceleration is very very low, so any changes take ages to become apparent. On the last boat I was forever tweaking the sails, adjusting shape and trim because you knew straight away what the effect was.


Does anyone have suggestion on how to detect improvements or degradation from sail trim in a very heavy boat? Aside from sailing for a few hours and recording the distance covered?


Matt
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Old 15-10-2015, 01:06   #35
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Race her. Do a few twilight races, and maybe the odd weekend series. On the first beat you will learn a lot about boatspeed and pointing real quickly.

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Old 15-10-2015, 04:00   #36
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

A good idea, but not without some problems. First, and most important of which, is that our insurance does not cover us for racing.

Second is that I have taken part in a few club races as a crew member, and they are all freakin insane! Seriously, the last boat my wife crewed on was leaking water through the midships topside from being T-boned in the previous race, they were STILL racing. I pass one yacht on my way to the pen which is missing about two feet of the topside and deck where someone took a bite out of it with their bow, it has been this way for three months or more while, I assume, they argue about who is paying for the repairs. One guy I raced with, lovely bloke, told me how he had been phoned at home one evening after the races and told, in no uncertain terms, how the right of way rules applied.

I don't need that kind of ****.

Otherwise, like I said, a good idea.

Oh yeah, did I mention we have a turning circle of a B-double?


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Old 15-10-2015, 04:14   #37
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Ha, insurance is a real nuisance. Often they let you do three races a season or so, without an extra premium. Shame there is no cruising division.

We raced my parents gaff ketch, with a turning circle like a steam train for season. Start lines are fun, wait for all the hot shots to start, then follow, Hopefully there's a few slower boats with the same idea that you can duel it out against.

Done right you learn more than just sailtrim and helming, you learn some good teamwork, with the mark roundings.

Done wrong, you start yelling and screaming, stuff breaks, and nobody wants to sail with you ever again.

The right attitude is to approach it as a learning, teambuilding exercise, it not about beating the other boats, it's about getting the best out of your boat and crew, with the other boats making a fine measure of how well you are going. That's the part of racing I enjoy. And at the end if you can have a laugh with the other crews about that mess you made of the mark rounding or the start all the better.

But If it's just a lot of high tech racers it's probably not going to work. You really need a non spinnaker cruising division to start out with, otherwise you end up so far behind the rest that you struggle to complete the course in the time limit.

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Old 15-10-2015, 04:29   #38
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

The twilight series are the best of the bunch, that's for sure. And I am pretty sure the insurance would easy enough to fix if I wanted to too.

I raced the Austral once. It was across the gulf in a 35 mile straight line drag race. We crossed the start line a healthy ten minutes after everyone else. It just seemed safer that way. What followed was about eight hours of trying to keep the other boats from vanishing over the horizon. Quite educational.


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Old 15-10-2015, 04:57   #39
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Ha, when we first raced the "Maid" we were in div two, with a bunch of 30 foot racers dancing around the start line. When they yelled "starboard" or "up Up UPP" we just looked at them and yelled "20 tonnes" that confused them, or terrified them enough that they left us well enough alone, and soon disappeared over the horizon, unless some hapless boat got stuck in the windshadow of our 1500 square foot of sail.

Anyway they soon started to reappear behind us trying to lap us... At the end of the day we were far enough behind that the race commitee boat would ask us to pickup the marks on our way round the last lap, so they could get into the bar.

Picking up the marker bouys on the fly as we sailed past while gybing a 45 foot gaff ketch at 8 or 9 knots with a mizzen staysail, topsail, flying jib and watersails set was a fine game.

We won the series on handicap, by vastly improving each race.

But the real benefit was the way we learned to sail the boat as a team. I was 15, Our crew was my parents, me and my four younger brothers. We had no winches and lots of ropes. And we really got the old girl humming! Those teamwork skills really paid off when we started living aboard and cruising full time.
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Old 15-10-2015, 06:18   #40
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GILow View Post
Well, it's not often you get so close to a consensus on CF.

I'll take the "yes" vote as carried.

I thought I heard some collective "HOMMMMMMM" from the heavens...


I am a bit concerned about the 4:1 purchase suggestions. I was hoping to avoid that much rope lying around, but Roland's idea about making a temporary setup is clever so I will do that. I think the Swanson has a pretty conservative sail plan for a 42 footer, so hopefully 3:1 will be strong enough.

I thought Roland's idea was a SUPER one too...

Matt


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Quote:
Originally Posted by GILow View Post
I am certain that if I raced the boat I would not hesitate to fit the traveller control system. Hence my question was posed as a cruising boat.


But reading the responses here, I can see enough cruising folk who reckon it is warranted to think I will give it a go. I will check the local chandlery for a decent secondhand setup first.

Matt
+1 on this... I ran across one big enough for your boat in great shape for $50... Sill waiting for any other deal remotely close to this!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
GILow,

Think of the future, when you decide you want a mainsail with more roach, more area, better light air performance!

Anyhow, another "yes" for the traveler, we use ours a lot. Easing the traveler is one of the quickest ways to reduce heel angle, and lots less cranking than dumping the main sheet. As mentioned above, it retains the sail shape, just eases, makes life easier on ship and crew.

Ann
Exactly Ann !
1st immediate line of defense... One of the handiest multipurpose items in your inventory...
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Old 15-10-2015, 08:03   #41
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
I thought I heard some collective "HOMMMMMMM" from the heavens...
More like a collective "Gaaarrrrhauerrrrr....". But close enough.
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Old 15-10-2015, 08:09   #42
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GILow View Post
More like a collective "Gaaarrrrhauerrrrr....". But close enough.
Damn Tinnitus...

Wouldn't be the first time I misheard something...

However this time it wasn't on purpose...
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Old 15-10-2015, 09:09   #43
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Personally can't imagine sailing without a vang AND a traveller.
I usually sail solo, I use the traveller as much as the mainsheet.
Came from a racing background but don't race anymore, once you properly learn how to use all the controls at your disposal you will really miss them.
In my books a vang is nowhere near a replacement for a traveller.
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Old 15-10-2015, 10:33   #44
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Garhauer Marine Hardware -12458714 go and get one.

I replaced both my rigid vang and my traveler. Sooo nice to have new working equipment.
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Old 15-10-2015, 11:36   #45
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Re: Fit a mainsheet traveller system or leave well alone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GILow View Post
All this underlines one of the weaknesses of the Swanson 42. I am reading this and thinking about how I have stopped playing with sail shape because it is so hard to tell the difference. Our acceleration is very very low, so any changes take ages to become apparent. On the last boat I was forever tweaking the sails, adjusting shape and trim because you knew straight away what the effect was.


Does anyone have suggestion on how to detect improvements or degradation from sail trim in a very heavy boat? Aside from sailing for a few hours and recording the distance covered?


Matt
Don't beat yourself up over it. The gains to be made are way too low relative to the effort required. Just cleat your gear off in an average position and relax. Where it is windy enough to make the boat round up in a gust then you should over ease the sheet and/or traveler a little. Having part of the main inside out will not slow the boat provided the jib is working.
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