Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 20-06-2008, 08:01   #1
Vendor
 
witzgall's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Eastern Shore, MD
Boat: Camper Nicholson 44 Ketch
Posts: 1,775
Bought industrial sewing machine!?!?

I got a super deal on an old industrial sewing machine. It has a 1/2 hp belt-driven motor, oil bath, and was heavy as hell. The motor is mouted below, and it has a walking foot. Feeds great. Got it setup last night, and it sews like it is posessed by the devil.

I have barely any experience sewing. I need to re-stitch our dodger, make a tiller cover, etc. The possibilities are endless!!!

So I need some advice on this sort of stuff. What sort of needles, thread, should I be using? It came with several cones of Nylon thread, but it seems like it is medium weight, not heavty weight. Not sure how to tell.

Any good books out there on sewing for a sailboat?

The machine is a Cut-Line C-210. Internet searches came up with Nada!


Chris
__________________

__________________
witzgall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-06-2008, 08:07   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,140
Go to Sailrite. They'll have everything you need. Marine Fabrics, Sailcloth, Sail Kits, Canvas and Sail Hardware for Do-It-Yourself
__________________

__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-06-2008, 09:13   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Middletown, NJ.
Boat: Bruce Roberts Offshore '38 - "God Willing"
Posts: 41
Images: 23
Hi there. Congrats on purchasing a commercial machine. You also could have done sewing on something like a Singer Model Number 247. It has no belt, but a steel timing mechanism. They can sew 5-10 layers of canvas no problem. For home use, in an industrial application, such as making boat covers, they're fine. Your local craigslist always, if you look close, has older sewing machines which have all steel timing mechanisms.

Google books is the best. Here's a good book.

The Complete Canvasworker's Guide
The Complete Canvasworker's Guide ... - Google Book Search
__________________
usa-068 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-06-2008, 09:22   #4
Moderator Emeritus
 
Pblais's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hayes, VA
Boat: Gozzard 36
Posts: 8,700
Images: 15
Send a message via Skype™ to Pblais
Quote:
I have barely any experience sewing.
The way the woman that did our works does it with new people is to get some cotton duck material and start making tote bags. Make them in all sizes. Practice sewing straight and computing seam allowances. Try to make them to exact sizes. They are something quite useful to have and maybe you could even sell a few. If you get that far try adding zippers to the tops. Then use the bags and see how they hold up.

Working on real projects always teaches you details you need to understand. Sewing is actually very easy but making sail boat products is quite hard. Dodgers are perhaps the hardest component to make well. My canvas lady told me when she opened the shop she could make a dodger with 24 hours of labor. She now requires 40 hours. Learning to do things right has it's extra efforts. It also points out that how you design things matters as much as the tools you use.

As Rick notes the Sailrite web site has a lot of things in one place where you can get ideas. They have some simple videos and boos as well. All this however is really very basic.
__________________
Paul Blais
s/v Bright Eyes Gozzard 36
37 15.7 N 76 28.9 W
Pblais is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-06-2008, 11:22   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver Island
Boat: US 25, Aquappella
Posts: 11
"The Sailmaker's Apprentice" by Emiliano Marino is a very good book. I believe every sailor should read it. It covers sewing, both machine and hand, and covers sewing machines and what thread/needle for what thickness cloth etc. It also begins with the making of a ditty bag.
There is a lot of good practical theory on sails and sail trim/modification.
It is available from Amazon or Chapters/Indigo, and I would bet any book seller could get it for you.
I am assuming that you already know that Sailrite is the go-to supplier of the supplies you need.

Tim J
__________________
Feetup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-06-2008, 20:54   #6
Registered User

Join Date: May 2008
Location: SW Florida
Boat: Bristol (Alden) 35 Sloop "Zephyr"
Posts: 498
Images: 2
Congrats on the machine. A true industrial walking foot machine, with larger underarm space than a home machine is great. Once you use the walking foot machine, you will love it.
with the machine feeding the top and bottom material, you don't need to pin a seam, so the top feeds thae same as the bottom material.
Look closly at a needle that came with the machine, and see if you can read the numbers on the shank, then contack an industrial sewing supply and get some needles. for V-92 thread, you would most likly use a #21 needle.
A few tips:
Buy a long reach stapler from Office Depot or other store. Use it to staple seams together. MUCH easier than pins. Also get a staple remover. The kind that looks like a short knife blade, not the claw type. when you remove the staples from Sunbrella, the holes don't show.

Double sided seam tape can be helpfull

Get a long (5') aluminum straight edge, ruler. and a few shorter ones

I use soapstone for marking from a welder supply store

Get a 1/2" batten, or make one, as a guide for adding seam allowances

Use UV protected Dacron thread, or better yet Tenara (expensive, but lasts forever)

Try a few canvas shops and ask if they have any partial cones of thread they would sell. Or roll ends of Sunbrella

Push pins work for pinning material down for tracing a pattern. I use commercial ones from a canvas supplier. they are larger.

Check Ebay for Sunbrella. i bought some 3 and 4 yard pieces for $5/ yard

And most of all, keep fingers out from under the needle!
__________________
over40pirate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-06-2008, 07:58   #7
Vendor
 
witzgall's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Eastern Shore, MD
Boat: Camper Nicholson 44 Ketch
Posts: 1,775
Working with heavy thread

Thanks all! Good info.

I bought some heavy polyester thread this weekend, and attempted to get the machine to work with this. What a mess. It would constantly pop out the bobbin, or make a bird's nest down there, as soon as I would try and advance the machine other than by hand. The last I tried, I could get maybe twenty stiches before this would happen.

I don't have a manual, it is a cut-line C-210. I did search online, and found some similar machines, and I do now have a theory. The bobbin is placed into a cassettte and that is snapped into the machine. From reading online, the cassette has a screw that you use to adjust bobbin tension. It is not on the machine, like home machines.

I have several bobbins, and cassettes. I tried several of them, to the same result. Is it possible that the tension on these are too tight, and that it causeing the issue?

Chris
__________________
witzgall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-06-2008, 08:59   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 34
I have an old Singer Industrial, 2hp motor hangs out of the bottom mounted on butcher block table, will sew through your arm at 7kts. It took me several months to learn the correct thread tension, will very with what your sewing, also machines will get out of time. Bobbin tension is also inportant. A machine slightly out of time will drive you crazy. Once I retimed mine all my problems went away. Since mine's a Singer there was lots of info on internet
I started out sewing flat awnings/tarps, I use basting tape to hold seams aligned, helps alot. You can buy at any fabric store(Hancocks). I repaired a friends sail last weekend, 30 minute job. I have not attempted a dodger, that will be my next project, still planning.
Good Luck, be patience.
phillip
S/V Silver Heels
__________________
silver heels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-06-2008, 09:10   #9
Provocateur & Raconteur
 
knottybuoyz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Iroquois, Ontario
Boat: Bateau.com TW31 Modified
Posts: 3,583
Images: 87
We've also started down the road to sewing happiness too! Picked up a Singer 500A industrial last year and have only now gotten around to using it. Just to state upfront I have absolutely no experience with sewing. Knottygirlz is the seamstress and makes all her own clothes, draperies etc. This Singer is her third machine.

We got this machine to learn to do all our own canvas/upholstery work. It certainly is a capable machine but isn't a walking foot type. So far we've only produced one zip-in plastic window. The second is underway.
It's hard work ripping out all those stitches!!!

We've been using a sunbrella binding tape to help finish the edges of the windows before sewing on the zippers. It's a bugger to fold and sew while feeding in the plastic window. A third hand is definitely an asset. We found an attachment that'll probably work that feeds & folds the binding tape. That'll be a gawdsend. One other attachment we got that seems to work well is a teflon foot that lets the material slide easier.

I've produced a few of those birds nests of thread under the baseblate. As mentioned I think it's due to improper thread tension. Knottygirlz is working on that!



As you learn the "stitch ripper" will be your best friend, right honey?

There is a great amount of satisfaction being able to do this kind of stuff yourself but the learning curve is steep. I have a newfound respect for those that can do it and do it well. It's hard work.
__________________
Yours Aye! Rick
~^~^~^^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~~^~^~~^~^~^^~~^~^
"It's not the boat "you built" until you've sworn at it, bled on it, sweated over it, cried beside it and then threatened to haul the POS outside and burn it!"
knottybuoyz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-06-2008, 21:11   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: seattle
Boat: Devlin 48 Moon River,j/100 BJ
Posts: 586
Each machine is a little different but there are some underlying similarities.- would suggest you get somebody with some experience to help you until you can iron out problems- unless you are very mechanically gifted timing and troubleshooting without a manual can be difficult and even destructive. Try to find manual and troubleshooting guide see if company is still in business.
__________________
eyschulman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2008, 19:23   #11
Registered User

Join Date: May 2008
Location: SW Florida
Boat: Bristol (Alden) 35 Sloop "Zephyr"
Posts: 498
Images: 2
I wouldn't be surprised if your machine is a knock off of a singer design. If you could post some pictures of it here, and on any Sewing site you can find, such as, Upholstery Discussion Board

You might find some who recoginizes it, and can lead you to a manual for it.

I sounds like the machine might be out of time. be sure the needle in inserted all the way. Turn the machine over by hand with the bobin cover plate off. As the needle approaches the bottom of it's stroke, watch for the "hook" which comes around and grabs the thread.
Basiclly it should pass the needle,above the needle hole, in order to catch the thread. It should be close to the needle but not touching it.

Different machines have different timing adjustments. If you don't know what you are doing, you can really screw things up!.

On the old Singer 211 machine I have, has a safety clutch that will slip and put the machne out of time, if the needle hits something. On this machine, you just push a button and turn the machine over, and it clicks back in time.

Trying to get a sewing machine to work right can be a nightmare. When a good machine is set up right it can be trouble free for a long time.

You might look at the "hook" and see if the tip is in good shape. It should be fairly sharp and smooth.
They can get damaged from hitting the needle. I was lucky, when I bought my Singer. It had a new hook installed.

Good luck.
__________________
over40pirate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-06-2008, 22:15   #12
Senior Cruiser
 
senormechanico's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2003
Boat: Dragonfly 1000 trimaran
Posts: 5,832
Interesting thread as I'm a Certified Bernina sewing machine technician.
Most of my sewing is on my sails, and I've hotrodded an old Pfaff 1171 mechanical machine to my liking.

Regarding your birds nests in the bobbin, there are several things which could cause this.

I'm not familiar with your particular machine (at least by your description of it) and a photo or two would help me to diagnose your problem. if you can, post a photo of the bobbin area with the bobbin case removed as well as an overall photo of the machine.

If the machine sews a decent stitch when you turn it over slowly by hand, but not when you sew fast, it may be a sticking check spring.
Put the bobbin in the bobbin case with the thread spool turning the opposite way that the thread exits under the bobbin spring.
A general rule of thumb whenever you encounter a problem, rethread the machine, both top and bottom thread. Are you absolutely sure you are doing it correctly?

Does this machine sew a zig zag stitch? If so, try sewing as wide a zig zag as possible by slowly turning the hand wheel. Post a close up picture of top and bottom of that stitch. Also try it with the motor at high speed. Let me know what that does. Photos are always helpful.

If you have any burrs on the hook or surrounding area, this will grab the upper thread and cause breakage and/or shredding of the thread, but that doesn't sound like your problem.

Steve B. (known around here in sewing circles as "The Famous Steve")
__________________
senormechanico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2008, 09:30   #13
Vendor
 
witzgall's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Eastern Shore, MD
Boat: Camper Nicholson 44 Ketch
Posts: 1,775
All;

I got the machine working. The number one problem was that it came with a bunch of bobbins that did not work with this machine. I was using one of these, as they looked a shiny an new. The old ones work fine. THe other issue was tension, which I worked out.

Lat night I tried sewing new windows on our old dodger. The material of the dodger is one step from dry rot, and quite thin, but I am hoping to get one season out of it before either attempting to sew a new one, or getting somebody else to make one up.

THe trouble I am having is that the window vinyl and the cloth are feeding at two different rates, so the cloth is bunching up terribly. I have tried changing the pressure foot pressure all over the place, no real cure. The Vinyl is on the top, so I can see what I am stiching

I did try sewing a piece of new cloth and new vinyl, and could only get it to work if I swed the cloth on top, vinyl on the bottom. I cannot see where to stitch this way.

Is there a good way to accurately glue or tape the twp together, so I can sew it upside down?

Chris
__________________
witzgall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2008, 09:55   #14
Provocateur & Raconteur
 
knottybuoyz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Iroquois, Ontario
Boat: Bateau.com TW31 Modified
Posts: 3,583
Images: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by witzgall View Post
All;THe trouble I am having is that the window vinyl and the cloth are feeding at two different rates, so the cloth is bunching up terribly.
With our Singer 500A, a non-walking foot type, the teflon foot eased that problem a lot. It allows stickier stuff, like the window plastic, to follow the material with the same pressure.

Google Search Teflon Foot

Quote:
Originally Posted by witzgall View Post
Is there a good way to accurately glue or tape the twp together, so I can sew it upside down?
Two sided binding tape.
__________________
Yours Aye! Rick
~^~^~^^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~~^~^~~^~^~^^~~^~^
"It's not the boat "you built" until you've sworn at it, bled on it, sweated over it, cried beside it and then threatened to haul the POS outside and burn it!"
knottybuoyz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-06-2008, 13:17   #15
Vendor
 
witzgall's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Eastern Shore, MD
Boat: Camper Nicholson 44 Ketch
Posts: 1,775
And ours does not have a walking foot. I reported that incorrectly. There are some feet on ebay that look to work with ours. I might give it a try.

Binding tape first though, as I think that the trouble is more the "slipperiness" between the two fabrics.


Chris


Chris
__________________

__________________
witzgall is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
sewing machine

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sewing Machine Ripoff Azura Product or Service Reviews & Evaluations 24 09-04-2008 21:37
Wanted: Sewing Machine AnchorageGuy Classifieds Archive 3 12-07-2007 17:30
Portable Industrial Sewing Machine Gallivanters Classifieds Archive 2 17-06-2007 00:29



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:53.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.