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26-05-2019, 12:42
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#1
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Writing Full-Time Since 2014
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Deale, MD
Boat: PDQ Altair, 32/34
Posts: 9,559
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Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Better or worse, and why? They reduce construction stretch, but other than that, I'm not seeing it. It seems like there are areas I cannot inspect, for little up-side.
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26-05-2019, 12:50
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Nice, France
Boat: Hunter Marine 38
Posts: 1,342
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
inspect for what? rust?
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26-05-2019, 16:20
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#3
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Writing Full-Time Since 2014
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Deale, MD
Boat: PDQ Altair, 32/34
Posts: 9,559
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailormed
inspect for what? rust?
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Ha ha. So, what is the up-side? I'm fully serious.
Now that I look farther, I can see that they combine other fittings (T rope eye) in some cases. But unless I misunderstand, it is still a splice, just a slick way of capturing it and transferring the force.
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26-05-2019, 16:55
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Oregon
Boat: Seafarer36c
Posts: 5,563
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
They're for the unbelievers. A little chunk of cheap steel must be better than something that looks so soft. They just don't know how strong it can become.
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26-05-2019, 17:24
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Left coast.
Posts: 1,451
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Upside may be for connecting standing rigging to a turnbuckle, particularly if it is easily adjustable after the dyneema creeps.
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26-05-2019, 20:49
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Indonesia
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 3,794
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Very cool terminators. You splice your UHMWPE around a bone, which has a diameter for example of 18mm for 10mm line. Any thoughts of throat tearing with that size of an eye and a throat that’s tight against the bone?
Unfortunately for our boat we will need 16 or 18mm fibre shrouds, and the threaded fitting is only up to 10mm. Sigh.
Cool fittings for lifelines, especially the hole liners and terminators for gates. Might be pricey, but will look very good without tons of thimbles and lashings.
Can one buy directly for them?
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27-05-2019, 12:11
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Atlanta, GA
Boat: Catalina 30
Posts: 651
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
It looks like a STA-LOK for Dyneema. Bend seems a bit tight. As I understand it Dyneema does not like to be bent into a tight curve like that. (BTW, the dyneema is still spliced around the bone.)
I think these look interesting: Standard Terminator® Fittings from Colligo Marine® They can be pinned or used as Dead-Eyes.
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27-05-2019, 13:11
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,007
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Thinwater,
I think the reason for these fittings is that anybody can do fit a terminal to a dyneema line and turn it into a shroud of the right length.
While splicing dyneema is a really a piece of cake when you want a loop in the end of a halyard, but splicing to an exact length without significant construction stretch afterwards is just not possible to do without specialized skills, equipment and tools.
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27-05-2019, 13:37
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Indonesia
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 3,794
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Quote:
Originally Posted by billknny
Thinwater,
I think the reason for these fittings is that anybody can do fit a terminal to a dyneema line and turn it into a shroud of the right length.
While splicing dyneema is a really a piece of cake when you want a loop in the end of a halyard, but splicing to an exact length without significant construction stretch afterwards is just not possible to do without specialized skills, equipment and tools.
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RE: splicing to an exact length. Do one splice, measure the length, set with load, measure the result. This will give you the delta between initial length and length after removing construction set. All the construction set is in the splice and bury, so your testing can be on short lengths as long as your eye sizes are correct. There are a number of YouTube videos of people loading their shrouds using trucks or winches. No specialised equipment/tools needed.
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27-05-2019, 13:49
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,007
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty
RE: splicing to an exact length. Do one splice, measure the length, set with load, measure the result. This will give you the delta between initial length and length after removing construction set. All the construction set is in the splice and bury, so your testing can be on short lengths as long as your eye sizes are correct. There are a number of YouTube videos of people loading their shrouds using trucks or winches. No specialised equipment/tools needed.
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If it's on Youtube it must be right...
At the very least, you need a tension gauge so you know how much tension you have put on it. Doing with a truck is not a good idea.
Remember we are talking loading these things to 20 to 25% of breaking strength at a minimum to stretch them out. If you have 1/2" dyneema, that's a load on the order of 10,000lb to set the splice properly. Maybe if you hang your truck from it...
Yes, you can do it the way you describe, but it won't be right. You'll bottom out your turnbuckles in a year of hard sailing.
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27-05-2019, 14:08
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Indonesia
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 3,794
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Quote:
Originally Posted by billknny
If it's on Youtube it must be right...
At the very least, you need a tension gauge so you know how much tension you have put on it. Doing with a truck is not a good idea.
Remember we are talking loading these things to 20 to 25% of breaking strength at a minimum to stretch them out. If you have 1/2" dyneema, that's a load on the order of 10,000lb to set the splice properly. Maybe if you hang your truck from it...
Yes, you can do it the way you describe, but it won't be right. You'll bottom out your turnbuckles in a year of hard sailing.
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Good points, will be interesting to see the results on these channels after a year or so. For those using lashings there’s a bit more room for error, but not so much for turnbuckles.
I suppose you could hire a test rig in a machine shop or maybe a rigger to do the loading for you. Once to test the elongation, and then again for every splice.
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27-05-2019, 14:08
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#12
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Writing Full-Time Since 2014
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Deale, MD
Boat: PDQ Altair, 32/34
Posts: 9,559
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Quote:
Originally Posted by billknny
Thinwater,
I think the reason for these fittings is that anybody can do fit a terminal to a dyneema line and turn it into a shroud of the right length.
While splicing dyneema is a really a piece of cake when you want a loop in the end of a halyard, but splicing to an exact length without significant construction stretch afterwards is just not possible to do without specialized skills, equipment and tools.
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If you look closely, you will see that you still have to do a full splice. No difference. The only difference is in how the force is transferred to the rigging pin.
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27-05-2019, 14:09
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#13
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 21,135
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Quote:
Yes, you can do it the way you describe, but it won't be right. You'll bottom out your turnbuckles in a year of hard sailing.
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Possibly so, but then you can undo the splice and shorten it up a bit.
Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II, lying Port Cygnet Tasmania once again.
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27-05-2019, 14:26
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,398
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
I guess the idea is that it's very straightforward to replace SS with fibre, with identical terminal hardware.
__________________
"You CANNOT be serious!"
John McEnroe
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27-05-2019, 14:38
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Indonesia
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 3,794
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Re: Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice
Since the expansion with temperature is opposite for UHMWPE vs aluminium how do cruisers with synthetic rigging handle movements between warmer and colder conditions?
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