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Old 12-08-2008, 07:43   #1
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Any Updates on Synthetic Rigging ?

Anyone actually cruising with synthetic standing rigging yet? The more I look at this Dynex Dux 75 the more things I like. I priced out all the material and fittings for discontinuous 316 stainless 1x19 and Dynex using the design loads. Even ordering enough for a spare upper shroud and covering all the Dynex in high quality PVC heat shrink tube for UV and chafe protection the Dynex comes out about 10% less expensive and the weight savings are a little over 100 lb. Most of the cost savings comes from eliminating all the turnbuckles and compression fittings. Even better I can fabricate it all myself.

Creep does not seem to be an issue with Dynex Dux as long as the static loads are under 20% of breaking strength and I sized 5:1 for dynamic loads so static loads should be well under 20%. Lots of other advantages too. For example it would take 5 different sizes of wire but only 2 of Dynex. Total windage area using 9 and 11mm Dynex is about the same as 1x19 and the PVC cover will eliminate most of the turbulence the weave might have caused.

The one problem I have to solve is that my chainplates are to close together to fit deadeyes. I may have to stay with turnbuckles at the deck and just resign myself to resplicing the lower thimbles in a couple of years after the shrouds have taken a set.

Right now the only risk I see might be a crazy machete wielding Haitian.
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Old 18-08-2008, 17:27   #2
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I haven't got an update but I thought I would just say thanks for your post. I'm watching developments with synthetics too. I guess you could say I tend to be an "early adopter" of new technology and couple this with an opportunity to reduce weight aloft and it's a pretty good motivator for me as my boat is a little on the tender side anyway.

I don't think I'll head to Haiti now, just in case....!
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Old 18-08-2008, 18:45   #3
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MikeNZ It looks the way to go. like yourself I'm all in favour of new technology,Dynex dux etc but how do you get over any stetch without turnbuckles. Surely it would need tensioning occasionly? Would love some pics of how its done.
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Old 18-08-2008, 18:49   #4
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Check out the latest Ocean Navigator. Nigel Calder does a piece on synthetic rigging.

Ocean Navigator

The website does not list it, but the latest print version, Sept 2008, has the article.
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Old 18-08-2008, 19:19   #5
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Nigel's article covers PBO and carbon, both way out of my budget. Dynex DUX is a 12 strand single braid Dynema that is preset under heat to pull out all the construction creep so you only have to allow for creep in the splices. On a breaking strength basis the price per foot is a little less than 1x19. Allowing for the higher safety factor the cordage cost is about the same but the end treatment is far less than Norseman, Stayloc or Hayne fittings.

Precort and Colligo are selling alumuinum deadeyes for Dynex. Deadeyes give you a lot more range to take up any creep but I am hearing reports that compatable size turnbuckles have plenty of adjustment range because the creep is so low.
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Old 01-09-2008, 05:00   #6
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synthetic rigging

Hello To You All,
Following up on posts regarding dynex dux as a rigging alternative

firstly i must state that my business is fittings and furlers and in particular rope including dynex and dux, i am happy to update all on progress within this field but apologies to all if this may also seem somewhat commercially driven, hopefully any information i can provide may be of real use generally as it has all been very extensivly tested .

Its great to see an interest in these high strength UHMPE derivatives, (ultra high molecular polyethelene).
Dynex dux is definitly suited to standing rigging, it is very strong, reliable, light and well proven. As opposed to some of the other fibres it is what can be considered "workman like", its properties are well known and it is proven in some very tough environments, probably far tougher than we as yachtsmen will ever subject it to.
The first generation of high strength spectra/dyneema was regarded as being "stretchy", this perception has lingered possibly longer than it should have, with the Dux version we can produce standing rigging that has tested to equal the stretch parameters of 1x 19 stainless dyform but at 85% less weight and usually 30% plus more strength but at a similar price.
To achieve this we have developed some techniques ,it takes care and time and a little skill, but we can succesfully terminate this to standard rigging screws, and expect the same kind of adjustment as high quality wire.

My own yacht a 1936 42ft S&S sloop 1936, was fully rigged in dux using this method a year ago, she is moored on a very exposed mooring, and is sailed a couple of times a week all year round. To date i have added one full turn to the lowers, one half turn to the shrouds and nothing to the backstay in the 12 months since the mast was re stepped.
We have also rigged a number of widely different other yachts, with no problems.

What is being produced may be beyond what is possible DIY, but does not rule this out, the rope is very user friendly.

To date we have had no difficulties with insurers, and our industry experience ( suppling deep sea fishing, energy exploration) suggest the rope will last at least as long as steel, we produce a covered finished product and UV is not an issue
Our rigs can, coupled to turnbuckles, appear to a casual glace to be more "steel like" than rope.
As to malicious damage, there are unfortunatly always idiots about, but wire cutters, angle grinders and other implements are freely available at your nearest bulk store, to date i have heard of no sudden upsurge in the cutting of wire rigs because the possibility exists.

Hope this is of some help,
regards
mike strong
strongRope
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:44   #7
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Mike S

Thank you for your professional opinion/info on synthetic rigging!

I'm sure this has been a question on many minds (including my own) with the new technologies that keep coming into the industries .

The question I have is, how to adjust the shrouds? e.g. Do you use a type of loos gauge? And, you must have come up with some spec's for adjustment?
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:17   #8
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Thanks Mike. The insurance issue was one thing I was worried about. The insurance company's surveyor will be by next month to check my progress and figure out what my premium will be for the next six months. I will broach the subject with him but he does not like deviations from the original plans.
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Old 27-09-2008, 18:51   #9
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Update

dynex dux - SparTalk

This forum has a number of good threads on Dux. I know the Brion Toss is going to or already has rigged his own personal cutter with Dux and Colligo deadeyes. This link will show you a nice series of shrouds with turnbuckles.....:-)

I have rigged half my Searunner already with Dux and will finish up this Oct. I love the stuff. I use it in Ak. as a commercial fisherman and the stuff is amazing. Strength, light weight. Much safer....:-)
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Old 27-09-2008, 19:57   #10
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I breached the subject on a boat design forum and got my ears firmly boxed but as a congenital engineer I have not given up. The problem is lack of definitive engineering numbers on stretch and creep. John at Colligo has sent me a sample of 9mm Dux which I am about to put on my cobbled together test bench and test for stretch and creep under load. The complete test for creep will probably take a few months but I will report my results.
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Old 27-09-2008, 23:27   #11
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Good for you! I love the stuff as you can probably tell. I will continue to run my live test in the sun on the water on the boat and report back also. I have already used the stuff enough to know what a huge leap it is. It will take a while for people to get their head around the idea of a 3/8's piece of string can pick up a suburban truck. You can splice it, and it does not take a sponser to buy it for you.
In AK. we have a 50 ton winch we use out at sea and have twice cracked the drum with dux on shock loads. The dux is still there. The manufacture of the winch told us it is designed for wire which will either smash flat and spread the load.........or break......but not Dux it does neither. or break.
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Old 28-09-2008, 05:37   #12
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Mike,

Are you keeping the forestay wire or can Dynema handle that as well? Thanks for sharing your experience with the product.
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Old 28-09-2008, 07:43   #13
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It doesn't have to be malicious intent to cause damage. What about accidents with any sort of sharp object, or just plain chafe? I have no problems with the strength of the synthetics, I worry about having to replace it much more often than steel due to nicks, cuts, and abrasion that wouldn't have had any effect on steel.

John
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Old 28-09-2008, 11:10   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abaco View Post
Mike,

Are you keeping the forestay wire or can Dynema handle that as well? Thanks for sharing your experience with the product.
I am using 9mm forestay and intend to start out with conventional hanks and I will monitor the chaff. I see they have a good looking solution over at Precourt for synthetic hanks. I may go to those if I see any chaffing that need taken care of.
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Old 28-09-2008, 15:56   #15
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Synthetic Lifelines

I have not used synthetics for rigging, but last winter I replaced all my lifelines with synthetic. Previously, I had the typical vinyl coated stainless wire on our cat and one of the lifelines failed due to corrosion under the vinyl. It failed while the boat was at the dock and the corrosion cut all the wire strands except for 2. I used a Technora/Dyneema double braid line with a polyester cover (6mm dia) for the new lifelines and made all the eye splices myself. I was able to use some of the existing hardware so the cost was considerably cheaper than using wire.

After 9 months, I'm still happy with the result. There hasn't been any measurable stretch and I haven't had to tighten the turnbuckles. The lines are lighter and softer than the wire and would be less painfull if I ever get thrown against them. The breaking strength is 4,400lbs which is higher than the breaking strength of the wire I removed. I also like this alternative because I can see any wear spots. IMHO the vinyl covered wire used by most manufacturers can have hidden corrosion and can fail without much warning.
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