World Wide Pump Out?

[Delancey]

Just curious as to what nations beside the US require boats to have holding tanks? There must be others, we can't be the only ones to legislate poop.

Europe? Australia? New Zealand? The rest of the world probably not would be my guess.

[Sailmonkey]

I'm almost positive Mexico, Belize, and Guatemala require holding tanks......I've personally not seen a pump out on the east coast of Mexico, I've seen one in Belize, and one in Guatemala.

[Pete7]

UK not required unless you are on a lake, river or canal.

Pete

[Delancey]

I guess the better question is what countries have no discharge zones?

And of those countries, which ones actually have enforcement? Since a requirement to have a holding tank is pretty silly if there is no infrastructure for pump outs.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

I'm almost positive Mexico, Belize, and Guatemala require holding tanks......I've personally not seen a pump out on the east coast of Mexico, I've seen one in Belize, and one in Guatemala.

Where did you see pump outs in Belize & Guatemala?

RAM on the Rio Dulce has talked of installing one, but dont know if they ever did.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Delancey

I guess the better question is what countries have no discharge zones?

And of those countries, which ones actually have enforcement? Since a requirement to have a holding tank is pretty silly if there is no infrastructure for pump outs.

Do you mean zero discharge? Only some waters in the USA that I know of.

For human waste I think the 3 & 12 mile limits are incorporated into the MARPOL treaty...but realistically only developed countries have enforcement resources.

Re enforcement resources for this sort of thing...zero in any Central American country. Many coastal sewage systems here discharge directly into the sea anyway...making boats a pretty insignificant contributor. These shore side discharges range from over the water outhouse, to disfunctional septic systems (water table too high), to full on municipal waste discharge.

[model 10]

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

I'm almost positive Mexico, Belize, and Guatemala require holding tanks......I've personally not seen a pump out on the east coast of Mexico, I've seen one in Belize, and one in Guatemala.

How did you come up with that? There is a broken down pump out at Isla Mujeres,MX. It's been that way since at least 2010. In 3 years of cruising Belize I never saw a pump out. The one pump in Guatemaka, at the fuel dock in Rio Dulce, is never used.

[lonesoldier0408]

I think it would be a good idea. It gives those who dwell, something else to dwell on or stress over and stress kills.
It started in the earth and to the earth it shall return.
You're not going to stop all the excrement, from finding it's way into the waters of the world.
Some poor guy, pushing it out of sight, to dump it, will not stop the rain from bringing it back.
It's a mind game, that you will not win.

[peghall]

In the US, all INTRAstate inland lakes are NDZs (see this list on the EPA site here EPA NDZ list The discharge of treated waste from a USCG Certified Type I or II MSD is legal on most navigable inland rivers and most coastal waters. US "no discharge" laws only apply to "sewage" which is defined as "human body wastes and the waste from toilets and other receptacles intended to receive or retain body waste." Gray water ("galley, bath and shower water") may legally be discharge directly overboard in all US waters except for a very few inland lakes and in some small areas of the FL Keys Nat'l Marine Sanctuary that are clearly marked on charts.

You'll find all the US marine sanitation regs that apply to recreational vessels in two parts of the CFR (Code of Federal Regulations): 33 CFR 159 33 CFR Part 159, Subpart A and 40 CFR 140 PART 140--MARINE SANITATION DEVICE STANDARD. It's the CFR that establishes the "3 mile limit." MARPOL regulates large commercial vessels.

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by peghall

In the US, all INTRAstate inland lakes are NDZs (see this list on the EPA site here EPA NDZ list The discharge of treated waste from a USCG Certified Type I or II MSD is legal on most navigable inland rivers and most coastal waters. US "no discharge" laws only apply to "sewage" which is defined as "human body wastes and the waste from toilets and other receptacles intended to receive or retain body waste." Gray water ("galley, bath and shower water") may legally be discharge directly overboard in all US waters except for a very few inland lakes and in some small areas of the FL Keys Nat'l Marine Sanctuary that are clearly marked on charts.

You'll find all the US marine sanitation regs that apply to recreational vessels in two parts of the CFR (Code of Federal Regulations): 33 CFR 159 33 CFR Part 159, Subpart A and 40 CFR 140 PART 140--MARINE SANITATION DEVICE STANDARD. It's the CFR that establishes the "3 mile limit." MARPOL regulates large commercial vessels.

Hi Peg, it would seem to me that the NDZs are potentially counter productive in that they prohibit discharge of waste treated by devices such as the Lectrasan.

Is it really better to pump out waste into a municipal system that will likely discharge the same untreated waste directly into the water whenever there is an overflow rather than to allow for technology that does a "pretty good" job of treating it?

[peghall]

That can of worms is hotly debated everywhere it comes up. I'm on your side, but it's impossible to convince some people that there should be any alternative to holding tanks and I don't have the time or energy to argue with 'em right now, so I'm not gonna go there this time.

[peghall]

To get back to the original question...Turkey is the only nation I know of that rigidly enforces their NDZ regs...they do it from the air, looking for cloudy water around a vessel that indicates a dumped tank, and the fines if you get caught are huge. Never mind that there isn't a single pumpout anywhere in Turkey...making necessary to up anchor and leave Turkey's territorial waters the only way to empty a tank.

[Delancey]

An interesting article -

NDZs are not the answer | Loose Cannon

[Kenomac]

Turkey and the USA are the only nations which feel the need to legislate poop.

I spent an hour yesterday under our boat in our Italian marina (no pumpout), no issues no sickness today, no need to worry.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by Guy

How did you come up with that? There is a broken down pump out at Isla Mujeres,MX. It's been that way since at least 2010. In 3 years of cruising Belize I never saw a pump out. The one pump in Guatemaka, at the fuel dock in Rio Dulce, is never used.

The Belize pump out I saw was a cart @ cucumber beach. I missed the one in Mexico.

As far as the no discharge....it's written in the laws (I think...I seem to remember this because I found it funny), but is unenforceable.