The Head Smells Bad

[peghall]

You certainly do like to overcomplicate the simple!

It's not flushing with salt water that creates odors...it's allowing salt water to sit and stagnate in the system that does. Rinse the salt water out of the system before the boat sits...problem solved.

[Wand]

Originally Posted by peghall

You certainly do like to overcomplicate the simple!

It's not flushing with salt water that creates odors...it's allowing salt water to sit and stagnate in the system that does. Rinse the salt water out of the system before the boat sits...problem solved.

peghall is spot on; it's as simple as flushing with fresh water before departing. Lotsa folks have gone to lotsa expense in all sorts of ways, including ditching and installing a compost system. But before you follow, simply try peghall's advice. It's cheap, easy and it really works.

[peghall]

Somebody who knows how to search this site please point him toward any of the recent threads in which we've discussed teeing the head intake line into the head sink drain line?

[Wand]

Originally Posted by peghall

Somebody who knows how to search this site please point him toward any of the recent threads in which we've discussed teeing the head intake line into the head sink drain line?

Can't find the thread but I do it so it's simple enough; wash your hands with fresh soapy water in the plugged sink, then pump out via the tee through thru the dunny. Finito. No wasted water (recycled); and dunny and hoses sparkling.

[peghall]

Oh dear...Only clean water should go through the toilet. Gray water needs to go out the thru-hull, 'cuz soap scum, dirt and body oils aren't good for the toilet pump or the hoses..they create a scum that can trap waste, salt and minerals, resulting in a buildup. As for the part of about no wasted water...use sea water to flush...only use enough fresh water to rinse all the sea water out before the boat will sit. Follow it with a cupful of distilled white vinegar once a week to prevent sea water mineral buildup. Be sure to flush the vinegar ALL the way through the toilet pump...don't leave it sitting in the bowl.

[Wand]

Originally Posted by peghall

Oh dear...Only clean water should go through the toilet. Gray water needs to go out the thru-hull, 'cuz soap scum, dirt and body oils aren't good for the toilet pump or the hoses..they create a scum that can trap waste, salt and minerals, resulting in a buildup. As for the part of about no wasted water...use sea water to flush...only use enough fresh water to rinse all the sea water out before the boat will sit. Follow it with a cupful of distilled white vinegar once a week to prevent sea water mineral buildup. Be sure to flush the vinegar ALL the way through the toilet pump...don't leave it sitting in the bowl.

At the risk of turning this into an exclusive conversation, I didn't mean to suggest (yikes!) that the head is flushed with sink water - the flushing's done with sea water of course! The fresh sink water is simply pumped through the system after the flushing is done.

But if peghall is concerned about the little bit of soap used for hand washing causing problems, I can say it's never yet been a problem for me - and I've being doing it for quite a while. Maybe the regular vinegar flush is be taking care of any potential probs there?

I also think there's no need to be quite specific about the vinegar - any old cheapie vinegar seems to do the job just fine...or has for me so far anyway

[peghall]

There are a lot of things that don't seem to cause any problems in our lives for quite a while...then we find out why we shouldn't have.

...I also think there's no need to be quite specific about the vinegar - any old cheapie vinegar seems to do the job just fine...

There's good reason to use distilled white vinegar instead of any old kind. Cider and wine vinegars are fermented fruit juice, notably apples. Spill some and when it dries you're left with a sticky spot on the counter. Sticky is not really what you want in hoses. Otoh, distilled white vinegar is distilled from grain alcohol and is not only not sticky buy actually a bit more acidic...and therefore is used far more for cleaning than in cooking 'cuz it has many good uses. I haven't paid attention to prices, but I THINK white may even be cheaper than cider. Google white vinegar to learn about all the things it's good for.

But I only advise...it's YOUR boat!

[Wand]

But...it's YOUR boat!

Good we agree on that one... Phew! (thanks for yr advice though - I'll come back to it if my system turns turtle)

[peghall]

Originally Posted by At sea

Good we agree on that one... Phew! (thanks for yr advice though - I'll come back to it if my system turns turtle)

[akio.kanemoto]

Originally Posted by peghall

You certainly do like to overcomplicate the simple!

It's not flushing with salt water that creates odors...it's allowing salt water to sit and stagnate in the system that does. Rinse the salt water out of the system before the boat sits...problem solved.

Howdy Peggie,

Yep, that's me!

Now on this note - what if you're using the boat daily and flushing with saltwater daily etc? Do you still need a freshwater flush? Maybe nightly? Or not at all?

Also - just to summarize the thread on "lubricating valves etc" - some people have suggested pine-o-cleen, dishwashing liquid and olive oil - what are your thoughts about these to keep the joker valve etc supple?

So far, I think there's consensus about weekly cupful of vinegar to remove the mineral deposits, but would love an "authoritative" view on the lubricant aspect.

(btw, you probably won't remember, but we spoke on the phone some six years ago when I started my current rebuild of the boat and you convinced me to move the holding tank directly below the head

[clockwork orange]

I for one dont believe that flushing out the salt water with fresh is the solution, i sail on Lake Superior which of course is nice clean fresh water and most of the boats in our marina reek, it seems to me that many folks just accept it as part of the deal, my boat partner is ambivilant about it while i find it disgusting, far worse than the sum of the contents imho. I just finished replacing all the hose on the outlet side of the tank today with 1.5" pvc pipe and re routing it to shorten the run, there were two sections that required curving the pipe which can be done with a heat gun fairly easily. I got rid of about 6 ft of hose, it started at the aft end of the tank,looped under the tank and went foreward under the tank,following the stem and exiting just behind the bow fitting, glad to be rid of that. I scrubbed the whole boat out and it seems to be fixed although i still need to do the shorter section from the head to the tank. Next year we will throw it all away and install a composter.
Steve

[peghall]

What if you're using the boat daily and flushing with saltwater daily etc? Do you still need a freshwater flush? Maybe nightly? Or not at all?

How often should you take a bath? Or do laundry? When needed! If you're cruising in open ocean, ocean water miles from shore is actually pretty clean...so you might not need to flush out the system till you make landfall and close up the boat. Otoh, if you're cruising in, say, the Chesapeake, which is VERY organic, you might want to rinse out the system a bit more often...let your nose tell you when.

Also - just to summarize the thread on "lubricating valves etc" - some people have suggested pine-o-cleen, dishwashing liquid and olive oil - what are your thoughts about these to keep the joker valve etc supple?

Avoid household chemical bowl cleaners, pine oil cleaners, bleach or any products that contain bleach...Lysol or ANY household chemical products, and petroleum based products. Anything thin in enough to pour down the toilet is just gonna get washed out in a few flushes...but if you insist on a never ending job, veggie oil is prob'ly the best way to go. However, I'd rather spend just 10-15 minutes once a year to replace the thick synthetic Teflon grease that's in every toilet pump when it leaves the factory...and it's easy to do: just remove the top of the pump or remove the pump from the base...stick the tube of grease into it and give it healthy squirt. Put the pump back on the base or the top back on it...pump a few times to spread the grease all over the inside of the pump cylinder...you're done till next year.

(btw, you probably won't remember, but we spoke on the phone some six years ago when I started my current rebuild of the boat and you convinced me to move the holding tank directly below the head

I did??? Hmmmmm....

[peghall]

It's not a cure for EVERY source of odor...it's a cure for head INTAKE odor.

There are many sources of odor...permeated sanitation hoses...wet dirty bilges, dirty sumps...chain lockers...just to name a few. And they can all be cured, but of course not simply by teeing the head intake into the head sink drain!

it seems to me that many folks just accept it as part of the deal, my boat partner is ambivilant about it while i find it disgusting,

I'm on your side...that's why I wrote a whole book on odors and how to get rid of 'em!

You may want to do a little research into the effects of cold temps on composting before committing to a composting toilet.

[page winslow]

Had the same prob. on my 41 hunter. replaced hoses put in odor eater bags only helped a little (wife still smelled odors) then I install a clear air system ran lines to both heads, wife Happy now

[undercutter]

Great information in this thread as we are about to close up the boat for 9 months and leave her in Malaysia on the hard.

Plan to take the advice posted here and run vinegar through the heads right away and repeat just before haul. Also flush with fresh water as well. This will be a regular occurrence in the future.

Any other advice to prevent odours forming and or any other deterioration of the system. We have 2 electric heads c/w 2 holding tanks and overboard pumps. (This is asia and there are no pump out facilities here)

I really hope to hear from Peg on this one as well as anyone else that can help.