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Old 27-01-2011, 00:32   #1
JJB
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Spectra or FCI

Hey.
I've been checking out the other threads on watermakers, but really haven't seen this question answered, my parents called me today, about a new watermaker for their Cat, their old one is on the fritz, my father is leaning towards an FCI, simply because he thinks he can get it cheaper than a Spectra.

I've fairly recently purchased a Spectra Newport 1000 MK2, haven't had much chance to use it yet, but I have always had fairly positive experiences, the model my parents are looking at is an FCI Aquamiser Plus, the exact model produces 79L/hour.
Just wondering what peoples opinions are.

Edit: Sorry I didn't include their usage habits, they tend to use 500L between the two of them a day, their old system used to be run 4 hours a day, when they were at sea.
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Old 27-01-2011, 05:44   #2
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500 liters a day!! Wow! And I thought I was a water hog!
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Old 27-01-2011, 05:51   #3
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500 liters a day!! Wow! And I thought I was a water hog!
Hehe, I can see how you would say that, but bare in mind, for them two showers a day is the norm, with how long each of them take in the shower, I strongly doubt each of them would use less than 150L each shower. Dad also has a routine of hosing the decks every morning.
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Old 27-01-2011, 05:58   #4
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Originally Posted by JJB View Post
Hey.
I've been checking out the other threads on watermakers, but really haven't seen this question answered, my parents called me today, about a new watermaker for their Cat, their old one is on the fritz, my father is leaning towards an FCI, simply because he thinks he can get it cheaper than a Spectra.

I've fairly recently purchased a Spectra Newport 1000 MK2, haven't had much chance to use it yet, but I have always had fairly positive experiences, the model my parents are looking at is an FCI Aquamiser Plus, the exact model produces 79L/hour.
Just wondering what peoples opinions are.

Edit: Sorry I didn't include their usage habits, they tend to use 500L between the two of them a day, their old system used to be run 4 hours a day, when they were at sea.
500 Liters a day is about 132 gallons. While that amount will shock a few sailors here it's not all that uncommon. How much fresh water tankage does their Cat have? With as much water usage as you've stated an FCI Aquamiser 79L is way too small a watermaker for that demand. It would have to run about 7 hours a day to keep up. Your NPMKII1000 would only need to run about 3.5 hours a day to get the same amount of water. But I don't like to see watermakers run every day but prefer to see them run every three days ideally. Even every other day is better than every day. Once you get above a six hour run time for each operation it's a good indication that you should be looking at a larger watermaker.
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Old 27-01-2011, 06:05   #5
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500 Liters a day is about 132 gallons. While that amount will shock a few sailors here it's not all that uncommon. How much fresh water tankage does their Cat have? With as much water usage as you've stated an FCI Aquamiser 79L is way too small a watermaker for that demand. It would have to run about 7 hours a day to keep up. Your NPMKII1000 would only need to run about 3.5 hours a day to get the same amount of water. But I don't like to see watermakers run every day but prefer to see them run every three days ideally. Even every other day is better than every day. Once you get above a six hour run time for each operation it's a good indication that you should be looking at a larger watermaker.
That makes sense, but how about the brand comparison and the different pro's and cons between them, if needs be I am sure they would get a larger water maker, after pointing that out to them.
They have 4x 250L tanks. Two in each hull, space here also isn't at a premium, they have many places they could put the watermaker, where it is right now seems to work fine, but if larger is required there is plenty more space.
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Old 27-01-2011, 06:12   #6
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Hehe, I can see how you would say that, but bare in mind, for them two showers a day is the norm, with how long each of them take in the shower, I strongly doubt each of them would use less than 150L each shower. Dad also has a routine of hosing the decks every morning.
Wow! Well, if they've got it, of course, it's their privilege to use it as they like.

My Dad is a complete water nazi; he can live for weeks on the 100 gallons on his boat. He starts shaking involuntarily when anyone turns on a faucet.

I am considerably more liberal with water than my Dad, and in hot weather I also take two showers a day. Nevertheless, our 1000 liters of tankage will usually last a week with three or four people on board, even if we run the washing machine a couple of times.

We generally take shipboard showers, however, which I think is good practice on board even if you have plenty of water.

If your Dad's decks are teak, he might be better of hosing them off with salt water.
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Old 27-01-2011, 08:27   #7
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That makes sense, but how about the brand comparison and the different pro's and cons between them, if needs be I am sure they would get a larger water maker, after pointing that out to them.
They have 4x 250L tanks. Two in each hull, space here also isn't at a premium, they have many places they could put the watermaker, where it is right now seems to work fine, but if larger is required there is plenty more space.
I have to be careful on two fronts. First I have to say that I am a dealer for Spectra and other brands but not FCI. Also I cannot nor will I here on CF push one brand over the other. I can only give general advice. If you would like to PM me I could go into details a bit further. But FCI makes a good watermaker but it's an energy hog especially when getting into the size of watermaker your folks require. All watermakers of this size will run on either 120V or 220V. So the power issue is generators, inverters etc. A large watermaker that runs a plunger high pressure pump is going to take a lot of power relative to a boats capabilities to generate that power. The boats abilities to generate this power in balance with all it's electrical needs is a very important issue when deciding which watermaker to choose. If your folks where to invest in a watermaker that is too small like the FCI suggested they would need to run it eveyday for at least seven hours a day. That's a lot of extra wear and tear on the watermaker about three times the amount of run time that is normal. All things wear out from use. Watermakers are no different. Why buy something too small that will wear out three times as fast. The long run costs don't make sense. Also consider the generator. This is not an inexpensive piece of equipment either. Your folks would most likely be adding unnecessary hours on it as well to keep up with a smaller watermakers need to run 7 hours a day. These are real long term costs. In the range of water needed by your folks I'd be more inclined to direct them to a Farallon 1800 even over the NewPort1000 MKII . It would easily suppy all their needs and then some and only have to run every three days for about 3-4 hours and it is even far more energy efficent than your NP1000. A lot less wear and tear on both the generator and the watermaker adding a lot more longevity to both, again these are real costs. Also if noise is an issue, as it usually is on boats this size, large watermakers with high pressure plunger pumps are loud. Spectras are no where near the db levels. I don't mean to sound like I'm pressing a Spectra. But when you get into this size of watermaker the issues surrounding which unit to buy are no way the same or comparable to issues on smaller boats. A whole new set of problems and parameters arise that must be addressed. One thing I can say for certain is that if your folks buy any 79 lph watermaker they will soon regret the decision and will probably remove it and buy larger one in short order. Add the cost of the first watermaker to the cost of a second larger one and they will have paid a hefty premium for attempting to buy cheaper the first time. I have seen this countless of times. People buy watermakers based on price and on their dock buddies at the Tiki bar well intended but misguided advice. You and your folks need professional advice and not just some salesman that will sell you anything.
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Old 27-01-2011, 17:21   #8
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I have to be careful on two fronts. First I have to say that I am a dealer for Spectra and other brands but not FCI. Also I cannot nor will I here on CF push one brand over the other. I can only give general advice. If you would like to PM me I could go into details a bit further. But FCI makes a good watermaker but it's an energy hog especially when getting into the size of watermaker your folks require. All watermakers of this size will run on either 120V or 220V. So the power issue is generators, inverters etc. A large watermaker that runs a plunger high pressure pump is going to take a lot of power relative to a boats capabilities to generate that power. The boats abilities to generate this power in balance with all it's electrical needs is a very important issue when deciding which watermaker to choose. If your folks where to invest in a watermaker that is too small like the FCI suggested they would need to run it eveyday for at least seven hours a day. That's a lot of extra wear and tear on the watermaker about three times the amount of run time that is normal. All things wear out from use. Watermakers are no different. Why buy something too small that will wear out three times as fast. The long run costs don't make sense. Also consider the generator. This is not an inexpensive piece of equipment either. Your folks would most likely be adding unnecessary hours on it as well to keep up with a smaller watermakers need to run 7 hours a day. These are real long term costs. In the range of water needed by your folks I'd be more inclined to direct them to a Farallon 1800 even over the NewPort1000 MKII . It would easily suppy all their needs and then some and only have to run every three days for about 3-4 hours and it is even far more energy efficent than your NP1000. A lot less wear and tear on both the generator and the watermaker adding a lot more longevity to both, again these are real costs. Also if noise is an issue, as it usually is on boats this size, large watermakers with high pressure plunger pumps are loud. Spectras are no where near the db levels. I don't mean to sound like I'm pressing a Spectra. But when you get into this size of watermaker the issues surrounding which unit to buy are no way the same or comparable to issues on smaller boats. A whole new set of problems and parameters arise that must be addressed. One thing I can say for certain is that if your folks buy any 79 lph watermaker they will soon regret the decision and will probably remove it and buy larger one in short order. Add the cost of the first watermaker to the cost of a second larger one and they will have paid a hefty premium for attempting to buy cheaper the first time. I have seen this countless of times. People buy watermakers based on price and on their dock buddies at the Tiki bar well intended but misguided advice. You and your folks need professional advice and not just some salesman that will sell you anything.
Thanks for your info Tellie, I wasn't after anyone to press anyone product in particular, more just the pros and cons of each, what you have provided me is great info, personally I am pro spectra as I have never had a serious issue with them.
I'll call them a little later today and provide them with this info, it's really all I was looking for
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Old 27-01-2011, 18:41   #9
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Old 27-01-2011, 19:04   #10
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G'day, mate. Why not refurbish the old unit? I just rebuilt a plunger pump for $250 USD. A couple of new membranes are in the same range. These are most likely the highest cost items in a system, unless it is an automatic system and the electronics need replaced. It appears that the watermaker your parents have was meeting their requirements when it was working properly. Cheers
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Old 27-01-2011, 22:31   #11
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G'day, mate. Why not refurbish the old unit? I just rebuilt a plunger pump for $250 USD. A couple of new membranes are in the same range. These are most likely the highest cost items in a system, unless it is an automatic system and the electronics need replaced. It appears that the watermaker your parents have was meeting their requirements when it was working properly. Cheers
Simply put, they just want something brand new.
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