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Old 03-11-2015, 18:45   #1
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Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

Modern boats have so many conveniences. But my experience is that they don't work consistently. For example, I remember having only a foot-pump in the galley to pump fresh water.

Now I have a modern, fully-featured almost new catamaran with a centralized fresh water system that runs on a single electric pump and an accumulator tank. The accumulator tank failed in 2 years of mild use. The pump gave out after only 3 years and we replaced it. But now, 8 months later, it appears to have failed again.

Our pressure water system was intermittent for a couple of days or so. It would pump just fine, but then it would stop working. Left alone for a while, it came back and would work again. This went on for a couple of days. But now, alas, it has died the final death.

Not sure if this failure is the pump or maybe a depressurized water system?

Any ideas on what I should do?

- BH

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Old 03-11-2015, 19:10   #2
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Re: pump, pump, no pump ...repeat and ...die

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Any ideas on what I should do?
Well, you could do what we do: foot pumps for the sinks, and pressure only for the shower and transom rinse hose. Our Whale foot pumps are now 25 years old, mostly full time cruising and dammit, I had to rebuild the one in the galley this year!

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Old 03-11-2015, 19:14   #3
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Re: pump, pump, no pump ...repeat and ...die

We have a Paragon Sr. pump with an accumulator on our boat. Its 15 years old and is working fine. Although it is expensive, it has been 100% reliable. The boat is a Bene 50.

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Old 03-11-2015, 19:27   #4
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Re: pump, pump, no pump ...repeat and ...die

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Well, you could do what we do: foot pumps for the sinks, and pressure only for the shower and transom rinse hose. Our Whale foot pumps are now 25 years old, mostly full time cruising and dammit, I had to rebuild the one in the galley this year!

Jim
HA! The good ole' days. The old ways are a wee bit more difficult, but seem to always work ...and work ...and work.

Just last night we were talking about adding a foot-pump in the galley.

Seems like now would be a good time.

Thanks

- BH

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Old 03-11-2015, 22:28   #5
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

BH, another good part of using foot pumps is that it encourages and expedites water conservation... without much thought or discipline on the part of the consumer, who may not be as conservative as you would wish in their usage.

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Old 04-11-2015, 03:35   #6
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Pitchondesign.
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Old 04-11-2015, 05:30   #7
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

I'm no pump expert...but your problem sounds like a short or lose connection.
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Old 04-11-2015, 05:41   #8
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

Check your wire size, too small a wire for too long a run will burn up motors and switches due to voltage drop.
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Old 04-11-2015, 05:42   #9
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

We have a pressurized water system without accumulator. Pumps generally last about three years, at which time you can either replace, or rebuild the head. I learned to carry an identical spare. Frankly I think the pump would work for much longer, but each spring we clean out the fresh water system by draining, fill with bleach mixture, pump out, fill, then pump out and refill - a 105 gal system. That's about a 30 minute run time per empty, and although we run the pump for a while, then let cool, etc., it's not designed for this kind of continuous operation and gets hot. The tankage is set low in the boat, and siphoning would take very long.

Finally, the only problem we've had is someone left the transom shower on slightly, to a fast drip. The pump really likes water on, and water off, and it will build up pressure and then turn off. With a drip/pressure leak, it has a harder time getting the pump volume to hit the pressure limit, and tends to just spin. That's not good on pump either.
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Old 04-11-2015, 09:41   #10
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

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Originally Posted by Capn Bri View Post
Not sure if this failure is the pump or maybe a depressurized water system?

Any ideas on what I should do?

- BH
Sell the boat. Clearly it is haunted. Sell it quick.
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Old 04-11-2015, 09:47   #11
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

Run two pumps each for my main water and shower sump. Inline with gate valves to divert from one to another and a three way electric switch, ( pump 1-pump 2 and off in the middle). All pumps go out sometime and having the ability to switch to a working one gives plenty of time for repair without a loss in livability.
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Old 04-11-2015, 09:57   #12
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Re: Pump, Pump, No Pump ...Repeat and ...Die

Fresh water pressure pumps life is dependent on hours of use.

We have 4 x 60 gallon fresh water tanks on our Liberty 458.

We find that suction side cavitation is our biggest issue.

As a work around we draw from 2 tanks at a time. The pumps duty cycle is greatly reduced.

To address the issue we plan to upsize the suction hoses. Additionally i'll be fitting a small gravity fed priming tank on the suction side.

Our johnson pump and non welded stainless acumulator (brand escapes me) are both 12 years old and still going strong.

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Old 04-11-2015, 10:08   #13
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Re: pump, pump, no pump ...repeat and ...die

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Originally Posted by Pitchondesign View Post
We have a Paragon Sr. pump with an accumulator on our boat. Its 15 years old and is working fine. Although it is expensive, it has been 100% reliable. The boat is a Bene 50.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
Interesting.... can't be sure because they don't say, but it doesn't look like they manufacture here unless the three people in Tampa are very busy - maybe China?

"Paragon Pump Company, LLC was founded in 2001, and is located at 18102 Courtney Breeze Dr in Tampa. It employs 3 employees and is generating approximately $159,012.00 in annual revenue. Additional information is available by contacting this business at (813) 994-3356.
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Old 04-11-2015, 10:21   #14
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Re: pump, pump, no pump ...repeat and ...die

Sorry. I wasn't specific enough. The Paragon Senior is made by Groco, not the Paragon Pump company.
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Old 04-11-2015, 10:32   #15
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Re: pump, pump, no pump ...repeat and ...die

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Sorry. I wasn't specific enough. The Paragon Senior is made by Groco, not the Paragon Pump company.
THANKS! I am looking at pumps right now and was impressed by the longevity you have experienced! I'll check them out right now!!
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