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Old 25-03-2019, 18:01   #1
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Propane for both cooking and heating?

My boat came with a propane Force 10 heater that the PO fed with 1 lb bottles that he kept under a bunk. Cooking was done on a white gas stove. It all scares the hell out of me. I have purchased a propane cook stove and am building a proper sealed tank container with an overboard drain and a solenoid. My question is how can I feed a propane cabin heater (maybe several hours at a time) and not have pressure to the stove. The stove wont be used for long periods of time and the solenoid will be shut off as soon as cooking is done. I believe that T-connections are not allowed in the boat and I dont want to have separate solenoids for the heater and the stove. I am sure that other people have had this issue. Any ideas???? Grant.
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Old 25-03-2019, 18:08   #2
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

If you want to run the heater AND not pressurize the stove AND not have two solenoids... it can't be done. unless you install a manual valve in the propane locker that would shut off flow to the stove.

A white gas stove below deck???? Damn..... it must be true that god protects drunks idiots and little children because that is as idiotic as they come.
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Old 26-03-2019, 08:16   #3
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

The one pound bottles are almost more scary than the white gas. I use them a lot on small torches and lamps and I know how they often leak down. I suspected that there was no reasonable way or any way that an insurance company would accept. I really dont like the idea of separate solenoids but that may be the only solution, or I may go back to my earlier days and have a kerosene cabin heater. One thing I will be sure of is (Thanks to Boaties Great Adventure) to carry the needed fittings to bypass the solenoid in case of an electrical failure, or faulty solenoid. If I remember correctly, Boatman 61 went a week or more without hot food on a delivery because of an electrical issue and not having the correct fittings to bypass the solenoid. That has stuck in my mind for the spares department. Thanks, Grant.
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Old 26-03-2019, 08:21   #4
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Propane for both cooking and heating?

The whole propane thing is weird to me.
Try to carry even an empty bottle into a store, they get upset like your carrying a bomb.
However in that same store, there will be pallets of those 1 lb bottles, all filled of course.
Once you attach some thing to a 1 lb bottle, they often leak when the item is removed form the bottle.
Then there is the fact that they are rust magnets. In short I donít use them anymore, I bought an adapter hose to connect a 10lb aluminum tank to a grill, and it will also connect to my propane torch
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Old 26-03-2019, 08:29   #5
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gjordan View Post
The one pound bottles are almost more scary than the white gas. I use them a lot on small torches and lamps and I know how they often leak down. I suspected that there was no reasonable way or any way that an insurance company would accept. I really dont like the idea of separate solenoids but that may be the only solution, or I may go back to my earlier days and have a kerosene cabin heater. One thing I will be sure of is (Thanks to Boaties Great Adventure) to carry the needed fittings to bypass the solenoid in case of an electrical failure, or faulty solenoid. If I remember correctly, Boatman 61 went a week or more without hot food on a delivery because of an electrical issue and not having the correct fittings to bypass the solenoid. That has stuck in my mind for the spares department. Thanks, Grant.

Get a short LPG hose with correct fittings all made up-to use as a solenoid bypass. / Len
https://www.rvpartscountry.com/RVLPHosesAccessories
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Old 26-03-2019, 09:32   #6
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

I have a Force 10 propane heater and Seaward propane stove connected to a Y fitting in the tank locker. Both can be used at the same time. The Force 10 goes through a lot of propane, about 1/2 lb per hour so I am surprised that anyone would use one pound cans to feed it.
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Old 26-03-2019, 10:42   #7
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

Good thought about having a manual bypass around the solenoid, all fittings of course located in the draining locker.


I would certainly avoid having the propane burner for the heater inside the boat. Webasto makes propane heaters that heat water and then circulate it to small blowers you locate inside the cabins. The burner is located in a separate locker with drain. That system can be plumbed in series with your pressure hot water system so at anchor the Webasto does all the heating.


With a couple solenoid valves you could introduce the hot water from the engine to the same system and isolate the engine from the system when engine is cold.



A friend installed a Webasto in his boat years ago and his boat became a very popular place to be on cold San Francisco evenings.
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Old 26-03-2019, 11:31   #8
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

Heating with LPG 4-10 hrs./lb.
https://ca.binnacle.com/pdf/COZY%20CABIN%20SPECS.pdf



Heating with diesel (24hrs/day on Low) winter in Canada 30gal/mo.
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Old 26-03-2019, 13:12   #9
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gjordan View Post
My boat came with a propane Force 10 heater that the PO fed with 1 lb bottles that he kept under a bunk. Cooking was done on a white gas stove. It all scares the hell out of me. I have purchased a propane cook stove and am building a proper sealed tank container with an overboard drain and a solenoid. My question is how can I feed a propane cabin heater (maybe several hours at a time) and not have pressure to the stove. The stove wont be used for long periods of time and the solenoid will be shut off as soon as cooking is done. I believe that T-connections are not allowed in the boat and I dont want to have separate solenoids for the heater and the stove. I am sure that other people have had this issue. Any ideas???? Grant.
Send an email to boatpoker@gmail.com and I'll respond with pdf's. of the ABYC propane standards. They clearly instruct on how to achieve what you want.
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Old 26-03-2019, 14:36   #10
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

I have a tasco 2 burner propane stove with oven and a Dickenson propane fireplace. The latter is supplied with air and vented via a concentric pipe to the outside. There is a t -junction from the stove to the fireplace. The tanks are in a gas proof locker with a solenoid. 25 years and no problem, there is a propane monitor in the cabin. The insurance company has never had a problem with this
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Old 26-03-2019, 14:41   #11
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

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I have a tasco 2 burner propane stove with oven and a Dickenson propane fireplace. The latter is supplied with air and vented via a concentric pipe to the outside. There is a t -junction from the stove to the fireplace. The tanks are in a gas proof locker with a solenoid. 25 years and no problem, there is a propane monitor in the cabin. The insurance company has never had a problem with this
`Some people don't care but that t-junction is not ABYC compliant.
Or perhaps your surveyor missed it or didn't mention it in the report. Or perhaps he does not survey to ABYC.
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Old 26-03-2019, 14:54   #12
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

If ABYC is not a concern, just take that fact as an indication to regularly do a thorough inspection of the lines & fittings, soapy water or gauge-based leak tests, proactively replacing rubber bits & hoses.

Which should all be par for the course.

99 people out of a hundred can all agree "never had a problem" but does not mean it's safe.

And yes driving on highways is less safe, but. . .
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Old 26-03-2019, 18:23   #13
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by deblen View Post
Heating with LPG 4-10 hrs./lb.
https://ca.binnacle.com/pdf/COZY%20CABIN%20SPECS.pdf



Heating with diesel (24hrs/day on Low) winter in Canada 30gal/mo.
Personal experience


Len
They can publish any spec they want but that does not make it true. I have had my Cozy Cabin Heater for close to thirty years and I can suck a 20lb tank dry in less than two days at the highest setting.
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Old 27-03-2019, 11:20   #14
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

To start with, Propane is the worst type of heating available, because it generates condensation, i.e. a rain forest, although there is one type that is vented outside, that eliminates that problem.
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Old 27-03-2019, 12:23   #15
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Re: Propane for both cooking and heating?

I know a lot of people don't care about ABYC but they do have a reason for requiring all propane heaters to draw combustion air from outside as well as exhaust to the outside.
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