Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 16-01-2013, 02:43   #1
Registered User
 
ALLAN WARD's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Homeport : Port Owen , Cape West Coast , South Africa . Currently cruising .
Boat: SHEARWATER 39.
Posts: 90
PAR Manual Toilet Lubrication

I have a PAR (Jabsco) manual toilet which needs continual lubrication.I have tried baby oil,then switched to vegetable oil but still the pump needs to be lubed after every couple of flushs as it get tight and noisy obviously causing unnecessary wear.Any suggestions
__________________

__________________
ALLAN WARD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2013, 03:19   #2
Moderator
 
Pete7's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Solent, England
Boat: Moody 31
Posts: 8,551
Images: 14
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

A replacement pump is only a fraction more than the overhaul kit so I replaced the whole pump and noticed a huge difference, much easier to use. Also came with the later twist and lock mechanism. It's only a 10 minute job.

Pete
__________________

__________________
Moody 31 - April Lass
Pete7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 03:25   #3
Registered User
 
ALLAN WARD's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Homeport : Port Owen , Cape West Coast , South Africa . Currently cruising .
Boat: SHEARWATER 39.
Posts: 90
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Many thanks for the quick reply Pete . Have already priced the new pump and you are right , very little difference in cost . Looks like the way to go.
__________________
ALLAN WARD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 06:09   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: liveaboard
Boat: 36' solaris sunrise catamaran
Posts: 392
Smile Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Before spending good money, try this.

Pump the toilet dry, put some OLIVE OIL in and flush with some FRESH POTABLE water. It works wonders. Also once a month flush with VINEGAR.

Good luck

Peter
__________________
rivonia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 06:17   #5
Senior Cruiser
 
colemj's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Presently on US East Coast
Boat: Manta 40 "Reach"
Posts: 10,049
Images: 12
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Oil will never work longer than a day or so. You need to remove the plunger (very easy with the new pumps) and spread a synthetic grease-type lubricant on the cylinder and plunger O-ring. We use SuperLube, as does PAR in the original manufacturing assembly. An application lasts 1-3 months (full time use) before the squeaking starts again.

Mark
__________________
www.svreach.com

You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
colemj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 07:56   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: liveaboard
Boat: 36' solaris sunrise catamaran
Posts: 392
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
Oil will never work longer than a day or so. You need to remove the plunger (very easy with the new pumps) and spread a synthetic grease-type lubricant on the cylinder and plunger O-ring. We use SuperLube, as does PAR in the original manufacturing assembly. An application lasts 1-3 months (full time use) before the squeaking starts again.

Mark
What planet are you from ? Olive oil will lsat a minimum of seven days. DO NOT REMOVE THE PLUNGER !!

Just follow my original instructions and see what happens. You came on here for correct advice and not to get and guess work.

Peter
__________________
rivonia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 08:35   #7
Registered User
 
svHyLyte's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Tampa Bay area, USA
Boat: Beneteau First 42
Posts: 3,432
Images: 25
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALLAN WARD View Post
I have a PAR (Jabsco) manual toilet which needs continual lubrication.I have tried baby oil,then switched to vegetable oil but still the pump needs to be lubed after every couple of flushs as it get tight and noisy obviously causing unnecessary wear.Any suggestions
You may have a build-up of salt/calcium-carbonate on the walls of your pump. Before replacing, you might try picking up a product known as "SaltAway" from you local marine store and mixing up a gallon batch or so. Emply the head as much as possible, refill the bowl with fresh water, pump that down about 2/3'rds and then pour your SaltAway mix into the bowl and pump the mix down about 3/4's, leaving some in the bowl and you pump-handle fully retracted. Allow that to sit a day or so. (While the handle's pulled out, lubricate the shaft with some silicone grease.) After a day or so, oump a few bowls filled with fresh water through the head and then add some Head Lube to the water in the bowl and repeat the foregoing exercise, again leaving the pump handle pull out such that the pump body remains filled with the head lube/fresh water mixture.

With the foregoing you may find that the easy operation of the head is restored at little cost or effort. FWIW we keep a plastic squeeze bottle with a SaltAway mix in both heads on our boat and add a few squirts to the water once the bowl's been cleared of debris/waste and pump that into the lines and, with that, and an occassional head lube in the bowl and silicon grease on the pump shaft, our pumps have remained functional for years.

FWIW...
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the Sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."
svHyLyte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 08:36   #8
Writing Full-Time Since 2014
 
thinwater's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Deale, MD
Boat: PDQ Altair, 32/34
Posts: 4,333
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

  1. Read the manual. It will repeat colemj's comments.
  2. Baby oil can harden and swell the internals (neoprene). That combined with wear (I gather it is old) have most likely sealed its fate. Replace the pump unit. Do not try the rebuild, as the pump is a far better value.
  3. Maintain the new unit acording to the manual.
  4. Olive oil is best. Baby oil and corn oil are bad (side-by-side testing). But lubing every year is easier IMHO.
__________________
Gear Testing--Engineering--Sailing

Writing full-time since 2014.
Bookstore:http://sail-delmarva.blogspot.com/20...ook-store.html
thinwater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2013, 08:50   #9
Sponsoring Vendor
 
HopCar's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2011
Location: Miami Florida
Boat: Ellis Flybridge 28
Posts: 3,160
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Colemj is correct. Putting salad dressing down the toilet is a short term fix that can lead to other problems. An oil slick in your holding tank can cut the black water off from air and the anaerobic bacteria can flourish and cause a stink.
Peggie Hall, the Head Mistress, suggests grease about once a year. Be sure it is a type of grease that won't hurt rubber.
If you decide to buy a replacement pump, I'd love to sell it to you.
Here is a link to my website: Jabsco Toilet Pump - 29040-3000
Here is a link to Paggie's book: Get Rid of Boat Odors by Peggie Hall
__________________
Hopkins-Carter Marine Supplies & Fishing Tackle
What You Need, at the Price You Want...with Service!
HopCar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-01-2013, 00:20   #10
Registered User
 
ALLAN WARD's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Homeport : Port Owen , Cape West Coast , South Africa . Currently cruising .
Boat: SHEARWATER 39.
Posts: 90
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Many thanks to everyone for your great advice. One way or the other , l will solve my problem of a tight noisy head.
__________________
ALLAN WARD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-01-2013, 01:02   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ireland, French canals/Med/Spain
Boat: Birchwood Centre Cockpit 33, Broom Shannon Class 42 flybridge.
Posts: 476
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

I use my boat around the Med and European canals and the water in the canals is very hard. I have both an electric toilet and a manual and got a calcium build up in the toilets and discharge pipes. I stripped the electric toilet and soaked the macerator parts in vinegar to clean them, the discharge pipe was originally 3/4'' and was so badly built up with calcium after 6 years use it was down to 5/16'' bore, I replaced the pipe refitted the macerator and it works fine, I now put down a quart of vinegar once a month and pump slightly to soak the internals,then flush after about 4/5 hours, I've have had no further problems. The manual toilet also had a build up of calcium, and particularly in the groove of the piston head behind the rubber 'O' ring which was forcing the ring out of the groove making the toilet very stiff to operate. Again I cleaned it all and soaked in vinegar, refitted it with just a smear of vaseline to lubricate and a smear on the piston rod to keep it free.
As a matter of interest I use a electronically controlled magnetic field water softener for the domestic supply and have tested it over a period of time, it definitely works, not as fast as a salt based water softener but effective over the long term, cheap bit of kit, just fit it and forget it.

Hydrochloric acid will dissolve calcium build up very quickly but I would advise extreme caution if you decide to use it, frankly vinegar is cheap, effective and safer.
Different conditions in different cruising area's of course but I hope this helps someone somewhere.
__________________
Irish rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-01-2013, 05:14   #12
Senior Cruiser
 
colemj's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Presently on US East Coast
Boat: Manta 40 "Reach"
Posts: 10,049
Images: 12
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rivonia View Post
What planet are you from ? Olive oil will lsat a minimum of seven days. DO NOT REMOVE THE PLUNGER !!

Just follow my original instructions and see what happens. You came on here for correct advice and not to get and guess work.

Peter
On my planet, my boat has had two of these exact heads in daily use for 10 years now.

Do you even own this exact head on your planet, or are you giving advice based on experience with another brand/model of head?

One could follow your instructions, or one could follow the instructions from the manufacturer (which I recommended). On my planet, we take advice from the manufacturer and consider it correct. We call advice from others that go against these recommendations "guess work"

On my planet, we want our toilets working between maintenance for several months and not several days.

On my planet, the plunger is dead simple to remove so there is no need for shouting caution.

Maybe you have banged your head too hard?

Mark
__________________
www.svreach.com

You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
colemj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-01-2013, 05:18   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: liveaboard
Boat: 36' solaris sunrise catamaran
Posts: 392
Exclamation Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
On my planet, my boat has had two of these exact heads in daily use for 10 years now.

Do you even own this exact head on your planet, or are you giving advice based on experience with another brand/model of head?

One could follow your instructions, or one could follow the instructions from the manufacturer (which I recommended). On my planet, we take advice from the manufacturer and consider it correct. We call advice from others that go against these recommendations "guess work"

On my planet, we want our toilets working between maintenance for several months and not several days.

On my planet, the plunger is dead simple to remove so there is no need for shouting caution.

Maybe you have banged your head too hard?

Mark
The manufacturer does NOT recomend removing the plunger !!!

Reason why- The screws that hold the top are not meant to be frequenlty removed as they WILL leak. Nuff sed.

Peter
__________________
rivonia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-01-2013, 07:09   #14
Senior Cruiser
 
colemj's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Presently on US East Coast
Boat: Manta 40 "Reach"
Posts: 10,049
Images: 12
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

Man, that head banging must really hurt.

The newer models have a plunger that is easily removed without removing any other part or screw. The older models require removing the screws holding the top, but there is a thick rubber gasket that does not require cranking down the screws. I have never caused one to leak.

The manufacturer recommends applying synthetic grease to the plunger o-ring and cylinder. How one manages to do this without removing the plunger is a mystery to me.

I don't consider 3-7 days of operation between maintenance acceptable. Particularly when there is a simple procedure that provides 3-6 months of operation.

Do you actually own this exact brand and model of head?

Mark
__________________
www.svreach.com

You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
colemj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18-01-2013, 07:46   #15
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,138
Re: PAR MANUAL TOILET LUBRICATION.

colemj is correct. I have always wondered why someone would be as foolish as to pour oil (olive, peanut, canola or whatever) in the head and then flushing it into the holding tank or overboard when the actual pump is so easy to lubricate. Especially the newer ones with the big nut. I lube mine once a month, ten minutes to do two heads.
__________________

__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Which Electric Toilet? Dockhead Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 74 25-07-2013 13:08
The Head To End All Heads GaryMayo Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 108 29-11-2012 07:51
Electric Toilet vjmehra Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 12 14-06-2012 21:52
Replacement for Jabsco manual toilet nwh10 Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 5 09-06-2012 19:19
Electric to Manual Toilet Pump . . . Help ! suz_lee Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 6 05-12-2011 09:49



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 00:02.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.