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Old 09-05-2012, 20:29   #46
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

Our head has no smells because our head is also the shower and we each take a daily shower which essentially ends with a wash and wipe down of the head. There's also a large forward facing hatch above the head which scoops up air and both dries it quickly and freshens the air. Regardless I replace the out flow hoses every few years. Absolutely no *head* smells whatsoever... ever. Clever design.
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Old 09-05-2012, 23:52   #47
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

Before replacing anything, I'd like to understand why Tartan went to such great lengths to route the head sink to the sump. I don't believe this was to save the cost of a thru-hull - instead there's 10' of hose and a couple of tee's, sump and pump. The only thing I can think of is the sink "might" be below the waterline when the boat is heeled over. In that case, routing to the sump makes sense. I'll let you know what I discover!

I also want to see if cleaning the holding tank vent solves our recent problem! Yes, I'm looking into replacing the fitting - the one I have has 2 small (~1/4" screens intake to 5/8" hose).
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Old 10-05-2012, 01:49   #48
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

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Originally Posted by Capt.Don View Post
Before replacing anything, I'd like to understand why Tartan went to such great lengths to route the head sink to the sump. I don't believe this was to save the cost of a thru-hull - instead there's 10' of hose and a couple of tee's, sump and pump. The only thing I can think of is the sink "might" be below the waterline when the boat is heeled over. In that case, routing to the sump makes sense. I'll let you know what I discover!
My boat is plumbed like that.

I think that in any case it is safer to have grey water pumped out above the water line via an antisiphon loop, than it is to let it drain through a below the water line through-hull.

Now why in the world did they design the deck and cockpit drains to go down below the waterline??
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Old 10-05-2012, 08:32   #49
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

I don't know that Tartan did plumb it that way...owners do get strange ideas sometimes. If they did, it's not how they used to do it...they plumbed the sinks to go directly overboard...teed the head intake into the sink drain line to use a single thru-hull for both. In fact, it was a Tartan owner who in 1993 first told me about using the sink to rinse the sea water out of the system. It was such a great idea that I began recommending re-plumbing any system to tee the head intake into the sink drain line...freeing up a hole in the boat to use for a washdown pump, heat/ac, or eliminating it altogether. However, Tartan wasn't the only ones to do this...some builders still plumb this way...I dunno why Tartan stopped...but then builders can also get strange ideas too!

the sink "might" be below the waterline when the boat is heeled over. In that case, routing to the sump makes sense.

No, keeping seacocks closed while underway is what makes sense, not a sump.

Re your holding tank vent thru-hull. Replace it with an open bulkhead or "mushroom" thru-hull, not a "vent" thru-hull. All "vent" thru-hulls are one-size-fits-all including fuel...so they're designed to include spark arresters--screens, pinholes, slits etc--that make it impossible to backflush the vent line to prevent blockage.
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Old 26-09-2012, 04:09   #50
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

I have exactly the same problem as bec.chandler and others in this tread.
I have read with great interest all of the contributions on this thread and would like to explain my system and what I have done, with some result but not cured.

The vessel is a Bayliner Avanti Express 3485, build year 1996. It was imported to the UK from Florida USA. The boat is used mainly in fresh water (rivers & broads).
When I bought it 5 years ago, it was fitted with a brand new Jabsco model 27354 electric toilet. The flush water was taken from river via a filter and the discharge runs horizontal through the bulkhead then rises to the top of the holding tank (no loop).

I foolishly poured bleach / disinfectant directly into the bowl with the result of damaging the seals and having to strip down & rebuild the Jabsco toilet. In the UK we use a blue formaldehyde based holding tank de-odorant which does not damage the seals, don’t know what you use in the US.

I cured the smells outside of the boat by fitting a ‘LeeSan’ Microvent Holding Tank Breather Filter.
However the head itself (nowhere else on the boat) smells every time it is flushed.

I then disconnected the raw water flush feed and now only flush with fresh (potable) water. I also fitted a ‘LeeSan’ Head Treatment System to treat the incoming flushing water to destroy the Micro-growth. It also turns the flush water blue and scents it. Smells nice if you just add water, until you flush.

As I still got ‘black bits’ in the bowl from the flush water I ripped out the original black rubber hose and connected the fresh water / HTS directly to the white plastic hose which was fitted with the new toilet. So the flush water circuit is now,
- Potable water supply to pressurization pump – solenoid valve operated by electric toilet switch – non return valve – head treatment bottle – white plastic feed pipe – toilet bowl.
The head still smelt every time it was flushed!

I noticed bubbles in the bowl after a flush and assumed the Jabsco ‘Joker’ valve was allowing gas from the discharge pipe back into the bowl, particularly as the discharge pipe rises about 3 feet to the top of the holding tank (there must be foul water in this pipe unless you flush an impractical amount of water through it) so fitted an additional ‘Henderson In-Line Check Valve’ in the discharge pipe close to the bowl.
It stopped the bubbles but the head still smells every time it is flushed!

I then tried, as recommended by ‘LeeSan’ Clean and Green Sachets. It was worse than the blue formaldehyde based holding tank de-odorant!

I was not happy with the ‘pump out’ at my usual place as it took to long and you could see on the level indicator that the holding tank level went down very slowly. I suspect that the tank was not being cleaned out properly. I now when it is a good pump out as it sucks the water out of the head bowl. I changed to a new pump out station with really good results. The head hardly smells at all when first flushed after a pump out, even if the boat has been left unused for weeks, but starts to smell after a few days use, again only when flushed, even having not used the head but just flushing it.

I am at the end of my tether; don’t know what else I can do? The only thing from the tread I have not tried is the vinegar treatment, with my system, would this help?

Any help would be gratefully received, Terry.
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Old 26-09-2012, 08:19   #51
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

Go back through this thread and read only Peggy's posts. Or maybe even better, buy her book.
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Old 26-09-2012, 08:26   #52
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

A couple of drops of EUCALYPTUS oil in the toilet bowel water before using takes all smell away, leaving a drop in the water also does the trick along with a seawater flush of the holding tank when at seas.... We have no more smell since using the oil......
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Old 26-09-2012, 08:29   #53
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

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Originally Posted by DeepFrz View Post
Go back through this thread and read only Peggy's posts. Or maybe even better, buy her book.
Thumbs up on that. Peggy knows her stuff when it comes to marine heads. I've been using CP (cleans potties) and K.O. (Kills Odors) products since the 1980's when Peggy ran Peal Products. They are now sold by Raritan but, IMO following Peggy's advice and using the above makes for a much nicer head environment on board.
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Old 26-09-2012, 09:35   #54
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

TerryJJ, A common source of head smells is that vegatation gets trapped in the rim of the bowl. Every time you flush it stinks and black bits come out with the flush water. The cure is to remove the bowl, hook a garden hose to the bowl inlet and give it a good flushing.

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Old 26-09-2012, 12:53   #55
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Re: My Head Smells Like . . . a Head

Thank you all. I have ordered Peggie’s book.
Peggie, if you pick up on my post, in addition to reading your book, if you have anything to add, thank you.
Terry
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