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Old 25-07-2019, 11:23   #1
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Jayco macerator, no tank.

I have a Glastron GT249 cuddy cruiser. It has a shower/head, and no manual. From the looks of it, the head is directly ported to open water which is obviously unacceptable.

Any ways I might easily add a holding tank to this?
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Old 25-07-2019, 12:00   #2
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

Your photo confirms that you do have an electric macerating toilet--a Jabsco 29090, which is only sold as a "conversion" that replaces only the pump on a manual toilet Jabsco 29090 Electric Toilet Conversion Kit The owners manual will help you learn how to use and maintain it. Jabsco 29090 conversion owners manual ...that is, IF you keep it.

Yes, you DO need a holding tank, but that would require a lot plumbing in addition to the tank, which on a boat the size of yours would eat up more than half of your storage space. Replacing the the toilet with a self-contained system—an "MSD" portapotty--makes a lot more sense. The "MSD" designation in the model name/number means it has fittings for a pumpout line and vent line, and is designed to be permanently installed (actually just sturdier brackets than portables, so you could still take it off the boat if you absolutely have to), which means that although it's still called a PORTApotty, you don't have to carry anything off the boat to empty it.

A 5-6 gallon model holds 50-60 flushes...you'd need at least a 30 gal tank to hold that many from any marine toilet. No plumbing needed except a vent line and pumpout hose--so no new holes in the boat...and -0- maintenance needed except for rinsing out the tank--which you can do with a bucket while it's being pumped out. Total cost including the pumpout hose and vent line is about $200--a fraction of what you'd spend for toilet, tank and all the related plumbing needed. And the best part is, you have all the advantages of a toilet and holding tank without giving up a single square foot of storage space.

Check out the Thetford 550P MSD and the Dometic/SeaLand 975MSD Sanipottie. Thetford has discontinued the 550PMSD, but it’s still available from most retailers…the Dometic 975MSD is still in production. They’re comparable, and not much can go wrong with either one, so go with the one you like best.

Defender usually has the best prices on most things and they have both in stock.

Dometic/SeaLand 975 MSD Thetford 550P MSD on Defender

I'll be glad to answer your questions about installation etc.



And btw, if you sell your toilet on Craigs List you can prob'ly get at least half the cost everything you'd need to install a new MSD system for it, especially if it's as brand new as it looks in your photo.


--Peggie
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Old 25-07-2019, 12:10   #3
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

The boat is new to me, but I maintain and clean things meticulously. It makes me happy that you noticed. I always have a spray bottle with some kind of peroxide solution in it. When on the boat, most surfaces get cleaned every day, otherwise very quickly boats start to smell of mildew and get little black spots all over them. Things like that can make a person ill very quickly.

Thank you for absolutely stellar advice!

I'm planning to use this boat for the Great Loop, so it would be used daily for a year. My ideal head would need emptying at most once a week.

I will heed your advice, but I do have a couple of questions.

First, the vent line and clean out port you mention. I assume they just go up the wall and exit the hull somewhere up high? I don't like the idea of a vacuum tube coming in through a window, when the outside of it is going to be smothered in fecal matter, and touching the inside of my shower. That would be gross.

Second, with proper care and maintenance, how long before the gasses coming off the head overwhelm the vent tube and I'd start smelling them inside? This was a problem with an RV I owned, and would start after just two days. I need to not access a slip for a week on a regular basis.

Third, can I use proper TP with it? I find my costco TP reduces to mush in water in about 15 minutes.

Fourth and last - any advice on blocking off the old vent hole below water line on my hull?
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Old 25-07-2019, 12:10   #4
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

What year is your boat?

I’ve just looked at several Glastron gt249 boats for sale, most of the photos that I saw of the switch panels had a macerator switch. This screams to me that there is a holding tank.

Also I was unable (in my quick search) to locate boats older than 2007-2008. Glastron would have been nuts to build a boat at that point without a holding tank.
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Old 25-07-2019, 12:42   #5
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

It's a 2008/9 switchover GT249. It has the 2009 fuel tank and motor, but everything else looks 2008.

The macerator switch just disconnects power to the electric macerator. There's also an "Electric Head" switch - I have no idea what that does.
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Old 25-07-2019, 13:20   #6
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

Electric head should be connected to your toilet, macerator should be connected to the pump that empties your tank.

The only way I could believe this vintage of boat doesn’t have a holding tank is if some previous owner has removed it.
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Old 25-07-2019, 14:38   #7
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

First, the vent line and clean out port you mention. I assume they just go up the wall and exit the hull somewhere up high?

Correct. The tank will be pumped out just like any other holding tank--through a deck pumpout fitting that's usually installed in the side deck, but can be installed in the hull.


Second, with proper care and maintenance, how long before the gasses coming off the head overwhelm the vent tube and I'd start smelling them inside?

If you're asking how long it's likely to take for odor to permeate the vent line...that depends on how permeation resistant the hose is. Those that have proven to be the most permeation resistant (at least 10 years) have considerably higher prices than that those that permeate quickly...making sanitation hoses the one place you don't want to go cheap! The good news is, you won't need much.

If you're asking how long it'll take for odor in the tank to overwhelm the tank product you're using and start gassing everyone within 50' of the tank vent, the answer is, when the right tank product is used according to directions, never.

Can I use proper TP with it? I find my costco TP reduces to mush in water in about 15 minutes.

Because there's no pump in this system that can be clogged or jammed by extra strong/soft TP, you can use any TP you like. Just DO NOT flush wet wipes! They won't clog anything on your boat, but can do major damage to dockside pumpout equipment.

Any advice on blocking off the old vent hole below water line on my hull?

There's no way any below-waterline thru-hull can be a vent, so you have to be referring to the toilet's flush water inlet thru-hull and (if the toilet is plumbed to flush directly overboard), the discharge thru-hull unless that one is above waterline. There should be seacocks (valves to open and close 'em) on them. You can simply keep them closed, or you can have a pro remove them and glass over the holes. Someone who knows what he's doing can do that so well there'll be no sign they were ever there.

We can talk one-on-one about installation issues specific to YOUR boat. If you'd like to do that send me an email (if you click on my name at the left of my posts it should bring up a choice of sending a private message or an email...please select email).

--Peggie
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Old 25-07-2019, 14:55   #8
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

Apparently the person who swapped out the manual toilet pump for the Jabsco 29090 electric macerating toilet pump wired it to the wrong breaker switch...it should have been wired to the Electric Head (head is the nautical name for toilet) switch. Most people refer to the macerator pump used to dump a holding tank (different from a macerating toilet pump) as just a "macerator"...that's what should be/have been wired to the "Macerator" breaker. If nothing is connected to the "Electric Head" breaker, you don't have a macerator pump.


However, that doesn't necessarily rule out the possibility that there is a holding tank...only that pumpout is the only way to empty it. If there's no deck pumpout fitting anywhere, that WOULD confirm that there's never been a tank. If there is one, but no plumbing connected to the underside of it, that would confirm that there prob'ly once was a tank but it's been removed. Where was this boat before you bought it--on inland waters or in coastal waters?



--Peggie
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Old 25-07-2019, 15:13   #9
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Jayco macerator, no tank.

A little more digging reveals a 40liter holding tank

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...t-249-3540411/
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Old 25-07-2019, 19:37   #10
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

There is so much knowledge and direction in this thread. I am humbled. This system is buried behind panels and completely inaccessible. Tomorrow, during daylight, I will photograph and document everything I can and report back.

Thank you both.
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Old 26-07-2019, 09:53   #11
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by peghall View Post
Your photo confirms that you do have an electric macerating toilet--a Jabsco 29090, which is only sold as a "conversion" that replaces only the pump on a manual toilet Jabsco 29090 Electric Toilet Conversion Kit The owners manual will help you learn how to use and maintain it. Jabsco 29090 conversion owners manual ...that is, IF you keep it.

Yes, you DO need a holding tank, but that would require a lot plumbing in addition to the tank, which on a boat the size of yours would eat up more than half of your storage space. Replacing the the toilet with a self-contained system—an "MSD" portapotty--makes a lot more sense. The "MSD" designation in the model name/number means it has fittings for a pumpout line and vent line, and is designed to be permanently installed (actually just sturdier brackets than portables, so you could still take it off the boat if you absolutely have to), which means that although it's still called a PORTApotty, you don't have to carry anything off the boat to empty it.

A 5-6 gallon model holds 50-60 flushes...you'd need at least a 30 gal tank to hold that many from any marine toilet. No plumbing needed except a vent line and pumpout hose--so no new holes in the boat...and -0- maintenance needed except for rinsing out the tank--which you can do with a bucket while it's being pumped out. Total cost including the pumpout hose and vent line is about $200--a fraction of what you'd spend for toilet, tank and all the related plumbing needed. And the best part is, you have all the advantages of a toilet and holding tank without giving up a single square foot of storage space.

Check out the Thetford 550P MSD and the Dometic/SeaLand 975MSD Sanipottie. Thetford has discontinued the 550PMSD, but it’s still available from most retailers…the Dometic 975MSD is still in production. They’re comparable, and not much can go wrong with either one, so go with the one you like best.

Defender usually has the best prices on most things and they have both in stock.

Dometic/SeaLand 975 MSD Thetford 550P MSD on Defender

I'll be glad to answer your questions about installation etc.



And btw, if you sell your toilet on Craigs List you can prob'ly get at least half the cost everything you'd need to install a new MSD system for it, especially if it's as brand new as it looks in your photo.


--Peggie
Peggy, I bought a boat with a potapotty years ago. I put a thru hull in the holding tank bottom and plumbed it to macerator and a through hull. Worked well not sure about the legality or not. maybe tiewrapping the switch would do.
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Old 26-07-2019, 11:00   #12
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

A holding tank that can only be dumped to empty it is not legal...it has be capable of being pumped out too 'cuz there's no way to prove that it's never dumped inside the "3 mile limit" and no legal eagle would just take your word for it that it never is.


What you should have done was either add the vent and pumpout fittings to your potty or replace the portable potty with an MSD version that has pumpout and vent fittings, then and put a y-valve in the pumpout line and run a line from it to the macerator pump. Or--assuming you still own the boat--you COULD add the y-valve now and run a line from it to a deck pumpout fitting that you'll prob'ly have to install.


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Old 26-07-2019, 12:36   #13
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

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Originally Posted by peghall View Post
A holding tank that can only be dumped to empty it is not legal...it has be capable of being pumped out too 'cuz there's no way to prove that it's never dumped inside the "3 mile limit" and no legal eagle would just take your word for it that it never is.


What you should have done was either add the vent and pumpout fittings to your potty or replace the portable potty with an MSD version that has pumpout and vent fittings, then and put a y-valve in the pumpout line and run a line from it to the macerator pump. Or--assuming you still own the boat--you COULD add the y-valve now and run a line from it to a deck pumpout fitting that you'll prob'ly have to install.


--Peggie
Thanks Peggy. As I said this was years age probably not to far after just pump i it overboard. I thought it may give the OP an idea. With your input of a Y valve and a deck fitting for pump out it might be legal. I for the life of me can't see how a Y valve and a tiewrap insures someone hasn't discharged inside of 3 miles? Three miles is small distance to sail. PS add a vent or step on the peddle when discharging.
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Old 26-07-2019, 13:45   #14
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

I for the life of me can't see how a Y valve and a tiewrap insures someone hasn't discharged inside of 3 miles?

It doesn't. But it does indicate intent to comply with the law.


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Old 26-07-2019, 15:51   #15
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Re: Jayco macerator, no tank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadence View Post
I for the life of me can't see how a Y valve and a tiewrap insures someone hasn't discharged inside of 3 miles?


I had the same thought when I was helping friends with their setup earlier this year. I ended up phoning around the regulators and got a good description that basically went:

“We don’t want you to make the whole thing locked down, we just want you to show that you can hold black water. THEN, we need you to include clearly printed instructions on board that explain how to put the system in holding mode so that we know that anyone on the boat knows HOW to comply with the rules when needed, even if you are not there.”

Made sense when I thought about it.
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