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Old 16-12-2016, 14:58   #16
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Oh- one more thing: neither the install or operational docs that came with the system give any data on what the pressure should be or how to check refrigerant levels in the system.


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Old 16-12-2016, 16:26   #17
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Hi again . Not a good place to have refer trouble . The last thing you wanted to do was fiddle with refrigerant . First thing I would check would be your codenser cooling system . Blocked passages or none functioning pump . Also anything electronic controlling compressor speeds gives me concern . Your electronics may not be speeding up your compressor or pump for the temperatures your in . Is there a way to confirm compressor speed ? Can your measure the amps your system is drawing less the pump ?
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Old 16-12-2016, 16:29   #18
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Also , how old is the system

Take those gauges off !!! ��
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Old 16-12-2016, 16:36   #19
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

These systems are sealed and crucial balance must be maintained, if you have a leak it would most likely be around the couplers , look for oil traces . Any other leak and you would have nothing left in the system. Gauges introduce air moisture and dirt and also disturb the balance .

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Old 16-12-2016, 16:38   #20
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

The system is an Isotherm 4901 ASU Magnum unit that is the water cooled version and is about 4 years old. Water pump and compressor speeds seem normal. No easy way to isolate the amp draw on the compressor.


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Old 16-12-2016, 16:48   #21
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Do you have a way to measur condenser temperature . The temperature of the tube going towards the evaporator or the high side temperature ? , sporry on my iPhone typing on small key board if I miss a few letters .
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Old 16-12-2016, 18:15   #22
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

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Originally Posted by teneicm View Post
So the symptoms are basically that the system had started to run continuously without bringing down the temperature of the freezer box. There was still some cooling happening as the system was able to maintain about 25 degrees (by running continuously), but wasn't able to get down to the usual 16-18 degrees. With the system not running, after allowing 30 minutes for things to equalize, we hooked a gauge to the single Schrader port and found only 5 psi. Gave the system a couple of shots of 134a and didn't see the pressure go up, but stopped at that point because of concerns of overcharging. Turned the system back on and the compressor draws down the pressure to about 1 psi. The system is now running better, (as in it now cycles on and off, holding a temp around 20 degrees) but am still uncertain if it's over or undercharged at this point. Also wondering why we didn't see the pressure go up at all when we put some more gas in.

The Indel system has a 'smart' controller that varies the compressor (and water pump) speeds depending on battery voltage and temperature. The system is also a holding plate system, so hard to see how much of the plate is getting cooled. Would love to have a competent tech take a look, but we are on the SE end of Guadacanal where most folks barely have clothes, let alone HVAC training. So at this point I'm the most qualified person for miles around (scary thought!).

Any other info that would help?

Thanks for all the replies, Matt


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I'm only gonna tell you this once.Pay attention to every detail. Do this with cold control turned to max.
Make sure your hose (blue Suction) is purged before and while you hook it up add gas (vapour) in short (3 sec) bursts every minute. when suction press is around 8 lbs pressure let it balance itself. You should see suction line frosting after awhile, good.Now vent off vapour from the yellow filling hose watch pressure never let it go below 3 lbs. Vent in 5 second bursts and wait two full minutes and repeat. Watch frosted line closely, it will defrost fast like magic.Don't rush it, it may take 10 to 50 times before the frost on the suction line makes it's move. You know you got it when you got no frost on your suction line and a suction pressure of 4 lbs. Make sure your gauge is calibrated, Put oil in your shrader cap before you put it back on. Don't rush , give it time to balance itself out after every move. Make all moves short. You'll get there and it will be perfectly charged.
That's all you need to know.
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Old 18-12-2016, 00:13   #23
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rorzech View Post
I'm only gonna tell you this once.Pay attention to every detail. Do this with cold control turned to max.
Make sure your hose (blue Suction) is purged before and while you hook it up add gas (vapour) in short (3 sec) bursts every minute. when suction press is around 8 lbs pressure let it balance itself. You should see suction line frosting after awhile, good.Now vent off vapour from the yellow filling hose watch pressure never let it go below 3 lbs. Vent in 5 second bursts and wait two full minutes and repeat. Watch frosted line closely, it will defrost fast like magic.Don't rush it, it may take 10 to 50 times before the frost on the suction line makes it's move. You know you got it when you got no frost on your suction line and a suction pressure of 4 lbs. Make sure your gauge is calibrated, Put oil in your shrader cap before you put it back on. Don't rush , give it time to balance itself out after every move. Make all moves short. You'll get there and it will be perfectly charged.
That's all you need to know.
Good advice, however you should start with a warm evaporator about 70*F,do not hook up or remove gauge with compressor running,after hooking up gauge don't be too concerned about the pressure being a lot higher than the <10 pisg you'll want later.Now run the compressor the pressure should start dropping.Do as Rorzech says,but you need to do this in 15 min. from comp. start, no more. The key indicator is checking the return copper line:coated with white frost means o'charged,cool to the touch is ok. If gauge goes below 2 psig - low charge. Re. oil on schrader cap,be sure it's the oil called for your compressor or risk contamination.
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Old 22-12-2016, 22:35   #24
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Thanks for all the replies and sorry about the lack of response- we've been running around Honiara for he past 4 days trying to complete errands so we can get outta this place (horrible rolly, dirty anchorage). I'll try the gradual bleed off process: based on the frost on the return line, I'm a little bit overcharged.


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Old 23-12-2016, 02:39   #25
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Does the schrader valve get hot or cold? If it does the high pressure side would be hot and low pressure cold.
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Old 23-12-2016, 09:17   #26
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Sorry, did not see all the good posts below.
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Old 23-12-2016, 10:45   #27
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

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Originally Posted by Brewgyver View Post
Run current is NOT an accurate way to assess the state of charge in any refrigeration circuit.
Do not be so categorical, I use run current indication from the very small refrigeration to the very large air conditioning system (in excess of 100A 3 phases 415V). In fact current reading is the best performance indicator of a system.
For Danfoss BD compressors, some one must be able to make sens of the tables provided in the pdf below.

http://www.saltservice.net/files/44446309.pdf
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Old 27-12-2016, 09:30   #28
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Re: Indel refrigerator with Danfoss 50 compressor- How to figure out refrigerant pres

Some great advice on the thread for charging refrigeration. I recently had to remove my fridge due to soaked insulation and I didn't really have the money laying around to build a new one so I improvised by purchasing a chest type top load freezer with the intention of changing out the compressor with my Danfoss 50 set up. Unfortunately, I was unable to find anyone on the small island of Anguilla that knew refrigeration that would help me (Typical for boaties, I know). So I set out getting the fittings together that I would need to make the switch. However, I didn't have a charge and guage set up, and couldn't see buying one for this one time deal.

I purchased a car charging hose and a small can 12 oz of 134a refrigerant. I then cut the car fitting off of the hose and connected it up to a fitting using copper tubing and a hose clamp that would connect to the schrader valve. Yeah yeah.. I know it's not right, but you have to be willing to overcome issues while cruising. So I came onto the forum and behold there was a thread about how to properly charge your refrigeration system.

Big shouts go out to Rorzech who's simple procedure worked like a charm. Also, Capt. Gill who was able to fill in the gaps that allowed me to properly charge my system and allow me to understand the freezing technique on the LP side that worked just as was written, and last to Chala who posted up his chart of working amp draws for the compressor that allowed me to bleed off a bit of gas until the compressor was operating within its design curve. You three helped me out big, and I appreciate it. New freezer / fridge is working wonderfully. I installed a new digital 12v thermostat and have turned a freezer into my new boat fridge.
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