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Old 11-03-2010, 09:14   #16
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Hydrogen Peroxide

We use 25% H2O2 for cleaning some antique ceramics, but it will unfortunately dissolve ceramic paste repair work. It will fizz and emit fumes in contact with some metals and organics.

We use Ozone O3 for disinfecting and de-odorizing. It is relatively safe (observe common sense precautions), and decomposes naturally. I have helped design Ozone systems for bottled water plants, most bottled water is packaged with residual Ozone as an in-the-bottle prophylactic sterilizer, which decomposes before you drink it. I would recommend using it for your water tanks.

I would not recommend using H2O2 without extreme caution. If you do it is better to use more of a low concentration H2O2 than try to mix high concentrations down and risk spills.

Higher concentrations of H2O2 is also used as a component in home made explosives, and purchases may be tracked.
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Old 11-03-2010, 12:01   #17
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Anyone contemplating using ozone in sufficiently high enough concentration to provide adequate disinfection should also know that it will attack all rubber and some synthetic gaskets and most hoses severely.
Advising to not use peroxide because it is a component in some explosives is analogous to saying don't use chlorine because it is a chemical nerve agent.

As with most chemicals, common sense and attention to safety precautions are always a good idea. There is no proverbial magic bullet free of any drawbacks and each (chlorine, ozone and peroxides) all have their limitations or dangers
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Old 11-03-2010, 14:19   #18
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Ozone H2O2

To try to douse the flames...

High concentration H2O2 is not dangerous because it is a component in explosives, but its' purchase may be tracked because it is so. Any questions can easily get a pass on the no harm no foul rule, but why bother when more quantity of a lower concentration is safer to handle and just as effective?

Both H2O2 and O3 are powerful oxidizing agents, which is why they work. Both are preferable to Chlorine (in my opinion). Both will attack similar things such as gaskets and metals for similar reasons at similar rates with similar oxidation potentials.

In my humble (and personal) opinion, Ozone is a better choice for your application, the limited solubility in water will limit end point concentrations. The natural decay will mean that draining after treatment is not required. And if you get your own ozonizer, you can go for minimal treatment, and re-treat as required.

Ozone is commonly used for both municipal and commercial water systems (as is low level Chlorine), but H2O2 is not.
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Old 11-03-2010, 15:22   #19
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Harmonytech,

I'm really interested in your experience with ozone (that's why I love these boards). I had assumed that a ozone generators for water treatment were only commercial scale - guess not.

Would a 500mg/hr unit as you mention be effective for a 120 gallon tank? How long would you run it for that much water? (assuming the water was in reasonably good shape to start). I like the idea of "minimal treatments" as needed. Does chlorine treat anything that the ozone does not?

Thanks

Carl
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Old 24-01-2013, 04:52   #20
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

WE used Peggy Hall's method a couple of years ago and now we need to shock treat our fresh water tanks again. I can't for the life of me remember the quantity of bleach we used, so I went back to this thread. What the heck does 3/4 dl mean in terms of cups?????



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Old 24-01-2013, 05:01   #21
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WE used Peggy Hall's method a couple of years ago and now we need to shock treat our fresh water tanks again. I can't for the life of me remember the quantity of bleach we used, so I went back to this thread. What the heck does 3/4 dl mean in terms of cups?????



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Google is your friend: 3/4 deciliter equals 1/3 cup.
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Old 24-01-2013, 05:55   #22
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

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... What the heck does 3/4 dl mean in terms of cups?????
(3/4) dl = 75 milliliters = 2.5360517 US fluid ounces = 0.317006 US Cup

Or, as daddle suggests, nearly 1/3 of a cup.
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Old 24-01-2013, 09:46   #23
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

Yes I googled and Ok aproximately 1/3 of a cup, but that would mean for my 200 litre water tank 6 cups of bleach or darn near 11/2 liters of bleach. That sounds like a lot of bleach to me...

I'm looking for somebody who has actually used this method and can clarify if that sounds right to them.

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Old 24-01-2013, 10:08   #24
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

my first tank cleaning i used a half gallon ov vinegar in each of my 80 gal tanks. second time i used a half gallon clorox in each tank. i rinsed them out each time and then filled.
the vinegar cleaning lasted much longer than thew clorox cleaning and did not yield rusty water when the tank was opened, as did the clorox treatment did.
i recommend vinegar treatment to clean then fill with filtered water.
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Old 24-01-2013, 14:40   #25
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

Zeehag - That's great news because I prefer the less caustic vinegar to bleach. I appreciate you sharing your experience and am pleasantly surprised to learn that the vinegar treatment lasted much longer than Clorox. I wouldn't have expected that - Excellent News !!
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Old 24-01-2013, 15:09   #26
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

If there is really organic material in the tank, scrubbing with a neutral cleaner is a good first step; the solids and biomass have to be removed. I find a tiolet bowl brush usefull.

Specific to aluminum tanks, ANY caustic, acid, or strong oxidizer will roughen the surface of the aluminum, giving bacteria much better places to grow. Sanitary equipment is generally kept pollished for this reason. So, strong cleaners can be self defeating; they get things clean but generally increase the re-cleaning frequency with repeated use.

Mild cleaners, elbow grease or a power washer, and minimal treatment with H2O2 or other. And filter all water BEFORE it goes in the tank. I have found that if I keep the tank phsically clean, the need for all of this fooling around with cleaners and disinfectectants goes away. Each winter I get the tanks bone dry, rinsing as I go, and that keeps them fresh all summer without any treatments at all.
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Old 24-01-2013, 15:53   #27
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

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Originally Posted by D_e_n_n_i_s View Post
Zeehag - That's great news because I prefer the less caustic vinegar to bleach. I appreciate you sharing your experience and am pleasantly surprised to learn that the vinegar treatment lasted much longer than Clorox. I wouldn't have expected that - Excellent News !!
it does work well. i researched since 1990, when i first moved on board, and found vinegar to really do the trick...i try to keep stuff simple as possible.
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Old 25-01-2013, 09:21   #28
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

Well I do understand the debate over bleach and more natural cleaners. If this was anywhere else on the boat I'd go for vinegar. BUT we liveaboard on the Red Sea where water is not always (in some countries never) potable. When I need to shock treat our tanks, like now, its because they have been contaiminated and then bleach IS the answer. And yes I scrub the tanks clean first. The bleach shock treatment is to also and maybe mainly treat the hoses.

So half a gallon bleach for an 80 gallon tank... well then maybe I am reading that correctly. It just sounds like a lot to me.... and I hate flushing all that bleach into the sea.
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Old 25-01-2013, 09:39   #29
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

i use mexican water--is never potable--even with filtering double....i use vinegar because it works longer and the resulting algae and molds dont immediately grow, as with bleach, which doesnt kill anything but makes ye think it does by bleaching it so isnt as easily seen by naked eyeballs.... goo dluck. i never drink my tank water without boiling --coffee, soups, etc....
vinegar changes the pH so the spores dont grow ..... something to consider....
i used bleach in la cruz, an dfound my stbd tank has mold and brown algae from the bad stuff in the la cruz de huanacaxtle city water, after double filtering....
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Old 25-01-2013, 09:43   #30
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Re: Fresh Water Tank Cleaning

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, as with bleach, which doesnt kill anything but makes ye think it does by bleaching it so isnt as easily seen by naked eyeballs.... ..

that isn't true!
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