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Old 22-09-2016, 09:32   #16
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

The reason I have read the cruisers forum for around eight years now is that I learn a lot. Sailboats are complicated systems and vary greatly from boat to boat. Every now and then I read something and a light comes on and I think 'I should try something similar'. I was unhappy with the refrigeration system on my boat. Two seacocks and a sea strainer were a real pain in the ass. I was in the position that I could dedicate a water tank to switch from sea water to fresh water. It took all of fifteen minutes to do it, and I can switch back in five.

Would air cooling work better? Maybe, but there may be a good reason the system installed used a water coil, probably because the system is in the engine room which can get pretty warm.

So it works much better than the old sea water system, and having the 'luxury' of having another separate 130 gal fresh water tank has allowed me to make the changes.

Am I suggesting that everyone use this system? Of course not but once again the reason I read Cruisers Forum is because I learn a lot from you all, and I thought I would contribute, maybe the light will go on for someone dealing with unique problems like me.

Respectfully, Doug
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Old 22-09-2016, 10:36   #17
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

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Originally Posted by bytownboy View Post
...The freshwater exits the tank at the bottom, circulates thru the coil and is pumped back into the tank thru the top. I use the breather for the tank for the return...
Bad tech to T into the vent line.

And if/when you travel to hot climates you will regret heating your water supply.
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Old 22-09-2016, 12:51   #18
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Your not dumping in much heat at all, on average about what a 30W light bulb would make. The heat dissipates into the environment especially if the tank is in contact with the hull. I'd be surprised if there is a more than 1 or 2 degree change before equilibrium.
But I have never measured it. If I had a water cooled fridge I would do it, I have heard of more than one super cold machine that salt water corroded through ruining the machine
Air cooled if fine 99% of all house heat pumps and refrigerators are air cooled, there would be more water cooled if it were much more efficient


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Years ago when I hauled out in Queensland Australia and I still was using salt water cooling I pulled the hoses off and stuck them into a 5 gallon bucket of fresh water. I did indeed see that the temp went up and after 3-4 hours run time the water was much warmer than when I started. No I never took an exact reading but it still cooled the water and kept the freezer cold.

Point being is you don't need a lot of water especially if the tank side is touching the hull below the waterline. Ours are below the floor boards and lay up against the hull. Point being is don't worry about pulling water out of the fridge tank just don't run out!

I rarely have internet but when we do I try to stop by and catch up on all the great advice and ideas folks discuss on this site.

Not sure what difference it makes if the water gets a few degrees warmer in the tropics.

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Old 22-09-2016, 14:40   #19
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

Thanks chouliha.

The water tank I am using is next to but not touching the hull, and is about one third below the waterline. As it is 85 gallons it does a great job, and in three weeks of cruising its temperature only reached two degrees higher than the diesel tank of the same size right next to it.

As I use my other water tank of 130 gallons for daily consumption the only time I can forsee needing the water would be in a emergency, at which time I would simply switch the fridge cooling back to sea water, a five minute job.
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Old 22-09-2016, 18:09   #20
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

Hi, the Ozefridge AW480 systems are both air and water cooled and can run on either. At system start up the condenser's twin fans only operate. (No water pump) When/ if the condenser inlet temperature reaches 40C then the pump runs and off again when/ if the condenser temperature drops to 35C.
This maintains a controlled condensing temperature regardless of how hot or cold the environment. The condenser temperature can be checked by pressing the down arrow on the digital controller. The condenser is of cupro nickel allowing raw water to be used by why bother? Fresh water recycling does the job without the drama, and as said earlier the amount of heat dissipated via the fresh water tank is minimal. We did trials with a 48 litre SS tank on a 40+C day and the water temp rose less than 2C after a long run refrigerating a large eutectic plate but reverting back to normal water temps shortly after the cycle finished. Water cooling or air and water cooling using recycled fresh can provide a solution when the unit is installed in an enclosed area. Condensing involves disposing of the heat collected from your cabinet therefore if that heat disposal is restricted or limited then the system will fail when you need it most... when it's really HOT.
A good starting point for the layman when offered a system, is to check the condenser size. Bigger is better, you don't want to be stuck with one of those tiny little things that struggle to perform when things get hot... now do ya
Cheers, OzePete from Ozefridge
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Old 22-09-2016, 18:48   #21
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Your not dumping in much heat at all, on average about what a 30W light bulb would make. ...........
If you're not dumping heat, your refrigerator is not getting cold.
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Old 23-09-2016, 06:18   #22
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozefridge Pete View Post
Hi, the Ozefridge AW480 systems are both air and water cooled and can run on either. At system start up the condenser's twin fans only operate. (No water pump) When/ if the condenser inlet temperature reaches 40C then the pump runs and off again when/ if the condenser temperature drops to 35C.
This maintains a controlled condensing temperature regardless of how hot or cold the environment. The condenser temperature can be checked by pressing the down arrow on the digital controller. The condenser is of cupro nickel allowing raw water to be used by why bother? Fresh water recycling does the job without the drama, and as said earlier the amount of heat dissipated via the fresh water tank is minimal. We did trials with a 48 litre SS tank on a 40+C day and the water temp rose less than 2C after a long run refrigerating a large eutectic plate but reverting back to normal water temps shortly after the cycle finished. Water cooling or air and water cooling using recycled fresh can provide a solution when the unit is installed in an enclosed area. Condensing involves disposing of the heat collected from your cabinet therefore if that heat disposal is restricted or limited then the system will fail when you need it most... when it's really HOT.
A good starting point for the layman when offered a system, is to check the condenser size. Bigger is better, you don't want to be stuck with one of those tiny little things that struggle to perform when things get hot... now do ya
Cheers, OzePete from Ozefridge

Is your system a capillary or a TXV system ?

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Old 23-09-2016, 07:05   #23
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

Capillary
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Old 23-09-2016, 07:29   #24
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

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If you're not dumping heat, your refrigerator is not getting cold.
That is correct your removing heat, but as I said it amounts to about a 30W light bulb.
Look at it this way, if your fridge compressor draws 5 amps, that is about 60W.
Assume that every erg of energy goes to heat and you have a 50% duty cycle, that is about 30W continuously.
A single person at rest radiates about 100W for instance

So, I still contend "it's not much heat" so little in fact that I think the water tank will lose that amount of heat about as fast as it absorbs it once the differential gets to about 2 degrees.
It is heat though of course, just not all that much really, another way to look at it is it takes a tremendous amount of energy to heat water, and we are not drawing a tremendous amount of energy with our fridges, so we aren't going to heat much water
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Old 23-09-2016, 08:20   #25
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
That is correct your removing heat, but as I said it amounts to about a 30W light bulb.
Look at it this way, if your fridge compressor draws 5 amps, that is about 60W.
Assume that every erg of energy goes to heat and you have a 50% duty cycle, that is about 30W continuously.
A single person at rest radiates about 100W for instance

So, I still contend "it's not much heat" so little in fact that I think the water tank will lose that amount of heat about as fast as it absorbs it once the differential gets to about 2 degrees.
It is heat though of course, just not all that much really, another way to look at it is it takes a tremendous amount of energy to heat water, and we are not drawing a tremendous amount of energy with our fridges, so we aren't going to heat much water
The heat is going somewhere and that somewhere is into the fresh water the OP has reserved for cooling the refrigerator. It will lose some of that heat through the tank walls and the piping.

Consider this though, The OP is carrying 85 gallons (several hundred pounds) of water just to use as a heat sink. I suspect five or so gallons of water run through a radiator or other liquid to air heat exchanger would work just as well. Or, he could run it through copper pipes fastened to the inside of the hull with a heat transfer compound.

I understand what he is trying to accomplish but I don't think his method is well thought out or very efficient.
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Old 23-09-2016, 08:47   #26
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

I would worry that the pipes in the cooler my have lead in them they were not ment to be drank from
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Old 23-09-2016, 09:03   #27
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

I grew up in a house and I suspect many others did too, that had copper pipes that were all soldered with lead solder. I know that lead pipes may leach significant amounts of lead, But a couple of solder joints?
I think the EPA's lead and copper rule didn't come out until 1991? I know that in the 80's there was lead in the solder cause I remember the new stuff coming out and it didn't solder as well.
I don't use copper anymore though, I'm a died in the wool Pex fan now.
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Old 23-09-2016, 09:05   #28
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

Yeah I wouldn't carry 85 gallons of water (709 lbs) for a heat sink, I'd use it myself.
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Old 23-09-2016, 09:18   #29
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

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Yeah I wouldn't carry 85 gallons of water (709 lbs) for a heat sink, I'd use it myself.
Ditto on that .

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Old 23-09-2016, 09:28   #30
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Re: Fresh Water Cooling For Fridge

I'm in the KISS air cool camp. Why carry 800# of water around just for cooling the fridge? If you're gonna have a pump just use seawater.
If it works for you it works though.
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