Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 09-11-2018, 19:26   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: BC
Boat: O'Day 40
Posts: 497
Espar Hydronic Durability

I have an Espar D5 Hydronic IIe heater supplying heat and hot water for our boat. It has run 3650 hours in the last 22 months or so. From the start it has been less than 100% reliable. The combustion blower failed early on and was replaced under warranty. It has had the occasional failure to start with no fault codes generated, then started up on its own a day, or week, or several weeks later.
We're full time on the boat and love the hydronic heat. The boat stays warm and dry, there are no drafts and hot water is always available.
The water pump has failed now but that may be normal for these types of pumps. It isn't hard to replace.
A local dealer/installer tells me the II series are nothing but trouble and I should replace it with a Series 3. He says he has had no warranty claims on the Series 3 for the past 2 years.
So, I am looking at another boat buck and a half.
So, I look at the online info from Espar, which seems a little lacking. I can't find the installation instructions or manual for this series but I did come across a bit of interesting info. Espar states that the service life of the S3 is 3000 hours. Warranty is 2 years or 2000 hours.

Is this the reality for these heaters? Are they only good for weekend and holiday use?

Anyone had the Planar hydronic long enough to judge their durability?
__________________

__________________
Trying to make new mistakes.
bcboomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2018, 20:23   #2
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Kemah, TX
Boat: 1979 Cape Dory 30 Cutter
Posts: 138
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Use what you have until it no longer works or is no longer safe to use.

The manuals are top secret...but here is the link. https://www.eberspaecher-na.com/down...l-manuals.html
__________________

J.Kitchens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 04:05   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 12,121
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

The point is reducing a high cost per year, not to mention the hassle factor.

Maybe going the China clone route, cheap enough to order plenty of spares in advance?

Haven't seen hydronic units, but the air heaters can go for under $200 on fleabay.

Of course a diesel burning water heater that would actually last for many years would be even better
john61ct is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 09:03   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: BC
Boat: O'Day 40
Posts: 497
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Kitchens
I've gotten past the point where I am willing to have the heater quit when we need heat. Too old for just adding layers and I'm not about to tell the Admiral to just put up with it. (Putting up with me is enough to ask )

John
Exactly. $750 a year, or more, is a bit much never mind the hassle. It's a fair bit of work to change it out as the wiring has changed too.

I guess I should have clued in when I was told that their thermostats will only allow a 1 hour run time but that info and the short service life are not in their marine literature.

I'm sticking with hydronic but air would sure be cheaper. We have heat under the floor where we sit, a heated towel bar in the head and the return lines warm the storage lockers and v-berth so no more dampness.

Maybe the ITR Hurricane is the only one that will last but I would rather put that money towards new sails. Plus it is a lot bulkier.
__________________
Trying to make new mistakes.
bcboomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 14:11   #5
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 15,129
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

" their thermostats will only allow a 1 hour run time "
There must be better choices, since the same basic units are used to heat municipal busses that run 18-24 hours per day, every day.
Maybe looking in the commercial bus/truck/rv market to see what can be adapted would be of use?
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 15:39   #6
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 8,309
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

The heater is designed to run continuously. Perhaps the overheat sensor is failing and shutting the heater down. Or maybe the thermostat is faulty. Also check that the fuel pump will run continuously. The system will run with the overheat sensor bypassed but only do that for a test run and keep a careful watch on the temperature of the unit.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 18:58   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: BC
Boat: O'Day 40
Posts: 497
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

No I don't have any overheat problem and there would be a fault code set if I did. I can watch the functions on my laptop and see the readings from the various sensors.
My concern is that the units have a "service life" of 3000 hours and I'll use that up in a hurry.
I'm replacing the worn out pump and that is probably just a "consumable" but I wonder about the rest of the unit. Is the burner likely to fail soon?
I'm using the ubiquitous Chinese temperature control (Inkbird) that seems to be popular for lots of uses.
I'm using it because I was told by the dealer, and confirmed with Espar, that they do not supply a controller that will run the hydronic units continuously.
I think the continuous running units are air, not hydronic.
I'd be happy if someone can give me an Espar part number for such a control.
There is a "commercial version" of the Hydronic II rated for 5000 hours. It has a reduced output, so I assume the lower output results in longer life.
__________________
Trying to make new mistakes.
bcboomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 20:54   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Kemah, TX
Boat: 1979 Cape Dory 30 Cutter
Posts: 138
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

It looks like the industry standard warranty is 2yrs or 2000hrs.

If I were in your shoes I would consult Sure Marine Services. They appear to be the top installer of marine hydronic systems in the US. They are a Webasto dealer but I'm sure they could help you understand what sort of life you should expect from a system.
J.Kitchens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 11:21   #9
Registered User
 
Macblaze's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Edmonton/PNW
Boat: Hunter 386
Posts: 818
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Interesting thread. While I love my Webasto, it has to be the most unreliable piece of equipment we have on the boat. It works pretty good if we are using it a lot (a couple of hours a day) but is prone to all sorts of errors and failures at the worst times.

I've asked many people over the last couple of years if it was rated for continuous service — we lived aboard one winter but mostly used electric heat and only ran the hydronic heater the aforementioned couple of hours a day when we were off cruising. I got all sort of differing answers, the most ridiculous of which was "its a very expensive piece of equipment...why would you want to wear it out..."

So ya, I would love to a) know what the technical answer to your question is and b) know what others are doing with this "very expensive piece of equipment..."
__________________
---
Gaudeamus igitur iuvenes dum sumus...
Macblaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 11:46   #10
Registered User
 
nwdiver's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Boat: C&C Landfall 38
Posts: 579
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Do yourself a favour and switch over to a hurricane........

Marine Heating Systems – Itrheat

You already have all the tubing in place they need simple maintanace and work for years.....mine is 8 going on 9, 4 as full time livaboard in the PNW....
nwdiver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 12:46   #11
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 8,309
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

There has to be something wrong with the install. Truckers use these same units all the time for years and often in much colder weather. In the real cold weather truckers use the hydronic units as many of the newer trucks don't idle well in cold weather.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 13:09   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 12,121
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

That usage is 95% of their market.

But in high-profit commercial usage, many thousands are spent on service every month, replacing these every few years is small beer.
john61ct is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 13:15   #13
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 8,309
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Check out some of the trucking forums and you will see that most, if any, aren't replaced every few years.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 13:19   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 12,121
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Perhaps with such a smaller living space, and only running during winter rest stops, the **actual** running hours per year is much lower?
john61ct is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 13:20   #15
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 12,121
Re: Espar Hydronic Durability

Or they keep idling the diesel. . .
__________________

john61ct is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Espar Hydronic expansion/overflow tank brianc Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 3 09-07-2016 19:15
Want To Buy: Espar Hydronic D10W transmitterdan Classifieds Archive 3 20-09-2012 20:23
Espar Hydronic Heater Question Strait Shooter Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 6 20-10-2011 10:08
Espar Hydronic Heater Dealer / Consultant ? SvenG Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 8 24-02-2011 06:50
Espar Hydronic L Help Wakadui Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 5 25-11-2010 12:01

Advertise Here


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:39.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.