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Old 11-12-2015, 12:14   #1
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Do you Recommend this Head?

guys,

Im about to install head in my cape dory 28 and I could get this one for free, see picture

what do you think about the design of the pump? Ive heard that it always leaks and thus it stinks all the time! correct?

thanks, tomas
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Old 11-12-2015, 13:53   #2
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Re: do you recomend this head?

That looks like a Raritan PHII, which is a well-regarded head.

The one in the picture does look like it could be leaky and stinky, though…

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Old 11-12-2015, 13:59   #3
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Re: do you recomend this head?

Based on that photo ... no, no, no

Doesn't look like it's been maintained (just look at the seat alone) at all.
When you're done replacing everything, you have an old head for the price of a new one.

There's a reason you can have it for free. I'd just go and buy a new one.
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Old 11-12-2015, 14:00   #4
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Re: do you recomend this head?

I think I would need to get a new pump as the one I have leaks. I did some search and found out that those pumps are very expensive, like 160 US. The rebuild kit is 70 US.

But I could get complete brand new jabsco for 150 US. Wouldnt it be better choice? Or is raritan much better then jabsco in long turn?

Thanks, Tomas
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Old 11-12-2015, 14:15   #5
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Re: do you recomend this head?

The Raritan is a well respected head and likely better than the jabso cheapie. Might be worth the kit cost. You can rebuild it prior to installation and clean the whole thing up with a shower cleaner and hose. Any new head will get dirty stinky eventually anyway.
Having said that, I have put the Jabsco cheapies in a few times. Just for that new head feel, cost, ease and smell.... I also never liked the ergonomics of the Raritan.... the Jabsco is a one handed flip the lever and pump ... the Raritan a bit cumbersome... but it's a small picky thing really.
Seems about one out of three Jabsco's don't pump that well... but that could have been the particular installation too... The Jabsco is a "use it and throw away when it fails" solution in my mind.
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Old 11-12-2015, 14:15   #6
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Re: do you recomend this head?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arecuk View Post
But I could get complete brand new jabsco for 150 US. Wouldnt it be better choice? Or is raritan much better then jabsco in long turn?

Thanks, Tomas
That is a tricky question, and you will get different answers depending on how one defines "better" and "long term", and how it will be installed.

We are quite happy with our cheap Jabsco heads. They are essentially disposable, though. Every 3 years, I undo the 4 screws holding the entire pump assembly on, toss it in the trash and install a new $70 pump assembly. Takes me 3 minutes - no gloves necessary.

In the interim 3 years, the only maintenance that is required is to give it a shot of grease every 6 months. We live on the boat 24/7, so this head gets a lot of use (and occasional abuse ). It does have a good installation with short hose runs, though.

The Raritan is, in all purposes, a better, more robust design and build. However, I suspect even it will need a $70 rebuild kit every 3 years.

Having rebuilt lots of heads of different types, I can say categorically that simply swapping out an entire pump assembly is FAR easier and much less messy than rebuilding a pump with individual parts.

And for some strange reason, the entire Jabsco pump assembly is less expensive than the rebuild kit containing the individual parts.

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Old 11-12-2015, 15:58   #7
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Re: do you recomend this head?

That is a VERY old, VERY neglected Raritan PHII...any toilet in that condition is almost certain to leak and stink! I would not install it 'cuz it'll cost you more to get into even marginal working order again than a brand new pump and base assembly.

The PHII and its predecessor the PH have been the top rated manual toilet for several decades. With just minimal maintenance--keep it well lubricated, replace the joker valve annually and rebuild every 5-6 years, it will easily provide at least 20 years of reliable trouble-free service. Yes, it does cost at least double the price of a Jabsco, but in 10 years you'll spend more replacing Jabsco pumps (nobody rebuilds 'em because the kit costs about 85% of the price of a new pump) than you'll pay for a new PHII pump and base assembly. Plus, the PHII is a far more efficient toilet than other manual toilets...because the diameter of the piston of the PHII is 2.5" vs 1.75" of most other manual toilets. it pumps twice as much per stroke. Adding the lever-type handle, there isn't as much actual effort required you only have to pump half as many times to flush it.

The PHC is the compact version of the PHII...it uses the same pump, but it's on a compact base and has a shorter handle to fit in a tighter space. It also costs less than the full size PHII.

About the only part of the worn out disaster you're asking about that's worth keeping is the bowl. You can buy just the PHC base and pump for about $100 USD more than a complete Jabsco (you'd also have to replace the seat and lid unless you just happen to like pink)...and reusing the bowl will save you quite a bit in shipping 'cuz bowls are HEAVY! I strongly recommend that do that 'cuz you will be a LOT happier with it any other toilet. And you'll only spend money for a toilet ONCE.

(For the record, I am not associated with R
aritan in any way...my opinions are my own, based on 25 years of experience with every toilet made.)

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Old 11-12-2015, 16:38   #8
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Re: do you recomend this head?

If the plastic parts are okay, not cracked or other wise compromised, a rebuild kit should put it back in working condition. Won't ever look pretty but should function just fine. If the major parts are compromised, replacing them can get spendy in a big hurry. Need to replace the pump housing or other large parts and you'd probably be smart to buy a new PHII and keep this one for parts.

The PHII is the best head at a reasonable price on the market. Had one for three years of cruising and live aboard and it functioned without a problem. After three years of daily use, stuck in a rebuild kit for the hell of it and it was still working fine 10 years after of less intense use when we sold the boat
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Old 11-12-2015, 17:14   #9
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Re: do you recomend this head?

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Originally Posted by peghall View Post
Jabsco pumps (nobody rebuilds 'em because the kit costs about 85% of the price of a new pump)
Actually, in shopping around, I find that the pump is generally 85% of the price of the kit. Strange, but it makes my life easier and less expensive.

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Old 11-12-2015, 17:19   #10
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Re: do you recomend this head?

I have never seen a head look that bad. How could someone have **** into something that gross? I can only imagine it not working and having to clean it out by hand.
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Old 11-12-2015, 20:25   #11
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Re: do you recomend this head?

If the plastic parts are okay, not cracked or other wise compromised, a rebuild kit should put it back in working condition.

Not likely because there are a couple of wearable parts--and God knows that toilet has seen a LOT of wear!--that aren't in the kit...and they aren't cheap!

Everything has a lifespan and IMO it's time to give that toilet a decent burial!
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Old 12-12-2015, 04:10   #12
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Re: do you recomend this head?

If you have the space, what do you think of the Sealand Traveler Toilet? We do it on downeast boats and works out well...

Sealand Traveler Toilet and Sanitation System
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:10   #13
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Re: do you recomend this head?

I love the SeaLand Traveler...it's essentially just a glorified MSD portapotty ("MSD" versions are designed to be permanently installed and are fitted to be plumbed for pumpout), but with a real china bowl that's fed by onboard pressurized fresh water (it's designed to be connected to the potable water plumbing, so it is safe to do so), so it doesn't look like a portapotty.. It needs so little water that the 9 gal tank holds more flushes than a 40 gallon tank connected to any manual or electric marine toilet.

Only two downsides to it: 1. it can ONLY be installed to use pressurized flush water....not practical if it's necessary to conserve fresh water. An intake pump COULD be jury rigged to work, but that would increase the amount of flush water enough to make the 9 gallon tank too small to be useful. 2. The tank footprint is 20" x 20"...too big to fit in most head compartments. If neither of those is a deal breaker, I'd seriously consider this one.
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:25   #14
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Re: Do you Recommend this Head?

Personally I would through that piece of junk overboard & install a Natures Head compost toilet.No hoses,no tanks,no smell. Its all good.
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:34   #15
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Re: Do you Recommend this Head?

rebuild it and live happily for looong time, just like looove.....
until someone flushes papertowels down the damn thing or toiletpaper. that is what the bag beside toilet is for--paper.
papier mache is what flushing toilet paper will get ye--in the hoses. really fun to deal with. NOT.

i wish mine were this kind pictured. is a good one.
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