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Old 31-01-2010, 19:38   #16
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Please do your conversions and let us all know how it came out. one can cruise with little or no smell. lt is simple maintainence. Are you going places or just leaving the dock?
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Old 31-01-2010, 20:27   #17
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Awesome to see all these replies, the engine we are upgrading is a 7hp Volvo so we don't require a huge amount of power. Also we are not adverse to having a petrol or diesel generator as they can be located in the aft locker and not in the main cabin.

Keep the ideas flowing

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Old 31-01-2010, 20:29   #18
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More info

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Originally Posted by S/V Antares View Post
Please do your conversions and let us all know how it came out. one can cruise with little or no smell. lt is simple maintainence. Are you going places or just leaving the dock?
The main issue regarding smell is the engine is a 1965 motor. and parts are almost impossible to get now, the injector pump leaks and a cannot buy new seals. rather than buying a new diesel engine im looking onto electric.

so that gives you some background into why we are looking
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Old 01-02-2010, 03:05   #19
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I recently looked into the hybrid technology now offerred by Fischer Panda and found it interesting - see Electric Drive Systems and Hybrid Drive Systems | Fischer Panda
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Old 01-02-2010, 04:02   #20
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Hi Dame n Jess ,

I've recently converted my boat from having an Atomic 4 to an electric motor and I think it's awesome. Yes you are restricted on range, but as long as you have patience and plan ahead that shouldn't be an issue. Although its near silent running is nice the best part I like is the control you have in tight areas. I can cruise up a narrow channel drawing only one amp, and quietly slide into my slide. I also really enjoyed the first time when I looked down at my battery monitor when under sail and saw that my batteries were being charged at almost 2amps. I was quite stoked.

Can't say enough about the motor. Bought it from Electric Yacht. Fantastic customer support. Really easy installation. The hardest part was trying to install the batteries, I have 8 trojan T-105's.

If you have any questions, will be glad to try to help.
hank
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Old 01-02-2010, 06:15   #21
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Hank,

What would you estimate your range is under typical conditions (like motoring at 4 knots with a 10 knot headwind)?
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Old 01-02-2010, 06:29   #22
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If your intention is to mostly use solar/wind/regen and only have a generator for back-up, you might consider converting a gasoline generator to propane (assuming you already have propane aboard, you would likely only have to add a tank for your needs). No strong smells and the engine remains clean; no stagnant fuel in the carb/injection system also reduces starting problems. There are a number of companies that sell conversion kits ordo conversions, just Google them.

For researching electric conversions check these sites:
Torqeedo Electric Outboard Motors - Green Boat Supply
Buy Electric Outboard Motors
SolidNav :: Alternative to Diesel Engine - Electric Sail Boat
PartsPage
L.M.C. Manufacturers of Permanent Magnet DC Motors - Lynch Motor Company Ltd
http://www.sillette.co.uk/elect_saildrives.pdf
http://www.etvmotors.com/
Fuzion Electric Outboards
Etek Electric Outboard Motor
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Old 01-02-2010, 08:12   #23
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Hank,

What would you estimate your range is under typical conditions (like motoring at 4 knots with a 10 knot headwind)?
I believe I could get around 20-25 Nautical Miles range at this speed. Just a really rough guess though. I've never discharged the batteries more then 10%.
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Old 01-02-2010, 10:24   #24
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I'd take a serious look at Hank's solution (or something similiar). If you can do the installation yourself using the existing prop and shaft, you will save a tremendous amount of money. This system has regeneration which is very "green". Once your boat gets close to hull speed - and a 28ft boat does that pretty fast - the extra wind energy just gets thrown away. Water power can provide MUCH more energy than any amount of wind or solar that you could fit on your boat. It also gives you an excuse to sail more often ("Dear, lovely wind today - those batteries need a charge")

I'd look at using the new Oddyssey AGM batteries from Enersys. These are more tolerant of deep discharge (400 80% discharges) so you can get by with fewer batteries. The total battery cost won't be much different than a larger number of lead acid batteries and you'll save weight and space. You can also recharge them very quickly if you have a big charger. Nigel Calder is using them in his electric/hybrid test boat.

If the range Hank sees works for you 90%+ of the time, then I'd carry a portable 2000 watt Honda generator and five gallons of petrol in a smell-proof overboard vented locker for peace of mind. The Honda could drive the electric motor right through the inverter if the batteries are dead. I bet your biggest problem will be remembering to replace the petrol when it gets old from lack of use.

Carl
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Old 01-02-2010, 11:48   #25
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+1 for propane.

Given your approach, I will second Loadsman's suggestion for backup being a propane generator. Mine is super clean and odor free. An extra 20 or 40 lb tank could give recharge time and you can share between the stove and generator.

Be sure it has an alternative, if you choose electric start.
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Old 01-02-2010, 14:48   #26
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Hanks Setup

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankthelank View Post
Hi Dame n Jess ,

I've recently converted my boat from having an Atomic 4 to an electric motor and I think it's awesome. Yes you are restricted on range, but as long as you have patience and plan ahead that shouldn't be an issue. Although its near silent running is nice the best part I like is the control you have in tight areas. I can cruise up a narrow channel drawing only one amp, and quietly slide into my slide. I also really enjoyed the first time when I looked down at my battery monitor when under sail and saw that my batteries were being charged at almost 2amps. I was quite stoked.

Can't say enough about the motor. Bought it from Electric Yacht. Fantastic customer support. Really easy installation. The hardest part was trying to install the batteries, I have 8 trojan T-105's.

If you have any questions, will be glad to try to help.
hank
Its awesome to get the feedback from a convert. can you tell me a bit about your boat ie; weight hull shape keel type width, length, and a link to the engine reseller you brought from (or the type of engine).

The batteries we are looking to use are below;
Golf Cart Buggy Trojan Battery Batteries 6-volt 210 Ah - eBay Batteries, Batteries, Chargers, Accessories, Electronics. (end time 11-Feb-10 09:06:50 AEDST)

And i haven't decided on the final number yet (room will have a say in it) but i am aiming for 8-12, i have room under the cockpit sole which should hold two rows of 6 batteries.

How did you find the motor (regarding size) did it take up most of your old engine box? what size engine did you replace?

I'm sure more questions will follow

Damien
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Old 01-02-2010, 15:02   #27
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Damien, I would suggest finding a motor and controller before choosing a number of batteries. Some common voltages are 48, 72, and 120V. It will take a different number of batteries to get to the desired voltage and you can choose different batteries to get to the desired Ah rating. You definitely need to make sure that the battery requirements are feasible but it is much easier to put a bunch of batteries in series than to select a motor and controller.

If you are replacing a 7hp engine, you may find that a motor that has a duty rating of 5kw is large enough for you. Be aware that motors are not tolerant of being overheated and if you undersize it, it will come apart in a hurry. You are likely to find that the motor is between 7 and 11" in diameter and between 6" and 18" long not including the shaft. They tend to be much smaller than the engines they replace. The controller is likely to be less than 1 cubic foot. As you already know, the volume is in the batteries. The higher the voltage, the smaller the components will be. Higher voltage means less current for the same amount of power and less current means less heat(remember P=I^2R).
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Old 01-02-2010, 17:07   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dame.n.Jess View Post
Its awesome to get the feedback from a convert. can you tell me a bit about your boat ie; weight hull shape keel type width, length, and a link to the engine reseller you brought from (or the type of engine).

The batteries we are looking to use are below;
Golf Cart Buggy Trojan Battery Batteries 6-volt 210 Ah - eBay Batteries, Batteries, Chargers, Accessories, Electronics. (end time 11-Feb-10 09:06:50 AEDST)

And i haven't decided on the final number yet (room will have a say in it) but i am aiming for 8-12, i have room under the cockpit sole which should hold two rows of 6 batteries.

How did you find the motor (regarding size) did it take up most of your old engine box? what size engine did you replace?

I'm sure more questions will follow

Damien
My previous engine was an Atomic 4 rated somewhere around 25hp. The motor I installed is rated at 5 hp. unless you are going head on into a significant chop or winds, it has enough power.

My boat is an 8.7 Columbia. 29ft approx LOA, 8500lbs displacement. I have all my batteries mounted inside my engine compartment. It was a headache, but eventually squeezed them all in. Going with T-105's is a good idea I believe. Much lighter then 12v. However I would suggest if where you put the batteries is not the easiest to reach, then go with AGM's. Good bit more expensive but with proper charging, these batteries should be good for 7 or more years.

Sizing the motor was done by talking with the supplier. Electric Yacht - Electric sailboat propulsion systems that are cost-effective, yet CLEAN, GREEN and QUIET!.

the motor I have bought is spec'd for boats ranging up to 35 feet i believe. However larger motors are available. My motor runs of of 36v or 48v depending on the power I need. The larger motors can run of 72v or 48v i believe.

Make the conversion, you won't regret it. No fuel smell is a great thing.

Ed
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Old 01-02-2010, 17:48   #29
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One thing to remember is that adding 8-12 batteries is going to affect the fore and aft trim. You may find that putting them all under the cockpit will make your stern sit way low. 8 batteries is approx 480 lbs give or take. 12 is 720 lbs. (based on the 12v auto batteries we used in the Acura) All that in one area will most assuredly make your trim go wonky. Even if you use lighter batteries, its still a heck of a good weight being added. You will save some by removing the engine, exhaust and fuel systems but the motor, coupling and battery racks also need to be factored in besides the batteries. Figure on spreading the batteries out unless you have the ability to shift keel ballast. My old boat is trimmed with lead in cans, so I can shift some of it around but not enough to balance out an additional 4-500 lbs aft of amidships


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Old 01-02-2010, 22:08   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabreKai View Post
One thing to remember is that adding 8-12 batteries is going to affect the fore and aft trim. You may find that putting them all under the cockpit will make your stern sit way low. 8 batteries is approx 480 lbs give or take. 12 is 720 lbs. (based on the 12v auto batteries we used in the Acura) All that in one area will most assuredly make your trim go wonky. Even if you use lighter batteries, its still a heck of a good weight being added. You will save some by removing the engine, exhaust and fuel systems but the motor, coupling and battery racks also need to be factored in besides the batteries. Figure on spreading the batteries out unless you have the ability to shift keel ballast. My old boat is trimmed with lead in cans, so I can shift some of it around but not enough to balance out an additional 4-500 lbs aft of amidships


Sabre
I agree, currently the fuel tank is attached to the transom and weights 44kgs (approx 100Lbs) so although the batteries will weight more they will be further forward. also the engine is old tech and fairly heavy, i do hope to be able to locate a number of batteries in the engine box. but as i'm still only guessing with dimensions for the motor i'm not sure how many will fit there. Also a factor for wanting them under the cockpit is the ability to lift to cockpit floor for battery maintenance (when i convert it to lift).
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