Value of a USCG Captain's License?

[IslandHopper]

Originally Posted by CaptRory

It is excellent training and will make you a better sailor.

It makes it possible to accept money on a casual basis. I've had people (tourists) walking the dock, stop and admire my boat....and offer up a substantial offer for a day on the water.

Your friends may up front pitch in for a passage vacation with is technically illegal without a license.

And...if anything happens and you end up before a board of inquiry you will be held to a higher bar. Worth considering.

I'm not sure of the regulations in SW Florida, and I may have misconstrued your post, but where I am you cannot take any paying passengers on your own vessel unless said vessel is surveyed and registered for such purposes, no matter what licence you may or may not hold.

Taking a bunch of mates out for the day and splitting the costs is fine, but having a group of tourists come along and pay you for taking them out is a big no no unless the vessel is surveyed for commercial use, just having a licence doesn’t mean your vessel qualifies for such activities.

Apologies if I misinterpreted your post…..

[Deltasailor]

Originally Posted by Mrfish

Are you saying that if I plan a charter in the Caribbean or the Med that I can't have my friends pitch in for the price of the charter because I am not a licensed Captain?

If you want to charter the charter company will find you a qualification! All you need is the check to pay the charter fee. I know this is wrong, a well known owner of a very large charter fleet told me one day, "we have taught more people to sail than any one else" I think his company also frightened the shxt out of many people who will never sail again. All with forged qualifications! All he wanted was the dosh!

[capngeo]

I had 500t Oceans, used it and made money, quit the water and got a land job. Downgraded to 100tNC (yes you can do that and save a pile) renewed 2x more without working the ticket other than a few deliveries. Didn't bother renewal on re-up #6. Oddly enough, got a chance to do a delivery, and the underwriter had no prob with "retired " credentials! Without pax, active license isn't required.

I'll never renew my creds

[CSY Man]

.

I don't understand the comment about not having sea time; AFAIK sea time is a requirement. My point is that sea time with only oneself to learn from is rather limited in value.

Greg

Guess I was not clear:
I was talking about renewal, not initial.
Read the previous post again, then my response.

If $100 per year is expensive to maintain a ticket, while saving $500 per year in insurance and making $500 per day doing charters, then you should find a new CPA.

[CSY Man]

. Small boat licenses appear to be totally different, however I doubt one could sail as on OS with one

Yes, you can sail as an OS with a small boat license.
720 days of sea time is required for the 100 ton Master ticket and you have to document every day with a Captain's signature and more.
(Got my first USCG ticket in 1985, a 6-pack. Not hard, not easy, just so-so.)
I let that one expire due to stupidity, then had to start all over and get a 50 ton 15 years later: Much more involved, more Documentation, more everything.
Took me months to get the sea time together, sending letters, asking for endorsements etc. (I was an ex Merchant Marine, plenty of sea time, but not recent)

My comment above was about renewal, not initial.
The initial is not easy, but a lot less than work than a 500 or 1600 ton.

Despite the pain in the rear, I still recommend getting a ticket, your learn stuff, you gain confidence as you know what is going on in a busy Port at night with various light and horn signals going on and you can make income while out cruising.
I see no negatives in going to school and getting certified.

[bsurvey]

there is no value to it if you are not going to use it for work.


no one is impressed that you have a bus drivers license?


what it will get you is federal time in jail because you have a federal license you are under control of the USCG, spill a little oil and see what happens.


better to be a private citizen, the USCG has to turn you over to the local cops

[nautical62]

I documented the hours, and read a prep book, but never took a course or the test. My insurance company provides a discount for having any certification, but the captain's license provides no more discount than a basic power squadron certificate. Since I have no desire to take anyone out for pay in waters requiring a captain's license, I saw no point in spending the time and money to obtain the license.

I did get ASA certified as a sailing instructor through bareboat and for me that's been much more useful.

[CSY Man]

. My insurance company provides a discount for having any certification, but the captain's license provides no more discount than a basic power squadron certificate.

I would shop around and find a different insurance company.
My policy requires a License, hence it is cheaper than other policies.

[CSY Man]

. I'm not sure of the regulations in SW Florida, and I may have misconstrued your post, but where I am you cannot take any paying passengers on your own vessel unless said vessel is surveyed and registered for such purposes, no matter what licence you may or may not hold.

The boat needs to be equipped for commercial charters, but not surveyed or inspected if limited to 6 pax or less.
Type 1 commercial type life jackets with automatic strobe lights are required with other stuff such as check lists and a ring for a type 4 PDF, etc.
Also random drug and alcohol program for the Captain and crew, alcohol tester onboard and more.
More than 6 pax and you need an inspection and stuff like fuel shut-off valves and what not.
I have been doing charters since last fall. Asked the USCG to come to my boat for a volunteer inspection and to get my OUPV sticker. They grilled me on stuff and inspected the boat and equipment.
Fairly easy process.
Then you can hang out a shingle and take random tourists for cruises.

[BandB]

Wifey B: Sometimes you do things for yourself, not for money, not for recognition. Don't say there's no value. Yes, there is always value in learning. I admire mom's who raise their kids and go back to college because they dropped out 25 years ago and it will make them feel better to complete it. I admire professional athletes who go back to college because they promised their mom they would get a degree one day. I admire those who take courses never to get any degree, but just to do it. I'm a well educated teacher, but I wanted to be an educated boat captain and that is the only reason I've become a captain. The license is to me much like a certificate saying I've done it. Nothing I have to show others, but it makes me feel good. I've learned so much in doing so. However, I've done it all just for me. I like doing things for me.

[CSY Man]

Originally Posted by BandB

Wifey B: Sometimes you do things for yourself, not for money, not for recognition. Don't say there's no value. Yes, there is always value in learning. I admire mom's who raise their kids and go back to college because they dropped out 25 years ago and it will make them feel better to complete it. I admire professional athletes who go back to college because they promised their mom they would get a degree one day. I admire those who take courses never to get any degree, but just to do it. I'm a well educated teacher, but I wanted to be an educated boat captain and that is the only reason I've become a captain. The license is to me much like a certificate saying I've done it. Nothing I have to show others, but it makes me feel good. I've learned so much in doing so. However, I've done it all just for me. I like doing things for me.

Well spoken, and I agree.
You can never know too much and sitting the exam for a license may force you to study. (It worked for me)
I also did it for myself, never got a hat or a t-shirt saying Captain, or a cap with scrambled eggs, also called chicken sh..
Besides my wife is the Admiral and she is the one who must be obeyed.

[Uricanejack]

Originally Posted by Captsteve53

For Information in many countries and all of European waters if you wish to hire or use a pleasure type charter vessel you must hold a suitable license, in many cases authorities are also asking what ticket you hold even in private use, (these cases seem to be a way of harassment/bribes more than any thing else!) but it's coming,

The RYA seems to be the official UK and European body issuing the credit card sized boat license in varying categories,

Many international insurance companies are now also asking for a minimum ticket such as boat master/yacht master etc before issuing a policy, as for being a waste of time I personally dont think as I regularly run across individuals that dont even the rules of the road let alone basic navigation or what the various marks mean on a chart, let alone international Cardinal Marks or that the US is one of the few countries that has it's Port and Starboard channel markers the wrong way around, (),(System A).

I was recently called to investigate a yacht on the rocks which didn't under stand the Port and Starboard channel marks and ran aground, telling me in the US where he sails the lights are (RED RIGHT RETURNING)(System A) includes Japan/Philippines/Korea.Well not in HK!! green to green red to red all is good go ahead (on Returning!)(System B)the rest of the world,perhaps if he had studied for a boat license he would have it correct!!, another claim was a yacht damaged trying to go between a seismic ship and her tail buoys over 200 meters long at night(actually 10 kilometers between ship and tail buoys), again well correctly lighted but the skipper had no idea what the three white lights on the mast meant? All of the above situations are covered in a license ,

Cheers Steve (IIMS surveyor-Lloyd's Accredited)

Please explain system A and system B again
I'must have been doing it wrong for 40 years

[Uricanejack]

Originally Posted by BandB

Wifey B: Sometimes you do things for yourself, not for money, not for recognition. Don't say there's no value. Yes, there is always value in learning. I admire mom's who raise their kids and go back to college because they dropped out 25 years ago and it will make them feel better to complete it. I admire professional athletes who go back to college because they promised their mom they would get a degree one day. I admire those who take courses never to get any degree, but just to do it. I'm a well educated teacher, but I wanted to be an educated boat captain and that is the only reason I've become a captain. The license is to me much like a certificate saying I've done it. Nothing I have to show others, but it makes me feel good. I've learned so much in doing so. However, I've done it all just for me. I like doing things for me.

Tiis perhaps the best reason of all and the greatest value

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by CaptRory

Your friends may up front pitch in for a passage vacation with is technically illegal without a license.

If it's friends and you are just sharing expenses (OP said he wasn't in it for profit), the USCG doesn't consider this a commercial operation. In other countries it might be different but since we are talking USCG license...

Now I have heard people trying to skirt the rule by claiming they met their "Friends" thru the internet and these new "Friends" decided to chip in a week later. I suspect if there is an incident, these "Friends" will throw you under the bus and make it clear it was a paid charter.

As far as people saying they learned a lot...you can take the classes without paying for the license and maintaining it. Better to spend the testing and annual dues on more classes to actually learn more.

Checked on the insurance discount and it wasn't any different than the 15yr old power squadron course discount.

If you aren't going to do commercial work, no real value.

[CSY Man]

. Better to spend the testing and annual dues on more classes to actually learn more.

Last time I checked the test was included with the class and there are no annual dues.

As for insurance, looks like every insurance company have different rules.
Boat US wants $3,000+ to insurance my boat, Charter Lakes for the same coverage charges $1,944 but a license is required for the policy.
The license is good for 5 years before renewal, savings on insurance $5,280.
I was hired once to look after and run a big boat for a month for $5,000 cash, paid in advance. (Not a commercial operation, but the owner's insurance company required a licensed Captain onboard)

Some people may not want to get a license, fine, but to say it has not value may not be entirely correct.