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Old 04-09-2010, 04:07   #1
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RYA Courses for Charter or Own Boat in EU or Australia

I have seen comments around the place about some countries requiring some level of licensing to sail in their waters. So I am thinking of doing a RYA course or two so that I have the right licensing, but I am not sure what is the minimum level I need. I'm not sure if the day skipper is enough or whether I will need coastal skipper and also don't know how important the tidal v non-tidal is.

I'm mostly thinking of sailing here in Sweden on own boat (eventually perhaps), Greece, Croatia and Turkey either on charter or own boat. I guess if I have my own boat in the med, I would need the paperwork to keep the other EU states happy. Eventually I will be back home in Melbourne, Australia and as a barest minimum I will have my fathers 40ft yacht to play with.

I know the Sweden is easy a currently there is no licence required for yachts under 12m, so I just need a VHF licence for here.

I am aware the some charter companies are relaxed about qualifications if they see you can handle it but I want the paperwork for the companies that want it.

What do I need?

One thing I noticed with the courses, they say that you need a minimum number of hours to get the certificate and the courses give you half the hours. How the hell do you prove you have the necessary hours?

I have hundreds of hours as crew, one overnight race, dozens of hours as skipper and even navigated in the pre-gps days island hopping across Bass Straight. Admittedly with the exception of 3 days sailing in January the rest of my experience was from 23+ years ago.
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Old 04-09-2010, 13:18   #2
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Hi Hoppy (should that be Skippy?)

It just so happens, that I am going throught the exact same exercise as you. I grew up in Tasmania and sailed my whole life there, there is no 'official' certification as such for sailing vessels. The only requirement is when it is a powered vessel greater than 7kW. When I was there last, I heard murmurs that they are thinking of bringing it in, and of course, the RYA is at the top of the list.

I have decided to bite the bullet and do the Day Skipper (DS) Theory and the later the DS practical. I have purchased study aids from the RYA, books, cd's etc. For me it is a good way to review information that I have not used in a long time, and also it provides a structured way to study or review the way they want it done.

It is necessary to pass the Theory by a certified RYA training school before you can do the practical. As for the logged miles, I have been informed that you can enter all your experience in a log book, and these may be recognised for doing the practical. You cannot do the practical until you have accrued the necessary miles and number of watches etc. I guess is more that they can see how you handle the yacht in close quarters, MOB drills etc.

The Tidal thing seems to be oriented at England, as they do have some nasty tidal streams and height differences. So a knowledge of this is a must for these waters. You can do the non-tidal version, but if you wish to go further, this is a must. I will go straight to Tidal version.

After the DS is passed, then you have the DS Coastal. This has now changed to Yachtmaster Coastal. After that, you have YM Offshore and YM Ocean.

To the EU thing. The RYA certification is not recognised by the Authorities in Germany, Switzerland and Austria if you are resident of one of these countries. If I want to go sailing here on Lake Constance, I need to sit the exam in German (and believe me, there is zero similarity in the nautical terms e.g. Jib = Fock). Then I need to do a practical for an arm an a leg. So, I am going to skip the whole sailing thing here, as I will charter elswhere anyway (Adriatic). Incidentally, the RYA certification is accepted by charter companies on the Adriatic.

The other thing you can do, is joing www.crewseekers.net or www.findacrew.net where there are many people private and otherwise, looking for crew members to do certain leg (short or long) where they need a helping hand. Just watch for the costs that are requested as 'contributions'...some of them seem to be using others to finance their kitty.

I hope that this has been of some help to you, and if you need more info just pm me.

Cheers,

Bloke
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Old 04-09-2010, 14:23   #3
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Hi Tassiebloke,

My last name is Hopkins, so I will stick with Hoppy

I'm not surprised that the Germanic countries make it difficult and costly to sail. I am however still surprised that there is not yet a licensing system here in Sweden. Here I need a licence to play golf but I did not need anything to be able to drive my old Searay at 45 knots. Strangely in the two seasons with my Searay, I saw more police and coast guard manning speed traps than I had seen in 10 years driving on the roads.

How are you doing the DS theory from Switzerland? can you do the exam remotely or are you planning to visit the UK?

I should pull my finger out an order the theory books and get into that. I've been putting off the idea of formal training for about a year and have been more focusing on what boat, how much I can afford, where I want it and how or if I should eventually import it into Australia.

I've only started looking into the training again because I need a break from work and Sweden and have been thinking it would be a nice to do the DS in Thailand or BVI. Generally I've been taking the "she'll be right mate" attitude and figured I buy the boat first and then hire a delivery skipper (if the boat is not where I want it) or an instructor to help teach my friends how to crew and to remind me of how much I may have forgotten and how naive I am about buying a boat after 25 years on the hard stuff.
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Old 05-09-2010, 15:38   #4
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day skipper is a good ticket and is the highest ticket in the rya that a school can award without an external rya examiner so you tend to find plenty see the rya website for schools.

dave
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Old 06-09-2010, 14:29   #5
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Hi Hoppy,

I have gone with the self study method. I seriously looked into the online courses, however as I travel a lot to Asia, I wanted to be able to use the time flying (12-13hrs, then change and another 3-5hrs), so I have saved everything locally on my PC, and I dont need to be connected to the Internet.

Once I am confident enough of the theory, I will go and do a smaller version of the so called ' zero to hero' course (that is from null to YM Ocean) but only to Day Skipper level. I have not decieed where, but depending on the timing, I might end up going south in the Winter to do it. Some options are Gibraltar or the Canaries.

Dave is right about the ticket for DS, as anything above then need to have an external examiner to certify.

You mention about the non-licence status in SK, how is it when you venture into the German waters of the Baltic? Would love to sail on the Baltic, have a friend in Malmö and can use his beach house in Höllviken...just need to find an old HR, Najad or Malö.

Cheers,

Bloke
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Old 07-09-2010, 10:55   #6
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Hi Bloke,

I've started making inquiries about the DS course with Sunsail as they have an RYA school in Phuket. It looks like they only do the courses until October, so if I do it, it will happen very soon or perhaps not until next spring. I guess I better get into the self study stuff very quickly.

That is an interesting questions about Germany and Swedish sailors. I can't imagine the German coast guard or police would be be making an issue about it if you are on a Swedish registered boat. I think that if it was an issue, then I don't think that the Swedish politicians would have been umming and arhhhing so much about introducing a boat licence like they have been. Then again there are only votes to be lost by introducing a licence here.
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Old 07-09-2010, 13:07   #7
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Originally Posted by hoppy View Post
I am aware the some charter companies are relaxed about qualifications if they see you can handle it but I want the paperwork for the companies that want it.

What do I need?
Ask the charter companies.

RYA papers are widely recognized and so are their US equivalents. I cannot recommend ISSA as my friend has been refused charter in the Med. Genuine national (French, German, Dutch, Spanish, Italian, etc.) papers are recognized in the Med.

I think you will want to have the paper that corresponds with the area and difficulty of the charter - tidal, offshore, etc. Except there are not very many offshore charter companies that offer bare boat.

IMHO, as long as you have the skills, and while you are in your own boat, all you need is the boat registration, your ID and the license as required by your (boat's registration) country regulations.

b.
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Old 08-09-2010, 07:53   #8
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Once I am confident enough of the theory, I will go and do a smaller version of the so called ' zero to hero' course (that is from null to YM Ocean) but only to Day Skipper level.
There no zero to hero DS course, as there is no need, it can be done in typically 5 days or two weekends, or even shorter in some cases. The zero to hero courses are for YM Offshore ( not Ocean) and is becuase of the mile building needed.


Quote:
RYA papers are widely recognized and so are their US equivalents.
I have both and I can say that the US certs are not widely recognised nor understoofd in most parts of Europe.

Dave
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Old 13-09-2010, 17:03   #9
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I now have so potential dates with Sunsail out of Phuket & BVI for the Day skipper course. They are in the next month or two, so I need to get up to speed with the day skipper theory course. Maybe I will plan a week relaxing around a pool doing the sailing.

I just hope they accept my logs rebuilt from memories of 20-25 years ago. At least I have days this year.

Any suggestions on schools where to arrange a the Day Skipper theory course buy distance.

I found one potential site from the RYA search http://tm-i.co.uk/store/store.php?pg1-cid46.html

An other suggestions? I see BOSS does distance as well.
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Old 14-09-2010, 05:18   #10
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Your best bet is to take the RYA ICC oral/practical test... I did it way back in the late 80's when I decided to expand my cruising area beyond the Sth coast of the UK.... it was called the International Helmsmans Certificate back then...
Basically you went out on a boat (I used my own) and carry out a succession of maneuvers, picking up a mooring under power and sail, tacking, going alongside etc; etc;.... at the same time doing an oral exam on light recognition, compass bearings and positions and other related things...
Its been accepted all over the EU, Turkey, the Caribbean and the US....
Mine qualifies me for Power and Sail up to 24m/80GT in coastal waters... its as good as the Coastal Skippers Ticket.....
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Old 14-09-2010, 06:19   #11
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Yes but the DS course is a better course as you learn more.

Note the milage for DS is usually done on the course as it's only 100 miles.

Try and do a tidal course if possible its more useful and not at all difficult at DS level.


In the uk the DS automatically qualifies you for the ICC.
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Old 14-09-2010, 07:03   #12
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Sorry GoBoat.... was assuming he already knew his stuff from his previous posts.
I was ex RN Seaman, joined at 15yrs and did my training at Ganges... One years seamanship/navigation training in power and sail before moving on to speciality TAS... worked boatyards in Poole for a few years as well so did not need the course.. I had already learnt more than needed including celestial navigation.
If you have the knowledge already why pay over the odds... just pay the fee for the test... mileage not required....
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Old 14-09-2010, 07:38   #13
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I am pretty sure you can't be issued an ICC in the UK if you are not a UK resident. So you can't just fly in, go through the course and tests, and fly home with your license. Is not the same true for the various RYA certs?
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Old 14-09-2010, 15:35   #14
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Yes youare correct, as a result of some changes 2 years ago , the ICC can only be issued to residents of the country. I should have clarified that


However RYA certs can be issued to anyone. ( and can be done anywhere, there is an RYA school , even in countries that themselves dont recognise the RYA tickets)

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Old 14-09-2010, 20:13   #15
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Ahhhhh... those damn shifting goalposts.... lol.
They've screwed me more than once....
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