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Old 16-04-2018, 08:18   #16
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

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Originally Posted by music321 View Post
Lot's of good info, thanks! I intend to focus on knots, charting, etc. in the mean time. My biggest concern regarding a simulator would be learning the wrong info. I wasn't aware of the ASA, which seems like a great resource.
You can do a whole lot of sailing just knowing how to tie a bowline, figure 8, and a half hitch which can all be learned in a few minutes

That simulator can teach you a lot if you apply yourself possibly more than crewing on a real boat since then most of the time you are just following orders and being bored the rest of the time

Once you can get a small boat and sail it alone is when you will really learn especially if you race it in a one design fleet
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Old 16-04-2018, 09:26   #17
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

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Hi,

I have "small water" boating and canoeing experience. I have handled a power boat in calm water, and a canoe in waves up to two feet. I think I've learned the most about watercraft by handling the canoe in water that was too big for it, and having to constantly stay on top of things.

I'd like to learn to sail, but won't be able to get onto an actual sailboat for a little while. The eventual goal is the take a 30' sailboat far offshore in three years or so. Before I can get onto a boat, I have two ideas as to how to learn. I'm wondering if either is worth it. I can buy a remote control sailboat. This will allow me to get some feel for and handling in rough water. What's nice about this is that a 20 knot wind on the local lake will produce "rough water" for a remote control sailboat. This won't give me a feel for long distance cruising with current, though.

The second, and in a lot of ways easier option, is a sailing simulator called "Sailaway". I'm wondering if this would do more harm than good, teaching unrealistic/false techniques. I played a "bass fishing" simulator years ago, which was absolutely unrealistic. Were the "techniques" actually employed, they would not work. Furthermore, they did nothing to address any of the real aspects of fishing. Would this, or any other, sailing simulator be just as worthless? thanks.
My dear friend,
Since you have been canoeing why don't you try sailing a dinghy (optimist, laser, etc) which you can hire on the beach I suppose. The following set of knowledge will help self-teach yourself secrets of handling winds and seas.
1. Sheets attached to the sail are used to control the sailboat. She moves when you pull them in to fill the sail and keep them tied and she stops when you let them.
2. You need the centerboard upwind, you don't downwind.
3. Start in calm weather not to be discouraged and be prepared to swim.
If you need more explanation I shall be glad to help. I can also recommend you a book to make your self-learning a great fun if you are really keen to learn how to sail. I live and sail in Greece all my life.
P.S. I don't really like your ideas.
Regards and good luck.
Ilias
Unquote.
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Old 16-04-2018, 09:31   #18
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

My dear friend,
Since you have been canoeing why don't you try sailing a dinghy (optimist, laser, etc) which you can hire on the beach I suppose. The following set of knowledge will help self-teach yourself secrets of handling winds and seas.
1. Sheets attached to the sail are used to control the sailboat. She moves when you pull them in to fill the sail and keep them tied and she stops when you let them.
2. You need the centerboard upwind, you don't downwind.
3. Start in calm weather not to be discouraged and be prepared to swim.
If you need more explanation I shall be glad to help. I can also recommend you a book to make your self-learning a great fun if you are really keen to learn how to sail. I live and sail in Greece all my life.
P.S. I don't really like your ideas.
Regards and good luck.
Ilias
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Old 16-04-2018, 10:42   #19
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pirate Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

Could always do this to get you started..

https://youtu.be/SbYkm4eIoDc
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Old 16-04-2018, 17:33   #20
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

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thanks for the replies. Well, at least I won't be wasting my time with a simulator! Ideally, I'd love to get a little sunfish, or something similar. I'm middle-aged with some health issues, and I probably won't have the physical strength to sail for another year, which is why I'm asking about alternatives.

Would the remote control boat be worth it, or is it just too different from the real thing?
I learned to sail on a Sunfish. Great little boat to learn on especially if you have some real wind. I also sailed Lasers, but later, after I had acquired some skills on the Sunfish. My dad learned to sail at age 54 on an O'Day 22 (I was first mate), and there are modern equivalent boats. He then moved up to a Catalina 27, and would have loved to buy a Westsail 32, but financially it was out of the question.

So my advice is to learn to sail on a real boat. If you are near a large body of water you could offer to crew for someone with a boat.
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Old 17-04-2018, 07:00   #21
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

This 2nd video that I just viewed, is nuts as to learning anything. Sailing is not a video game, and not an okole sitting event on your couch twidling thumbs. As mentioned, you need to feel the wind on your face, the heel of the boat, the response from your inputs at the helm. Look at the water, and the sky, and the clouds and what they can tell you.

Same with flying aircraft, we strongly feel, you need full on instruction in a real plane.

As many here related, you need to be actually out there sailing. I watched that sail away video, and here is what would happen in real life.

The vessel is sailing on a reach, and comes to a buoy, and all he has to do is turn.
Not even close. That is nuts. The boom is out, and not sheeted in before rounding the buoy. I am talking real sailing vessels, not dinghy sailing.

That turn can result in full on disaster. The main sheet is out, and the boom on a real sailing vessel would be swinging over with enough force to dismast the boat, and if anyone on board had their heads up, they more than likely would be killed as the boom with the force of the winds, impacts. the head . Or the boom sweeping across the deck, smashes into a body, knocking them over board, with possible serious injuries or drowning.

Add in no mention of cutting the jib sheet and sheeting for the new tack. The jib would have been back winded, and the vessel eventually in irons or out of control.

Back to real life:

Your goal is to sail off on your dream of cruising . That is going to take effort, and study and actually sailing on board a boat that has systems to learn , as well as actually sailing. That means being able dock what ever vessel you sail , under sail .
Why ? Well, engines fail, tansmisions fail, batteries and electrical systems fail, etc.


Strongly recommend a structured sailing course, and a great deal of devotion to your goal. That would be learning from a U.S.C.G. Licensed Capt and Instructor with a certified sailing club ( they have the boats, no huge outlay of cash ), and gaining some kind of a certification. ASA is one of the widely recognized organizations. But a lot depends on the individual sailing organization and the quality of the instruction.

Add in coastal piloting, and navigation, and that means chart reading, and plotting, taking bearings, D.R's, Estimated Positions, Fixes, Running fixes, and much , much more. Plus GPS.... I use both . We feel the good skipper applies all different aspects of navigation, not just one.

Once you pass your written tests and check outs , you can sail the sailing club vessels on your own. Sailing is not driving a car, it is seaman ship, boat handling, wind direction, seas, points of sail, knot tying, emergency procedures, weather systems, fog procedures, even nav by depth soundings, and the list goes on and on. Man overboard procedures, etc.

Marine head systems, engines, filters, pumps, electrical systems, bilge pumps, VHF radio procedures, fresh water system. Reefing down properly, anchoring methods, single hook, bahamian moors, bow and stern. Plus much, much more. We will never know it all.

Also with a sailing club, generally they have several different makes of vessels, starting at at about 27 ft going up to 50 footers depending on their fleet.

Why is this important, because you will be able to sail these many different vessels and learn what you like and do not like about the different boats, and be able to make an informed decision when it comes down to purchasing a vessel.

The ocean does not love you, and when in any alien enviornment, air, sea or land, it is important to learn as much as you can, put everything in your favor, and be very serious about your learning program.

Also, learn about skippers responsibilities , which are substantial .... the safety of the boat, your safety and the safety of your passengers and crew. No matter what happens, they are looking to you to keep them and the boat safe.

We do not know your physical limitations, and to go out dingy saling on your own and teaching yourself could be extremely risky. You might wish to Learn from the pros, and then get out and sail boats of the type that will eventually will be the type of vessel you will need to live your dream. Aim directly toward your goal.

These are my thoughts from my personal back ground in sailing, motor vessels and professionally flying real air planes. ( 40 years )

Both of these careers were concurrent. And took time and effort that actually was fun.

Point being : That does not mean that you have to go thru all of that to live your dream, but we strongly suggest in order to head off on your cruising dream, you put in the effort to learn as much as you possibly can from professional instructors, on board larger sailing vessels, and then get some serious experience sailing on your own . Then shove off on your adventures at sea.

Yep, we feel it takes dedication, work, time and perseverance and experience to become a seaman, and skipper .

Of course there are a lot of different views on that idea. It is entirely up to the individual.

I really believe in this famous quote.

Don't dream your life, live your dream.
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Old 17-04-2018, 07:30   #22
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

Re #21:

Well spoken!

Your reply prompted me to look at those videos, which I hadn't bothered to do before. I was not disappointed! I was not disappointed because I expected them to be utter crap, and that, indeed, is what they are.

If presentation and instruction of that quality is the standard we may expect these days, we are all bound for perdition! There is a special little enclave in Fiddler's Green reserved for wannabe sailormen who mistake this sort of thing for a "learning tool"!

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Old 17-04-2018, 07:56   #23
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

RC Sailboat Racing!

https://www.google.com/search?q=rc+s...6peexLjnq9onM:

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Old 17-04-2018, 07:58   #24
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

You can still learn a ton from that Sailaway Video Game.

If others can't see that, it's ok since everyone learns differently. (I'm a self taught sailor. I bought a Hobie 16 in 1992, learned to rig it then started racing other Hobie 16's. You learn fast that way)

I learned flying with RC Planes and some cheap PC Based flight sim programs.

Now when I fly the multimillion dollar twin engine flight sims here I do not crash. (it's also a pain to have to reset a scenario after a crash)

You can really learn most everything you need to know from videos, models, and small sailboats before buying something over say 17'
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Old 17-04-2018, 08:24   #25
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

Trente,

A fond memory of sea shantys and Irish sailing songs. Thank you.

Aye. Fidlers Green is a fine sea shanty:

" Fidlers green there's a place I hear tell, where sailor men go if they dont go to hell.

The girls are all petty .the beer is all free and there's bottles of rum hanging off every tree.

Dress me up in my old stenciled jumper, no more on the docks I'll be seen, tell me old shipmates " I taking a trip mates, I'll see some day on Fidlers Green."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Aye proud lads, some of us are becoming a vanishing breed.

But all is good, since we gave it one hell of go !

And have a few more sailing adventures left in us.

Haul up and stow those fenders, Lads, sheet er in, its near time to splice the main brace.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rum:

Oh, and nothing to do with the original post, speaking of rum, for a few years now, my rum drink..... ice, DARK RUM, laced with vanilla extract. I just poor it into the bottle and shake er up a bit, . when it comes home from the store.

Drop in the ice, pour from the dark rum bottle, and a splash of water.

Sooooo bloody smooth and silky easy. And I mean smooth . Of course it is added fun with sailing and caribbean tunes.

For the ladies, Erica has her Bacardi, or Cruzan or Mt. Gay, and mixes the rum and ice, with some frozen lime-aid and gives it a stir. Reeee- freshing.

Sounds like it is about time for the party to commence.

Life is good !
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Old 17-04-2018, 08:52   #26
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

A simulator would probably good way to learn things like what those tell-tale thingies on the sail are for, traveler and boom vang adjustments, and all the other things I still don't understand. Probably better than a book. Race car drivers even practice on simulator games.
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Old 17-04-2018, 09:34   #27
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

Quote: "Dress me up in my old stenciled jumper,..."

I know it as "Dress me up in m'oilskins'n'jumper..."

But with boggles o'rum hangin' off ev'ry tree", who cares :-)?

MySaintedFather used to say; "Give me my slippers, my pipe and a pretty blonde, and you can go to hell with me pipe'n'me slippers!" :-)

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Old 17-04-2018, 10:11   #28
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

TP,

yep, I bet it is oil skins and jumper, makes more sense as well.

We were fortunate to have been able to skipper motor vessels up the River Shannon for two weeks each ( two separate holiday trips. Stopping in the riverside villages, going thru the locks, visited a few pubs, did some hiking, and fell in love with every Irish Coleen bartender at every happy hour, and also added in a few days partying down in Dublin. Wow !

Erica and I met wonderful and friendly and fun people, and had super great times. Ireland and her people are very special .

Began the river trip in the south ( Portumna, and on up to beyond Kerrick on Shannon, to Leitrim, and then back to Forrest Park on the Boyle, and then back to Kerrick to drop of the motor vessel, and then the train to Dublin. All tolled , it was about three weeks total time. Ireland is still in our hearts.

Lots of fun adventures. The reason we bare boated with Emerald Isle Cruises, is that I was too chicken, or smart to drive on the other side of road and do the Irish music and pub tour of Ireland. Felt more safe skippering the 34 ft power cruisers. Motor, Dock, tie up, and head in the the village for a pint, or a hot whiskey , conversations and song.

What a marvelous holiday.


slainte

Denny and Erica
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Old 17-04-2018, 10:53   #29
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

Yis :-)! M'foist woife wuz from Ballyhaunis, Roscommon. Had a splendid time there in 1961. My present wife if has roots in both Belfast and County Cork. "M'father, he wuz Orange, and m'mither she wuz Green - It's the biggest fecking mix-op that ye've ever seen!'. ...:-)!

Our family GP has arrived recently from the City of Cork and speaks with the true Cork accent. Music to m'ears! Her last name is that of one of the principal protagonists of the Easter Rising in 1916, though she assures me that there is no connection. Apart from being a competent and thorough family doctor, she is also a lovely woman, so I've had to tell 'er that I've been sold a bill of goods... Orl m'loife I've been told that going to the quack's is no fun. That is clearly NOT true ;-0)!

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Old 17-04-2018, 11:25   #30
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Re: Learning to Sail with "Sailaway"?

Boatman has a great idea.... You say you want to go far offshore. Sailing is only a small part of it, one you can actually pick up fairly easily. There is so much more to it than that... from the vocabulary to theory, knots and ropework, navigation, pilotage, communication, meteorology, tide calculations, docking techniques, COLREGS, mechanical and electrical systems, rough weather techniques, heck boat cooking! How to grow herbs onboard, trolling for fish!! Right now I have a boat and am studying ways to catch shrimp All these things you'll need to know sooner or later, and in my opinion, they're quite a bit harder than sailing because there is not much physicality, or 'feel' involved, just memorization and calculations. Start with books, downloads, tons of youtube videos that cover every possible thing, and that'll make you a better sailor while you get your strength back and find a boat to fall in love with.....and then you're really skrewed But at least you'll know how to do everything but the feel of a sheet, and that will come a lot easier then.
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