Interesting read from one of our fellow female sailors.....

[DivingOtter]

Reminds me of the feminist group that went after Dawn dish soap (best degreaser by the way) because it showed females washing dishes. Now their commercials are based around wildlife cleanup after oil spills.

[daletournier]

Up until this week ive owned a fitness center for 18 years. Several years back statistics showed that 73% of my customers were women. The average age was 44. I then focused my advertising on that segment of the market which proved to be very lucrative. Does that mean im sexist towards men?
My last post was my opnion, not worded to be offensive or aggresive, but look at the first response that came back? This is a typical response to a non political correct opinion. Surely different views or opposing views are nessacary for balance, do they need to attract the typical emotional response?


Sent from my vivo Y35 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[meatservo]

Originally Posted by chris95040

You poor thing. That must be very difficult for you.

Like free speech is okay as long as you are the only one talking, opposition be damned...


meatservo

[Lepke]

What cry babies! Do you want to learn navigation and boat handling from someone that has skill and experience or someone that is politically correct? Suck it up! I pity your husbands/ boyfriends/whatever to have to listen to this pc crap.
Becoming a real captain requires dedication and time. Usually with lots of time away from home. Most women are not willing to do the dedication or do the time. If more women worked on the water instead of trying to trap a husband, there would be more women captains and more pc pictures.
As to the absence of minorities, I have been on the water since the late 1950s and found no absence of any group. There are some commercial trades dominated by certain minorities. I've been on ships, tugs, commercial fishing boats and found minorities represented and not restricted from any job if skilled and qualified. In my time, the US government has issued captain and other papers to anyone that can pass the test and has done the time. I served on a US destroyer in the 1960s that had a black captain. Maybe he didn't want his picture in your book.

[SV DestinyAscen]

Originally Posted by Lepke

What cry babies! Do you want to learn navigation and boat handling from someone that has skill and experience or someone that is politically correct? Suck it up! I pity your husbands/ boyfriends/whatever to have to listen to this pc crap.
Becoming a real captain requires dedication and time. Usually with lots of time away from home. Most women are not willing to do the dedication or do the time. If more women worked on the water instead of trying to trap a husband, there would be more women captains and more pc pictures.
As to the absence of minorities, I have been on the water since the late 1950s and found no absence of any group. There are some commercial trades dominated by certain minorities. I've been on ships, tugs, commercial fishing boats and found minorities represented and not restricted from any job if skilled and qualified. In my time, the US government has issued captain and other papers to anyone that can pass the test and has done the time. I served on a US destroyer in the 1960s that had a black captain. Maybe he didn't want his picture in your book.

Falgout? Unfortunately Vice Admiral Gravely has passed.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by PhiSig1071

I agree with this, and I've never understood people who want to force some form of equality on someone's business. If he's really a sexist, racist *******, do you want to give him your business? I wouldn't. But if he's forced to include women and people of color against his wishes, how will you know he's a racist bigot until it's too late?

He's not being forced to do anything, unless you equate a consumer voting with their pocket books to not buy from a vendor that treated them poorly as unfair coersion.

The fact that he was probably unaware that his words and actions were offensive does not get him a pass.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by landlockedsquid

Cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Boy, you sure showed him, deciding not to purchase the course so YOU could advance yourself.

Not really thinking it all the way through are you. If "Captain in a Box" were the only show in town then she might be spiting her own face.

There are plenty of other routes to a Master's Ticket. I bet there a few out there that will treat her as if they want her as a customer.

[landlockedsquid]

Originally Posted by Adelie

Not really thinking it all the way through are you. If "Captain in a Box" were the only show in town then she might be spiting her own face.

There are plenty of other routes to a Master's Ticket. I bet there a few out there that will treat her as if they want her as a customer.

Actually I did think it through. She didn't buy the course because her widdle feewings were hurt, and I don't care. But some people are pious and need to make a statement and tell everyone about it, and I still don't care. They had been thinking about it for awhile, so apparently they had decided this was the best one. But because there widdle feewings got hurt they will get one they didn't think was best. Their call. And I still don't care.

[JPA Cate]

I read the sequence of events somewhat differently. The couple had picked a training program that ticked many of their boxes, but the husband was already having doubts about this one. She let her husband take the lead, or he took it anyway, who knows, and the salesperson addressed him only. Suddenly, she's the invisible adult. The more invisible she is, the angrier she gets.

To write that "her widdle fweelings got hurt" could be taken to be extraordinarily *adjective of your choice* ranging from insulting, through demeaning, to, possibly, downright stupid.

The fact that she felt moved to write about it serves as a reminder of the imbedded female chauvinism still in the world. For some, it is a clarion call to action of some kind, but to me, it is only a reminder.

The woman's solution to her perceived problem was logical. She voted her wallet elsewhere.

No one on the sides away from the median will change anyone's mind here, as has been seen in so very many threads. Please, people, try and keep it polite. Or argue the opposite to your true position, you just might find giggles abound.

Ann

[StuM]

So let me get this straight - the fact that his advertising material was geared to 90% plus of his market means that he is a racist misogynist and "wimmen and blacks need not apply"?

Bet there weren't any disabled people in his advertising either and certainly none from the LGBT communities. What a prat he must be.


Either that or some people take offence far to easily and delight in shouting it from the rooftops.

[weavis]

I am laughing Ann, Honest.

Look at this: https://www.google.es/search?q=knitt...w=1366&bih=599

Tell me how many men you see in the search?

Then read this and it may give insight as to why people who try to be honest in their thinking and advertising are demonised and hung out for shame.

The Origins of Political Correctness

Pure equality can never happen because the sexes are different. I dont demand a woman holds the door open for me and want to be treated a certain way... I will take my chances on what happens. There will always be respect and consideration for the other person regardless of the sex, its called basic human decency.

Where it balances is with the cheque book. If a woman wants a product and feels demeaned or patronised she goes elsewhere. You know, it happens to me too from businesses and it has NOTHING to do with anything other than I dont like the person or the company...

I have always been an equal opportunity person. One of my best friends and colleagues in medical emergency was the most gorgeous sexy and feminine of women who could stand shoulder to shoulder in any circumstance or difficulty and retain her dignity and professionalism to the n'th degree. She proved herself as I had to prove myself and we forged a 4 year working relationship that was a joy to be a part of.

It is what it is. The second we make everything on the lowest possible common denominator, we join in the lie of Political correctness. Some people are chauvinists, some are silly, some dont think and some dont like women. Its the way it is.

As stated, if you dont like the product dont buy... Forcing someone to advertise a different way is forcing them to do what YOU want. Let a person be what they are and economics will sort them out.

The law forces people to accept, for example, that marriage is no longer confined to male/female relationships. It now legally can be same sex couples. The law however, as much as advocates for the new legal unions push, can never make some individuals like it. It is not a requirement that everyone not only accepts the legality of same sex marriage but should be enthusiastic about it... The same with taxes, the same with... etc.

We are in grave danger of losing out to common sense and truth if we push our own agenda and make everyone conform to the same base line for our personal preferences.

In saying that, I would be first in line if they made it mandatory that everyone own a catamaran...

[Sea Dreaming]

I am always annoyed by the phrase "political correctness". This implies simply trying to fit in with the popular crowd. But many issues aren't about popularism. Rather they are about liberty and equality for every person on the planet regardless of another's opinion of their value and worth.

Voting with your wallet is absolutely the right thing to do. But women do not have to simply shut up or fight. One can take the middle road by taking the lead in the discussion. There is no use in waiting for someone to address you. In that case I think we get exactly what we put out. In other words one gets treated as we allow. "Captain" implies one who is master of his or her vessel. The captain isn't going to wait for instructions or to be noticed or asked.
It took me years to realize that no one can give me "power" so fighting for it or waiting for it is pointless. People are largely followers. It's true. They ignore other followers because they offer nothing to those looking for direction.
I can't say if this seller wouldn't just ignore any woman no matter what or not. But no one will give "the lead" if you aren't stepping up to fulfill that role.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Sea Dreaming

I am always annoyed by the phrase "political correctness". This implies simply trying to fit in with the popular crowd. But many issues aren't about popularism. Rather they are about liberty and equality for every person on the planet regardless of another's opinion of their value and worth. .

No. You did not read the article cited above.

Here it is again. http://www.academia.org/the-origins-...l-correctness/

It is the most insidious tool ever designed and people fall for it thinking they are being liberal and equal.

[Sea Dreaming]

Originally Posted by weavis

No. You did not read the article cited above.

Here it is again. The Origins of Political Correctness

It is the most insidious tool ever designed and people fall for it thinking they are being liberal and equal.

I confess, I didn't read it at all. I may one day, but my comment is simply about my own reaction to the phrase. Not a reflection on your post or the article.

I agree people are inherently different. "Equality" probably isn't what most people want is it?
My friend Jacob with physical diabilities can't equally meet the same challenge as a weight lifter. But he can have an equal respect for his strengths (he is near brilliant in intellect) yes?

Big ideas but it 3:51 here, best I can do for the moment.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Sea Dreaming

I confess, I didn't read it at all. I may one day, but my comment is simply about my own reaction to the phrase. Not a reflection on your post or the article.

I agree people are inherently different. "Equality" probably isn't what most people want is it?
My friend Jacob with physical diabilities can't equally meet the same challenge as a weight lifter. But he can have an equal respect for his strengths (he is near brilliant in intellect) yes?

Big ideas but it 3:51 here, best I can do for the moment.

As a person who researches everything to do with medicine and psychology, I always quote sources and research material. Conclusions are for the individual to make.

Your reaction to the phrase, is EXACTLY how it was designed to be taken and deflect from the real reason. Im apolitical about everything, but a keen observer of how tools are used to influence individuals and the collective humanity.

Im a passionate sailor. I have no antagonism towards single or multi hulls. I have a preference for multis but as of yet own monos. I learn from whom and where I can and accept the weaknesses and strengths of my teachers. Some come from a generation where women were not in the main interested in sailing, and thusly the teacher has a male oriented mindset. That to me is OK... I know know one crusty old salt who took on a female to train on his boat once she proved to him she knew her ports from starboards and could trim faster than most men, me including me.

He told me one day that she was a special type of woman, a rarity and a pleasure to be around and work with. NOt the norm. #he would say with a twinkle in his eye to not let the male predjudice down...

Its life. It is what it is and if someone feels slighted or belittled, well you know they might be right... but then again it may be their own reaction to life... it was never meant to be easy and sometimes is quite hard...

Relationships are fraught with emotions and niggles and stuff... we all gotta deal with it.

Prejudice is not exclusive to men you know...