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Old 24-06-2013, 11:50   #1
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Challenging ASA Standards

Right, I need and ASA instructor in or around NYC - any recommendations?

I want to challenge ASA 104 (Bareboat) and ASA 106 (Advance Costal) so I can get on to a course that I will actually lean something on (ASA 108 Offshore Passage Making).

With ASA you have to have the previous keel boat standard before you can get on the next one and doing courses on which I'm learning nothing new is draining my already dwindling cash deposits.

Any recommendations? I have already tried Manhattan Yacht Club and a few others but they can't help because it's financially better for them if I do the course.

I have already contacted ASA and 104 can be challenged without an overnight sail if you can demonstrate you've previously done so successfully (I have just come back from BVI's have skippered a bareboat of 41 foot).

Thoughts?
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Old 24-06-2013, 12:37   #2
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

Why do you feel you need ASA classes/certification when you've learned the first 2 courses with practical experience?
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Old 24-06-2013, 12:42   #3
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

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Why do you feel you need ASA classes/certification when you've learned the first 2 courses with practical experience?
The only certification I want is ASA 108 - Offshore Passage Making. But I can't do that without all of the previous keelboat standards being acheived/signed off.

I've never been that bothered before but I'm thinking of transitioning from recreational to professional sailor and paperwork is necessary.
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Old 24-06-2013, 12:56   #4
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

Nobody in the professional world will take much notice of an ASA course. For professional work you need experience (measured in tens of thousands of miles), a license and if teaching an instructor's ticket after you have experience and a license.

USCG basic 6-pack is 360 days on the water and that is a very low level certification!

Good luck but it is lots of work ot get the experience!
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Old 24-06-2013, 13:19   #5
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

You are giving too much credit for ASA training. Simply put: It's for hobbyists! Some boat charter and insurance companies will recognize the certification; to them, it is much better to deal with someone who knows some seamanship fundamentals.

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Old 24-06-2013, 13:35   #6
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

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Nobody in the professional world will take much notice of an ASA course. For professional work you need experience (measured in tens of thousands of miles), a license and if teaching an instructor's ticket after you have experience and a license.

USCG basic 6-pack is 360 days on the water and that is a very low level certification!

Good luck but it is lots of work ot get the experience!
Yeah I get that. But to get more time on a boat it helps to be better "qualified" then the next guy, well at least that's my logic for doing the ASA 108. If someone is looking for offshore/delivery crew having ASA 108 has to have some sort of benefit, right?

The plan is to work towards the USCG 8 pak.
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Old 24-06-2013, 15:01   #7
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If you are looking to build miles and experience you would be better set taking the money you intend on classes and use it to fly somewhere to pick up a boat for a crossing or a shared expense crossing.

Rushing through the courses without getting miles renders the process useless.

You want to drop the ASA anyway and work on getting the RYA ticket anyway. The commercially endorsed RYA Yachtmaster Ocean allows an owner to have you and the vessel insured but it also is meaniness without ocean miles.

You would be better served racking up miles with different skippers and boats - many delivery companies use free crew. This will broaden your experie ce base working with different styles of skippers and boats, rack up your miles and experience, and also help to build up your co tact base.

If you are a good and serious sailor it will be noticed.

Taking Nav, Radar, Radio etc classes is good cause you learn proper technique.

The best wY to learn the "sailing" part of sailing is to go race at your local club.

The best way to learn to skipper, learn how to deal with boat systems, weather, diesel, etc - is to do it with a good skipper and with miles.

Training is very important, schooling will help you learn things faster and how do things correctly - but if you only do the schooling without the miles you are fooling yourself and wasting your money.
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Old 24-06-2013, 15:15   #8
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

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Originally Posted by s/v Moondancer View Post
Nobody in the professional world will take much notice of an ASA course. For professional work you need experience (measured in tens of thousands of miles), a license and if teaching an instructor's ticket after you have experience and a license.

USCG basic 6-pack is 360 days on the water and that is a very low level certification!

Good luck but it is lots of work ot get the experience!

Ditto. ASA certs are recreational, not professional, level (I'm an ASA Instructor Evalutor).

The only case they might be relevant is if your plans to "go pro" include teaching sailing.

For any USCG Lic one the key factors is how many days of officially documentable sea time do you have?
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Old 24-06-2013, 15:33   #9
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

Agree with previous posts: you don't get to be a professional by passing courses, and particularly recreational-level courses, and not have the experience. Even if you had a Six-Pack that alone wouldn't get you a job either - it only passes the legal and insurance bars. And that is only for coastal work - offshore you need a 100 ton (possibly amended down to 50 tons or less) which takes 2 years of documented experience at sea. The RYA Yachtmaster does represent some (minimal) relevant experience along with coursework, and with the relatively modest addition of the commercial endorsement will get you closer to the 100 ton with less experience. (It is possible to spend 6-8 months in an intensive, full-time course in the UK and receive the YM certificate.)

Bottom line: no one will consider you a professional until you have first put in the time and miles, so put your efforts into getting that experience. Best case it will take years, so get going on it.

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Old 24-06-2013, 15:52   #10
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

We plan to sail 8,000 miles in the next 16 months, perhaps you could convince my wife that we need crew...What can you fix?
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Old 24-06-2013, 19:14   #11
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Originally Posted by CannyBallast View Post

The only certification I want is ASA 108 - Offshore Passage Making. But I can't do that without all of the previous keelboat standards being acheived/signed off.

I've never been that bothered before but I'm thinking of transitioning from recreational to professional sailor and paperwork is necessary.
If you want to become a professional sailor , rather then a merchant Marine sailor , ten I suggest RYA YM, then have it commercially endorsed , with that you are " technically " good for upto 12 passengers and 200, where the manning requirements follow UK MCA guidelines. ( this includes super yachts and other professional leisure vessels ) you will need the STC95 basic courses as well , also first aid and VHF.

This is about the only worldwide ticket that has any credibility in the rather chaotically organised professional leisure marine sector.

Outside of that you have various Merchant Marine ratings , most require full time sea time plus a written exam. But again for professional leisure sailors ,this is is not a common route into the " profession"

Before you go any further I suggest you decide what you are aiming at and then seek advice


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Old 24-06-2013, 19:22   #12
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Re: Challenging ASA Standards

Is it worth all the time, efforts and cost to become a pro? While it looks like a glamorous lifestyle, it is everything but. Do your homework! Good luck!

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Old 25-06-2013, 03:40   #13
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+1

Did large yacht skipper work, not delivery, for 2 1/2 years. It was a lifetime goal and I managed to get a break very young.

It was life changing - and not in a positive way. I felt like a glorified chauffeur. Most large sailing yachts spend a manority of their time not actually sailing. It is a select few owners that do the big races, passages, RTW, etc. Mostly you will take it across the atlantic, if your lucky, twice a year and then sit.

Pro skippers are more manager than sailor, more employee than independant.

Works for some, I bailed after a couple years and never looked back.

Really enjoyed delivery work though!
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