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Old 16-11-2018, 18:50   #1
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What electrical draw items do you use

So boat is in refit and it is the early stages. I'm adding new Gel batteries and Efoy to service my electrical needs. So I thought I'd ask you cruisers what you have installed that is an electrical draw when at anchor, not when you are under way.

The reason I"m asking is that I don't want to miss something I might have added had I been aware. Currently I have a 12 volt fridge that runs off of golf cart batteries and that's about it. I'm thinking I'd like a small microwave and an Engel fridge/freezer, most likely 45 litres.

As I motor frequently, not so much a drop the anchor and stay for a week kind of guy, I am having a large alternator installed as well.

Also on my electrical draw will be a composting toilet. I use propane for on Dickinson heater, Force 10 2 burner oven/stove. Lights will be switched over to LED. TV isn't important to me and sound might be though it is easy to add blue tooth speakers coming off a rechargeable storage device.

So what do you have hooked up and running at anchor?
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Old 17-11-2018, 09:11   #2
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

On my 26-foot power cruiser on the Inside Passage, by far the biggest AH user was the fridge. I'm not familiar with composting toilets and how much they might require, but I would guess that your biggest users would be the fridge and the Engel you plan to add. Microwave and other high-current but short duration inverter users might be next. You are adding an inverter, right? If you're not already planning for it, I'd suggest an external regulator like Balmar MC-614 for your alternator.

If you like, I could email you the Excel spreadsheet I used to work out current draw, battery bank, and recharging requirements.
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Old 17-11-2018, 09:26   #3
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

Quote:
Originally Posted by NewMoon View Post
>>>>>>>>>>If you're not already planning for it, I'd suggest an external regulator like Balmar MC-614 for your alternator.

If you like, I could email you the Excel spreadsheet I used to work out current draw, battery bank, and recharging requirements.

The external regulator is a good idea.


Here is an energy budget. You should make one up yourself.


The All-Important Energy Budget:
Energy Budget

IMPORTANT BASICS What are amps & amp hours (thanks to StuM from CF.com)

Amps v Amp hours v Amps/Hr

Record of Daily Energy Use of 100 ah per day:

"Breaking In" New Wet Cell Batteries
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Old 17-11-2018, 09:48   #4
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

DC: two fridges, cabin lighting, shower sump, CO detectors, bridge stereo

AC via inverter from DC: "outlet" appliances -- TV/stereo, "device" chargers, microwave (short bursts, like popcorn), coffee maker... plus potentially Instant Pot (pressure cooker) and/or slow cooker, but we haven't tried that

AC from either shorepower or genset: battery chargers, water heater, aircons, cooktop, microwave (real cooking), the two fridges, plus all that other stuff...

-Chris
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Old 17-11-2018, 12:23   #5
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

Richard Cook, you said: If you like, I could email you the Excel spreadsheet I used to work out current draw, battery bank, and recharging requirements.

I will take your spreadsheet, email - rsn4534@gmail.com

So I have looked at the spreadsheet the owner Aquavite Energy Budget provided and some of it doesn't make sense. There are three columns, Daysail, Overnight, At Sea. At sea I don't care about as I am power and my 160 amp new alternator will take care of anything I run at that time. The overnight category is what interests me.

It you look at the figures in the Overnight column, he has the anchor light at 3 amp total draw, which I'm guessing is not an LED light. He has the cabin lights at 13.5 amps which again I'm assuming are not LEDs. These two make sense. But he has his VHF radio on, which partially makes sense, trust me, mine would be off. But then he has running lights at 3 amps, Loran at 2 amps, wind speed at .5 amps, why would you have those things on at anchor? Maybe I"m misunderstanding something.

Also I'm guessing he was using golf cart batteries that could only be discharged to 50 % for a total usage of 245 amps (with all three batteries at 50 % ). With GEL batteries with a combined amperage of 265 discharged to 20 %, I would have 206 amps.
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Old 17-11-2018, 16:46   #6
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsn48 View Post
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

So I have looked at the spreadsheet the owner Aquavite Energy Budget provided and some of it doesn't make sense. There are three columns, Daysail, Overnight, At Sea. At sea I don't care about as I am power and my 160 amp new alternator will take care of anything I run at that time. The overnight category is what interests me.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Glad you looked. I never said you should use the numbers as written, it is a guide. And yes, I did that 20 years ago and things have changed. It was the concept I was recording. Plug your own numbers in.



Not golf carts, just three 105-130 ah 12V wet cells.


Your boat, your choice.
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Old 18-11-2018, 15:19   #7
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

For us, the fridge and freezer are by far the biggest draw. Next comes our water maker and Splendide washing machine (I know, decadent). Then at least two and often three computers charging. After that, with LED anchor light and cabin lights, its basically nothing.
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Old 18-11-2018, 15:24   #8
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

energy-budget.pdfHere's my energy budget for a cruise from San Francisco to Hawaii, including a description of the DC system basic design.

P.S. I hate spreadsheets. They are of no value without a narrative explaining the design criteria and assumptions.


I've been sailing with that configuration for 4 years. Not shown is the 125 A/H lithium (LiFePO4) battery that I added two years ago. My total battery capacity is now 483 A/H. (About 240 A/H useable.)
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Old 18-11-2018, 17:18   #9
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

240v items used as a full time cruiser at anchor

250 litre 2 door fridge freezer on 24/7
120 litre fridge freezer x 2 on 24/7
100 litre deep freeze on 24/7
(23 cf total)
180 litre household hot water system turned on around 10am daily - finishes around 11:30am
Several hours of PC and 40 inch screen

Occasional use of 240v blender, toaster, pressure cooker, microwave, water pump and power tools and a simpson front loading washing machine.


Everything else is 24V and 12v

Everything runs from solar, inverters and batteries
Genset rarely used
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Old 18-11-2018, 17:40   #10
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

You may want to refer to the spreadsheet on the Pacific Cup Yacht Race site that can be very helpful for creating an electrical budget. I came up with this in the late 1990s, since I received so many questions related to "how big should my batteries/alternator/solar panels be?" This is especially good to know when sailing to Hawaii...

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Old 18-11-2018, 19:02   #11
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

Sometimes I run my chart plotter, depth sounder, radar, VHF. The plotter can use GPS for anchor watch and sometimes that is helpful. And an anchor light, of course. (In addition to things you have already mentioned.) Like you are planning, all my lights are LEDs.
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Old 18-11-2018, 19:25   #12
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simi 60 View Post
240v items used as a full time cruiser at anchor

250 litre 2 door fridge freezer on 24/7
120 litre fridge freezer x 2 on 24/7
100 litre deep freeze on 24/7
(23 cf total)
180 litre household hot water system turned on around 10am daily - finishes around 11:30am
Several hours of PC and 40 inch screen

Occasional use of 240v blender, toaster, pressure cooker, microwave, water pump and power tools and a simpson front loading washing machine.


Everything else is 24V and 12v

Everything runs from solar, inverters and batteries
Genset rarely used
Nice detail of power users on your boat. Would be curious about your battery capacity, solar panel rating, alternator max output and time you spend at anchor in a single stretch. What you did list I think has to run about 300AH/day of usage, at least, so your charging routine could be very interesting to support that with "genset rarely used"

We have a smaller fridge and freezer, but that alone requires about 60 to 100AH/day depending on outside temp of course. In a long term anchorage situation if we are on the boat we run genset about 2 hours most days - but then we are addicted to our microwaved hot coffee all the time, a movie if possible, washing machine every few days, watermaker and electric rice cooker. Our two 75W solar panels don't add much charge even when I constantly adjust them to the sun angle and avoid rigging shade.
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Old 18-11-2018, 19:36   #13
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

I have printed out all the spreadsheets linked, Cpt Pat's energy budget, and a private email from Richard Cook (New Moon) and am going through them, all helpful and I've looked at them closely with pencil making comments for myself.
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Old 19-11-2018, 01:45   #14
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

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Nice detail of power users on your boat. Would be curious about your battery capacity, solar panel rating, alternator max output and time you spend at anchor in a single stretch. What you did list I think has to run about 300AH/day of usage, at least, so your charging routine could be very interesting to support that with "genset rarely used"

.
8 x 220ah agm 12v set up as 880ah of 24v
9 x 250w solar
Midnite classic 250 mppt
Victron 5000va/120a inverter charger


Wake up in the morning batt monitor says 150ah approx used overnight and around 85 to 90% capacity.
In summer, by 10am batts are 97% and I flick on the hot water system , it usually has between -5a and +5a coming in still and everything is full temp and full charge by lunchtime.

In winter if we hang the wrong way I might need to give the genset 30 minutes head start early putting in 100+ amps plus hot water system at same time.
On zero sun days we have 100% charge and hot water done in 1.5 hours using our 7kva Kubota d900 genset.
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Old 19-11-2018, 11:51   #15
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Re: What electrical draw items do you use

I would plan at adding the needed power to charge a phone and a laptop computer.
You can't access that forum without them !

A laptop would add 6 to 8 amp/h of usage on average.
A phone battery for a full recharge will drain about 2 amp/h.
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