Two Stroke / Four Stroke Outboards

[beau]

With fuel/oil injection the newer two strokes are much better than they used to be.
I have spoken with a number of boat owners who say the new generation two strokes have better fuel economy and more "power" than four strokes.
Any real life support for either. Rather than hearsay

[David M]

Thats not exactly true. The new two-strokes are just a lot less worse than they used to be when it comes to efficiency and emissions.

Modern four-strokes are more efficient and cleaner burning. The downside to them is their greater weight and cost.

More power is a relative term. A unit of horsepower is the same thing regardless of the source.

Which are better is a matter of the application and personal preference.

If weight is a very high priority to you such as having to lug one on to a dink, then get a two-stroke. The new ones are pretty good engines now...less stinky and more efficient than they used to be.

[speciald@ocens.]

Can't buy a 2-stroke in the US anymore thanks to the Green Weenies.

[JusDreaming]

Originally Posted by speciald@ocens.

Can't buy a 2-stroke in the US anymore thanks to the Green Weenies.

You can still get them in the Bahamas and thier prices are better than in the states for out boards

[barnakiel]

Right or wrong, forbidden (to sell) in the EC.

b.

[s/v Jedi]

It's true, the new 2-strokes are cleaner and more efficient than 4-strokes... but they are only available at 40hp and up last time I checked. They are also approved in the US and EU because engines must meet emission standards, regardless of 2/4 stroke technology.

ciao!
Nick.

[beau]

Has anyone got some real experience with these new two stroke motors rather than the crap that manufacturers write or they pay journo's to write.
Here in Australia you can still buy two stokes and they are the latest technology from Mercury, Evinrude, Yamaha etc.(up to 300hp)
So far we haven't been sucked in totally by the Greens and their ********.

[s/v Jedi]

Check out the info about Evinrude E-Tec. They are 2-stroke, fully compliant with California emission standards and even the only outboard that ever won their award thing. They are cleaner than the 4-stroke outboards.

And I think I just saw that they have a 25hp E-Tec too now... it gets interesting.

Too many people think 2-strokes are out because of emissions but the e-tec engine proves this is bull. 2-stroke provides more acceleration, is lighter, smaller and can be cleaner/greener than 4-stroke. The point is that many don't care and make old-tech high-emission 2-strokes (and those are cheaper).

If Evinrude comes with a 15 hp e-tec, all the cruisers that had 4-stroke will go back to 2-stroke again ;-)

Here's some links:

The two-stroke lives! : Evinrude's E - TEC engines have done the seemingly impossible; saving the air-cooled two-stroke from oblivion | Automotive Design & Production | Find Articles at BNET

Clean Two-Stroke Engines - Boyesen Reinvents the Two-Stroke

ciao!
Nick.

[beau]

i am more interested in fuel economy of the new two strokes. Any experience out there.

[Bash]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Too many people think 2-strokes are out because of emissions but the e-tec engine proves this is bull. 2-stroke provides more acceleration, is lighter, smaller and can be cleaner/greener than 4-stroke.

The 25hp E-Tec weighs in at 156 lbs. Compare that with a Yamaha 2-stroke 25hp, which weighs only 105 lbs. The short-shaft Honda 4-stroke 25hp weighs 155 lbs, so it's actually lighter than the E-Tec.

[Cheechako]

Etecs are BIG trouble unless you are lucky and get a good one. I've been involved with the installation of many. a pretty good percentage of them melt their pistons in the first month of service. A good 2 stroke is hard to beat. The 4 strokes are smooth though and should be great engines if you can afford the weight. If I understand it right, the ETEC tries to use a black box to finely control emissions by metering oil in with the fuel, one of two things seems to happen, the Box thinks there's too much emission and cuts the oil back frying the powerhead, or loads it up with oil and it sucks the 2 stroke expensive oil like going out of style creating more pollution then a typicla 2 stroke. Evinrude is pretty good at fixing them though. An ETEC would be the very last engine on my list...

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Bash

The 25hp E-Tec weighs in at 156 lbs. Compare that with a Yamaha 2-stroke 25hp, which weighs only 105 lbs. The short-shaft Honda 4-stroke 25hp weighs 155 lbs, so it's actually lighter than the E-Tec.

Yes, I saw that too, but look at the displacement, the e-tec is a much larger engine. I was surprised to find a 25hp e-tec as the last time I checked it started at 40hp. They have a problem to build small e-tec engines but like always, time will improve things as they develop it further. May be a 40 hp e-tec is lighter than a 4-stroke?

My Yamaha Enduro 25hp weighs 125 lbs and that's too much to carry around without loosing control... we always use a halyard.

ciao!
Nick.

[Bash]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

My Yamaha Enduro 25hp weighs 125 lbs and that's too much to carry around without loosing control... we always use a halyard.

Enduro. Is that the one where you use a girl button to get it started?

Still, 25hp seems like an awful light powerplant for a 64 Sundeer.

[forsailbyowner]

I've seen the advertisement where they claim the e tec has lower emissions. They wave a wand in the air behind the running engine. Like airborne emissions are the only emissions. What happens to that oil that is injected? A large percentage still ends up in the water. Run a two stroke in a barrel and do the same with a four stroke. The water will tell the story. I'm surprised to hear so many against the environmental movement. Like an ostrich sticking his head in the sand, What pollution problem? I'm totally happy with my 3 hp four stroke. 3 star emission compliant, 35 lbs. Great fuel economy. I don't feel the need to go 20 kts in my dinghy or sailboat. Full time liveaboard cruiser 3 yrs no plans on changing lifestyle.

[Bash]

Originally Posted by forsailbyowner

I've seen the advertisement where they claim the e tec has lower emissions. They wave a wand in the air behind the running engine. Like airborne emissions are the only emissions. What happens to that oil that is injected? A large percentage still ends up in the water. Run a two stroke in a barrel and do the same with a four stroke. The water will tell the story. I'm surprised to hear so many against the environmental movement. Like an ostrich sticking his head in the sand, What pollution problem? I'm totally happy with my 3 hp four stroke. 3 star emission compliant, 35 lbs. Great fuel economy. I don't feel the need to go 20 kts in my dinghy or sailboat. Full time liveaboard cruiser 3 yrs no plans on changing lifestyle.

I'm neither an engineer or a scientist, but I do teach Environmental Studies at the university level. I have no interest for or against Evinrude motors, nor do I own one.

The bottom line with E-Tec technology is that they consume less gas than comparable engines, even 4-strokes. The less gas you burn, the less carbon you emit. It's that simple.

As regards oil in the water, here in California, where two-strokes were banned from places such as Lake Tahoe, the E-Tec engines are now allowed. Indeed, the boats from the regional agency that monitors compliance with outboard engine restrictions are now equipped with E-Tec outboards. For me, that constitutes a fairly strong endorsement, although I would still argue that kayaks present a greener alternative to anything with an E-Tec engine.

As far as knee-jerk reactions against the environmental movement are concerned, I have no comment other than to suggest, ahem, that you consider the source.