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Old 06-06-2016, 13:24   #46
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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Originally Posted by Fishman_Tx View Post
And I like this one even better!!!! Near exactly what I need. Though..she's a big sucker!!! No sundecks or flybridge. Straight forward. Looks like a house on a barge.
Houseboat For Sale-1974 Stephens 16' x 56'-$12,900 Holly Creek Marina, Dale Hollow Lake, TN

I hadn't looked at these earlier... I'd be skeptical about one that says "built to use on the ocean" (although I understand that's not your intent; just reacting to an idea about truth in advertising). I don't see much in the way of usable factoids relevant to displacement...

Big and flat, advantages to that. The only houseboat names I'm familiar with are Gibson, Holiday Mansion... and to a certain extent Bluewater... although the latter would probably not want to be called a houseboat.

None of those would be always usable on something like the Chesapeake Bay. Good weather windows could work.

-Chris
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Old 06-06-2016, 13:30   #47
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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Originally Posted by ranger42c View Post
I hadn't looked at these earlier... I'd be skeptical about one that says "built to use on the ocean" (although I understand that's not your intent; just reacting to an idea about truth in advertising). I don't see much in the way of usable factoids relevant to displacement...

Big and flat, advantages to that. The only houseboat names I'm familiar with are Gibson, Holiday Mansion... and to a certain extent Bluewater... although the latter would probably not want to be called a houseboat.

None of those would be always usable on something like the Chesapeake Bay. Good weather windows could work.
-Chris
Ditto that! I wouldn't go to blue water with that ever. Hell, I'm still skeptical about trawlers doing the Florida-Bahamas jump. I can't do the Blue anymore, so flat water for me now.
Yeah there was a I think a 36 fiberglass hull that went 13k displacement and I'm just projecting from there for the lab rat.
I REALLY like that Stephens 56, lots of room for the price point, but 56 is a lot of boat for an electric drive. Then again the Bauhaus barge is a 50 and it's all electric. Go figure...
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Old 06-06-2016, 13:32   #48
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

I have also been contemplating this idea for some time. Nowhere near making the steps that you are Tx. In my research I stumbled across these folks that seem to be onto something with converting gasoline outboards into electrics. Seems like it could be a viable option for you. I sent them an inquery email some time ago and they responded within a couple hours. two of those big outboards on the back should push you along at a good clip. Good luck with it.

MARINE
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Old 06-06-2016, 13:40   #49
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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Boy, Stumble, that was fast! Thx!
At 59klbs, isn't that a bit overkill? I chose 20klbs because it is real close to actual for the size, depending on whether it's steel or aluminum. An early 70's 36' FG hulled boat ran 13klbs. I know that a 90hp outboard will push it, but to what speed I'm unsure. Most boats of this age ('70s) in the 40-ish range have outboards from 90-130hp, while the inboards seem to like 2x318 Chrysler Crusaders or MerCruzers. I wonder if props or jet drives are more efficient? Hmmm...

Ranger:
Awesome! Thanks for that tidbit. I'm going to check it and see what the spec is if I can find it! I've looked at the Elco gear and they are very pricey, but if I can match the spec, I can find cheaper solutions.
Thanks again!
============

I've also just signed up on the Electric Seas forum for electric drive converts.
That's the displacement for a hull of those dimensions that's square, i.e. a barge or mostly a houseboat. In fact that's the displacement that the boat has to have. Leingth X width X draft = cubic foot * density of water/cubic foot = 58,000lbs

If you have a specific boat in mind then you just need to find the hp curve for the engines it's already using combined with the speed/rpm. To figure out how much power you need.


Outboards vs inboard efficiency gets very tricky very quickly... Actually it just starts that way. Their are pluses and minuses to each.

Inboards
+ better balance
+ larger props
- down shaft angle

Outboards
- worse balance
- generally smaller prop
- most are geared for speed not thrust
+ parallel thrust direction
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Old 06-06-2016, 13:42   #50
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

Another point for comparison... just for thought, really...


You can see from our avatar that we're NOT a big flat houseboat... so the idea of solar doesn't get much traction (although I could indeed mount some panels on the hardtop should that become useful in the future sometime).


But where I'm going with this is still about fossil fuel. We've got a bazillion horsepower, but we mostly futz around at trawler speed. We can carry 520 gallons of diesel. In the mission you describe, I could probably make that diesel last for 3-4 years, maybe more. At idle speeds, we burn something like 2 GPH total at about 4.5-5 knots using both engines. IOW, I could be in the backwoods of nowhere for a very long time without bothering to worry about fuel consumption... or lack of fuel supply.


We'd probably burn more running the genset for our all-electric galley and air conditioning than we would for propulsion. And some of that's where auxiliary solar (and maybe wind, if I could stand the noise) could really shine.


A not-uncommon point often made on Trawler Forum is that fuel is often one of our lesser bills. That's probably not as obvious for cruising sailors, but other stuff (dockage, insurance, food, etc.) always trumps our fuel bills. That'd be different if we ran the boat on plane all the time, of course, but that doesn't happen to be our norm...


-Chris
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Old 06-06-2016, 14:01   #51
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

Our old sailboat had enough fuel onboard to motor from the BVI to Briton non-stop but if we wanted to run the generator the whole way we figured we had to stop at least twice. In 10 years we probably didn't run an entire tank of fuel thru the motors, but the ten really liked to suck it down.

I think I have been pretty clear I think this is a silly idea, but hey, all boats are silly to some point.
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Old 06-06-2016, 14:13   #52
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

If you have speed and fuel burn you can also approximate the hp used. +\- 10% a diesel will generate 20hp/gallon/hr. So if a houseboat burns 2 gallons/hr they are operating at around 40hp at the drive shaft.

Which just so happens to work out nicely since I found that the average fuel burn for a particular 45' aluminium houseboat is to burn 2gph at 6.5kn.
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Old 08-06-2016, 07:32   #53
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

Well, the attitude around here is never surprising. It's the reason why I haven't been here in a few years.

Due to lack of constructive commentary based in reality as it applies and the fact that most think this is all "silly" or think me a moron, EVEN THOUGH YOU'VE BEEN GIVEN EVIDENCE TO THE CONTRARY, Tired of dealing with cynics and narcissistic folks. Tired of wasting 4 pages of **** disputing ignorance from those who have never done it telling me I can't do what we've ALREADY DONE FOR 40 YEARS!

Ranger and Steady Hand, thanks for trying.

I'll hang over at another forum that caters to the "electric" community and where ALL THESE PIPE DREAMS OF MINE HAVE ALREADY BEEN MADE A REALITY FOR OTHERS!!

I'm sick of all the years of CAN'T-DO attitudes and the numerous nay-sayers in this place who haven't a clue but act like they do.

Good Luck and Good Bye.


My Morgan thread will remain active and updated as time goes by.


===============================================
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Old 08-06-2016, 10:06   #54
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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Originally Posted by Fishman_Tx View Post
Well, the attitude around here is never surprising. It's the reason why I haven't been here in a few years.

Due to lack of constructive commentary based in reality as it applies and the fact that most think this is all "silly" or think me a moron, EVEN THOUGH YOU'VE BEEN GIVEN EVIDENCE TO THE CONTRARY, Tired of dealing with cynics and narcissistic folks. Tired of wasting 4 pages of **** disputing ignorance from those who have never done it telling me I can't do what we've ALREADY DONE FOR 40 YEARS!

Ranger and Steady Hand, thanks for trying.

I'll hang over at another forum that caters to the "electric" community and where ALL THESE PIPE DREAMS OF MINE HAVE ALREADY BEEN MADE A REALITY FOR OTHERS!!

I'm sick of all the years of CAN'T-DO attitudes and the numerous nay-sayers in this place who haven't a clue but act like they do.

Good Luck and Good Bye.


My Morgan thread will remain active and updated as time goes by.


===============================================
Please come back when you have built a 40-50' full sized houseboat that will do 10 kts for a full day on electric motors powered by batteries and costs under $50,000 and I will personally hand you $1000 in cash.
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Old 08-06-2016, 10:22   #55
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

Since you are not starting for at least a year, it'll be interesting to see what happens to Lithium battery prices when all the electric car factories start rolling out.
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Old 08-06-2016, 10:31   #56
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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Since you are not starting for at least a year, it'll be interesting to see what happens to Lithium battery prices when all the electric car factories start rolling out.
Battery prices might actually go up. Due to the huge increase in demand the price for lithium has jumped from $1.00/lb to as much as $35/lb on the spot market. 20,000 Kg container of lithium hydroxide or carbonate, direct from the producer in China is over $10.00/lb. Shortage forecast to go into 2017 or beyond based on current information.
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Old 08-06-2016, 12:41   #57
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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Please come back when you have built a 40-50' full sized houseboat that will do 10 kts for a full day on electric motors powered by batteries and costs under $50,000 and I will personally hand you $1000 in cash.
And this kind of commentary is why. Did I mention anywhere about a full day? Hmmm...?

NO.

I'm out.
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Old 08-06-2016, 12:45   #58
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

Cobalt Batteries, or Super Capacitor anyone? 🤔


Still surrounded by anchors.
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Old 08-06-2016, 13:21   #59
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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And this kind of commentary is why. Did I mention anywhere about a full day? Hmmm...?

NO.

I'm out.
Well you said you wanted a 10 kt speed to cruise on the MS River. So you tell us what time you consider reasonable. 30 mins or an hour at 10 kts isn't going to get you very far.

I see little if anything on this thread that isn't straight response of real world data from knowledgeable people in reply to your posted intentions for an electric boat. If the data doesn't match what you want it to be then you just say everyone's being rude and leave. Very common response when someone comes up with an idea that isn't realistic.

If you have other, real world data I really, sincerely would like to see it. I would go electric in a minute if it would meet just the following:

- Similar range to my current system,
- Similar power to my current diesel
- Cost similar to installing a new diesel

If you can show me this I will be sold.
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Old 08-06-2016, 13:36   #60
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Re: Electric Houseboat concept

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And this kind of commentary is why. Did I mention anywhere about a full day? Hmmm...?

NO.

I'm out.
If you are going up the Mississippi, you are going to need several hours at your 10kt cruise speed to make any headway but your the expert so you know a way around it.

If you have it all figured out, come back and give us on the water performance results. The facts say it won't happen but I guess that just makes us "nay sayers."

Makes one wonder why you asked in the first place if you already have the answers.
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