Diesel vs Domestic Fuel Oil?

[leftbrainstuff]

Home heating oil is a low grade fuel oil. Any of the older mechanical diesels with pintle injectors can burn it. The problem is you will see accelerated injector and pump wear. If you analyze your engine oil you will see lots more acid buildup.

We dont run anything but fresh clean diesel.

The military used to do this before they replaced all their diesels with electronic Euro IV spec engines. These are too fussy to run anything other than diesel. There is lots of research and wear data. You can run just about any oil. Olive, old chip oil, peanut oil, old sump oil, etc.

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[cal40john]

Originally Posted by Cowboy Sailer

I use the diesel from the local filling station diesel pump. So I pay a little road tax extra. It is pretty small price to pay to get fresh high quality fuel for my boat.

I usually buy diesel from the local filling station, so am also paying road tax, but even with road tax the diesel is cheaper than what it costs at the marina. I've been told I could fill out forms and get reimbursed for the tax. Too much trouble for the amount I'm buying.

OP are there no car filling stations with diesel nearby? As others have said, it is not illegal to use taxed fuel in your boat and at least in the U.S. is the same stuff.

[Neeltje]

I had contemplated getting a marine diesel tanker truck down here from the nearest distributor I know of (which is about 120 miles away), but aside from being cost prohibitive for a measly 250 gallon fill, I don't know if their feed lines could reach my boat at dock (a total distance of 220 feet from the nearest access point).

The local (private) marina is only about 200 yards downstream from my dock, but its only T-dock is even further away from the nearest truck access, and constantly occupied.

This being a relatively rural area, I was hoping that "domestic fuel oil" trucks might have longer feed lines than their "marine diesel" counterparts, and since the Dutch feed their boats red fuel regularly with no apparent issues, I was also hoping that the "red fuel" sold here would be equally "useable".

I'm running an older 90 HP, 4-cyl Lehman that drinks about as much as most of our local bass fishermen do (about 1 gallon per hour) at cruise, and since she is one of the very few diesel engines in these parts, I'm not all that concerned about her spewing enough additional sulfur to radically affect the local marine life as we know it.

As mentioned before, I'll start by getting the chain length and sulfur content stats on local fuel oil compositions from the local providers, and move on to the legal ramifications of using their red fuel on an "off road vehicle" such as mine...

Thanks once more for all your input.

Jacques

[Stu Jackson]

IIRC, there are "issues" with road fuel and boat fuel in the UK and especially in France and for boaters who regularly sail between the two.

That is simply NOT the case in the USA.

I believe you are over-complicating the issue.

Get a jug, go to a gas station and buy some diesel fuel.

Your larger issue is really the quantity you need and getting it to your boat, right?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Neeltje

I had contemplated getting a marine diesel tanker truck down here from the nearest distributor I know of (which is about 120 miles away), but aside from being cost prohibitive for a measly 250 gallon fill, I don't know if their feed lines could reach my boat at dock (a total distance of 220 feet from the nearest access point).

The local (private) marina is only about 200 yards downstream from my dock, but its only T-dock is even further away from the nearest truck access, and constantly occupied.

This being a relatively rural area, I was hoping that "domestic fuel oil" trucks might have longer feed lines than their "marine diesel" counterparts, and since the Dutch feed their boats red fuel regularly with no apparent issues, I was also hoping that the "red fuel" sold here would be equally "useable".

I'm running an older 90 HP, 4-cyl Lehman that drinks about as much as most of our local bass fishermen do (about 1 gallon per hour) at cruise, and since she is one of the very few diesel engines in these parts, I'm not all that concerned about her spewing enough additional sulfur to radically affect the local marine life as we know it.

As mentioned before, I'll start by getting the chain length and sulfur content stats on local fuel oil compositions from the local providers, and move on to the legal ramifications of using their red fuel on an "off road vehicle" such as mine...

Thanks once more for all your input.

Jacques

I had a similar size load trucked up from St. Petersburg (Russia, not Florida ) to Vyborg last summer. It was not cost prohibitive at all. The truck had a very long hose and it wasn't hard to find a place to take the fuel. The experience was a real pleasure, with the fuel being sold like fine wine, with a sample being tapped out and put into a sealed lab bottle, and presentation of analysis certificates.

I can't imagine it would be so hard to arrange a delivery where you are. Otherwise, just lug a couple of jerry cans from a filling station, as others have suggested. At 1 gallon per hour, a days worth of fuel is easily lugged.

[Stu Jackson]

At 1 gallon per hour, a days worth of fuel is easily lugged.

Could probably do 2 1/2 or 5 gallons per run. 5 gallons would weigh about 45 pounds (20 kilos?).

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

At 1 gallon per hour, a days worth of fuel is easily lugged.

Could probably do 2 1/2 or 5 gallons per run. 5 gallons would weigh about 45 pounds (20 kilos?).

You've never lugged jerry cans of fuel, or water? Oh, happy man!

A couple of Jerry cans make a whole 10 hour day at that rate of consumption. Most of us have lugged that kind of load from time to time. Even single handed, it's doable if you use a taxi.

[dannc]

Originally Posted by Neeltje

I had contemplated getting a marine diesel tanker truck down here from the nearest distributor I know of (which is about 120 miles away), but aside from being cost prohibitive for a measly 250 gallon fill, I don't know if their feed lines could reach my boat at dock (a total distance of 220 feet from the nearest access point).

...

This being a relatively rural area, I was hoping that "domestic fuel oil" trucks might have longer feed lines than their "marine diesel" counterparts, and since the Dutch feed their boats red fuel regularly with no apparent issues, I was also hoping that the "red fuel" sold here would be equally "useable".

...

As mentioned before, I'll start by getting the chain length and sulfur content stats on local fuel oil compositions from the local providers, and move on to the legal ramifications of using their red fuel on an "off road vehicle" such as mine...

Thanks once more for all your input.

Jacques

If you are in a rural area, the local fuel distributors will be selling off road diesel to farmers. Most farm tanks around about 200 US gallons and the distributor should not have a problem delivering that amount to you. His truck should have long hose on it because many home tanks are not always near the driveway or road but 220 feet might be a problem.

I think you might be getting hung up on the idea that your engine needs marine diesel. Others can answer for sure but does a Lehman not run plain old #1 or #2 diesel? I would be shocked if the answer is no. All you need is some #2 diesel and if you can get untaxed fuel, which will be dyed red that would be perfect.

The fuel is dyed to indicated that road tax was not paid and thus the fuel should only be used in off road vehicles like farm trucks, tractors, and home furnaces. That dye stays around even after filling up with new undyed fuel. The Tax Man does dip fuel tanks to see if the vehicle is running untaxed fuel on the roads. This happens from time to time at farm shows and NASCAR races. But you don't need to worry about this since this is a road tax a boat does not need to pay.

To put it another way, your boat is off road so you can use off road fuel aka dyed fuel, without a problem. All of the above is true in the US.

Later,
Dan

[Neeltje]

Thanks Dan, that's exactly what I wanted to hear. I'm more concerned with local availability and logistics than I am with distillate chain length or sulfur content at this point.

I don't know if those who suggested "lugging jerry cans from the nearest gas station" have ever been on the southern 180 miles of the Saint Johns River, but most of it is gas station free, and I don't know of any that offer diesel fuel.

Furthermore, the closest thing you'll find to a "taxi" is a hay binder or logging truck that happens to be going your way, assuming of course that you actually managed to find the dirt road they're traveling on.

The Upper Saint Johns River is indescribably beautiful. but all of its facilities cater to bass fishers and other shoal draft gasoline powered boats. Diesels need not apply.

Jacques

[Dauntlessny]

Neelte,

glad you got the right answer, at the start and the end of this thread at least.

Dannc, summed it up nicely.

And for everyone else who thinks there are 4 or 5 different types of diesel in the US, thanks for the chuckles.

Just keep paying extra for your "Marine" Diesel . I'm sure your engine will thank you and that extra cost almost guaranteed that your engine will last 3.75 hours longer than mine, after 20,000 hours of use, plus or minus 400 hours.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Dauntlessny

Neelte,

glad you got the right answer, at the start and the end of this thread at least.

Dannc, summed it up nicely.

And for everyone else who thinks there are 4 or 5 different types of diesel in the US, thanks for the chuckles.

Just keep paying extra for your "Marine" Diesel . I'm sure your engine will thank you and that extra cost almost guaranteed that your engine will last 3.75 hours longer than mine, after 20,000 hours of use, plus or minus 400 hours.

Yes but Heating Oil, Gas Oil , etc is different from DERV and some modern engines can smoke a lot with Gas oil.

As I'm allowed to use Red diesel , I use it , with no ill effects

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by Neeltje

.......... I don't know if those who suggested "lugging jerry cans from the nearest gas station" have ever been on the southern 180 miles of the Saint Johns River, but most of it is gas station free, and I don't know of any that offer diesel fuel...........

Have you checked active captain? There are some marinas on the St. Johns River that do sell diesel fuel. Georgetown Marina for one. There are others. Besides, you're in a sailboat, right? Let the wind take you there and just use the engine for docking.


Ba he fuel issue, diesel fuel from a gas station is fine Home heating oil would be a risk I would not recommend.

[hellosailor]

As the OP is looking for 250 gallons, jerry cans would be one long project.


But 55-gallon drums have a long history of being used for fuel transport and storage, surely he can arrange for four or five DRUMS of diesel fuel to be dropped off?


All the hand-cranked drum pumps I've seen advertised for diesel fuels, they can't just be ornamental devices, can they?

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

As the OP is looking for 250 gallons, jerry cans would be one long project.

I was assuming he was talking about the St. Johns River in Florida, USA. It would be very hard to burn 250 gallons of diesel in a sailboat before passing a marina that sells it. Same for a trawler. Not every marina on the St. Johns sells diesel but several do.

And he wouldn't need 250 gallons of diesel to get from where he is to a marina that sells diesel where he could fill his tanks if he wanted to.

[rwidman]

So are you north or south of the Shands Bridge and did you get your needed fuel?