Sudden Attraction to Hunters

[robert sailor]

Bad part of this sort of stuff is that it all ends up on the internet when guys are shopping. If anyone thinks the Hunters are built poorly compared to their competitors I guess thats one thing but from I know I think they are no better or worse than the B's, J's and the other large builders. I'm not a Hunter fan but thats just personal taste, I'm also not a Bene or Jeaneau fan either except for a couple of boats in their past line up. We should give the Hunter owners a bit of a break and gang up on another builder for entertainment.

[Navicula]

30 pages and over 400 posts here...........hunter also has a facebook page.......head on over a click....Like.....

[Sailor g]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

How can you have trusted these yard people when they commissioned your boat but also have a previous owner involved? When you are not the first owner, you never had your Hunter delivered from the factory with separate keel and have it assembled and launched by those people.

Sorry for the confusion. I wasn't just responding to your post but in general. I was just pointing out how we trust yards to do other jobs...like the job I mentioned- which took a lot of trust. I didn't say they commissioned the boat for me but they did for the guy who bought it new-we bought it from the PO. We delivered many of their new boats to boat shows too-none of which had keel issues.

[ArtM]

Originally Posted by Therapy

The reason they did that was to avoid taxes. It was a loophole they found and the cars were shipped with the components in the trunk. Something about luxury vs not.

That makes sense, I was thinking it had something to do with import taxation. This model at the time was built entirely in Japan.

In this case, the car was already on the lot with no A/C or sunroof. I ordered the A/C, but passed on the sunroof!

[ArtM]

Originally Posted by Navicula

30 pages and over 400 posts here...........hunter also has a facebook page.......head on over a click....Like.....

It does seem to be an excessive amount of discussion about one squeaky boat, and one leaking keel joint.

But there are many thousands of owners enjoying their Hunters on the water, perfectly happy with the attractive cabinetry and comfortable seating. A few are even doing a bit of sailing.

[MikeinLA]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

You really think I would not talk about what is wrong with Sundeers? There is plenty wrong with every boat

But......I thought it was a YACHT. Now I'm confused.

Mike

[sneuman]

Originally Posted by Navicula

this has to be directly related to the liners being glued to the hull and the keel design and all the other problems Hunter sail boats have......I am sure this would not happen on a Swan or Oyster or all the other non production boats......If this happen on your boat.....sell it right away, it has issues............this is proof.....so can we end this now....

Wow, if I ever teach a class on rhetoric, I am using this as a textbook example of argumentum ad logicam (straw man argument)!

[sv-Mystique]

Stupid thread -

[ColdEH]

I would love to have a new boat that is "stick" built, have you priced them lately?

Can't own them both, a boat or a house , make your choice. For that reason alone I guess liners make sense. Not all of us can afford a new Hylas or Tayana.


If that was the only choice, sailing would be a very exclusive hobby.

Regards

[Capt Phil]

Just got a call from an aquaintance who is thinking of buying a Hunter 28.5 with a small yanmar engine to use on a lake. After reading through some of this thread (couldn't spend hours reading the whole thing!), I advised him that while a boat that size and with the noted deficiencies from an offshore point of view, it would be ideal for lake/overnighting because of its roominess and ease of handling. Hope I didn't steer him wrong. Phil

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Capt Phil

Just got a call from an aquaintance who is thinking of buying a Hunter 28.5 with a small yanmar engine to use on a lake. After reading through some of this thread (couldn't spend hours reading the whole thing!), I advised him that while a boat that size and with the noted deficiencies from an offshore point of view, it would be ideal for lake/overnighting because of its roominess and ease of handling. Hope I didn't steer him wrong. Phil

G'Day Phil,

No, I think you were spot on, for that is exactly what such boats were designed for and excel at. If folks would routinely match the usage to the designers intentions we wouldn't always be having these silly arguments!

Of course, sometimes the marketing division gets in between the designer and the customer, and that can cause confusion in the naive.

Cheers,

Jim

[dennisail]

Here is an snippet from an email my friend Rick sent me the other day.

We are in Ensenada, Baja Californa (Mexico), for our second week. Attitude Adjustment finished the 66th Newport Beach to Ensenada B.C. race on a record Saturday 10:40 AM finish, a full 14 hours ahead of our prior best. It was good enough for a second in class overall and a third corrected for handicap in our class. We missed second on handicap by only one minute twenty two seconds after a 125 mile race. Not bad. And, the guys who took first really deserved it.

These guys own a 20 year old hunter design the same as mine. They do well in these sorts of races winning occasionally, and have a very comfortable and safe boat. As you can see their corrected time usually loses them positions rather than moving them up past faster boats.

Also, I do not see how a 28 foot boat not being a good candidate for an offshore boat has anything to do with Hunter. Its a 28 foot boat!! That style of boat is perfectly safe in larger sizes.

If you want a seaworthy 28 foot boat for ocean crossings the first question to ask is WHY? There are many decent 35' plus boats in the USA for the same price as a good 28'. Secondly if you must have as seaworthy style "small boat" like a dana 24 etc, the same question comes up again since boats like that are expensive and you can buy a MUCH larger boat for the same price. Plus small tank like boats sail like tanks and take forever to complete crossings exposing you to potentially bad weather for much longer periods of time, plus where do you put the beer?

Buy buying prod boats you get a much bigger boat for the money and size has always shown to be the one of the most important factors in seaworthiness. Waves are proportionally smaller to a large boat. As long as the boat is structurally sound bigger will usually be better.

There has been zero actual evidence to say that Hunter is any less reliable than any other big prod boat manufacturer and is nothing more than hearsay, probably started by someone who is crammed into a boat with half the size which cost more and needs to justify their cell like living conditions. Any company that produces 1000's of anything will eventually have incidences of quality control show up just due to the fact of how many of their products are out there.

[hjv]

I stumbled across this thread accidentially while I tried to figure out what all the Hunter bashing on the forums were all about. I have read it from start to end and it has been both entertaining and enlightening. What I get from it is that the rule of big numbers is the cause of it all.

Let's for the sake of argument say that with any brand there is a probability of one in a thousand of getting a lemon. That's a very low number, I know, but I just chose it for illustrating my point. In the better years Hunter, as well as Bavaria makes around 2000 boats. That means two accidental lemons a year.

Now, let's have a look at one of the prestigiuos brands, Hallberg-Rassy. They make 180 boats a year. It means that it statistically would take them more than 11 years to accidentially make two lemons, or one every 5.5 years. Their turnover in 2008 was 500 000 000 SEK, or about 68.7 mill USD. That gives an approx factory price of USD 381 666 in average per boat.

I am pretty sure that those factors combined with a small operation and catering to the high end luxury market where brand cred is everything makes for a great deal of flexibility. Giving them a reasonably quick and pretty informal process in handling those very rare screw ups before they turn into major incidents that could hurt their reputation, making sure the customer is kept happy and tells his friends how happy he is. The bottom line is that you really pay big bucks for that treatment.

High volume manufacurers rarely have ramifications for that personal touch that HR buyers pay big bucks extra to get. Hunter buyers don't want to pay tens- or hundred thousand dollars to get that special Business Class treatment on delivery. Still some of them will expect it. Most sailors just want a boat that works, one that they can enjoy life at sea in. That means that when something hits the fan at Hunter there will be more noise.

This and the weight of about 1820 more boats sold per year gives more events that turn into incidents, creating more dissatisfied customers compared to HR. Not neccesaily in percentage, but in numbers. That means more bad stories to be spread as rumors pr year than for HR, which, as you remember, had a probability of one bad story every 5,5 years.

Account in the fact that rumors usually make a feather into five hens and it all makes sense.

I have to say thank you for starting this thread. It has been very enlightening. I was shiyng away from Hunters because of all the bashing on the forums. I will no more page over a used Hunter in the classifieds as long as it is in my size and fits the budget. Maybe in a some years we'll be cruising the world in a Hunter. In the meantime I still have a lot of research to do, boats being one of the neccesary topics. That, and enjoying life in coastal waters in our cute little 24 foot sloop.



Regards!

[davefromoregon]

I have noticed a significant uptick in beneteau bashing lately. I suspect it too comes from numbers. I am happy with my boat and was quite pleased with the 37' Hunter I chartered a few years ago.

That said, I would prefer a BMW to a Chevy, but money sometimes dictates choices.

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by hjv

I stumbled across this thread accidentially while I tried to figure out what all the Hunter bashing on the forums were all about. ... Maybe in a some years we'll be cruising the world in a Hunter. In the meantime I still have a lot of research to do, boats being one of the neccesary topics. That, and enjoying life in coastal waters in our cute little 24 foot sloop. Regards!

Regards Cap: O the money you would save if you could make the little sloop do.