Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-10-2012, 19:18   #46
Senior Cruiser
 
Captain Bill's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: On the boat
Boat: Endeavourcat Sailcat 44
Posts: 2,313
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Sorry to hear about your injuries. One of the local sailors out of Whortonville NC got killed a couple of years ago. The boat jibed and he got hit in the head and went overboard and never came up. While your injuries sound pretty bad and I'm sure are quite panful, at least you're here to tell us about it. I have a boom brake and a preventer but sometimes the jibe happens as it did to you while you're in transition and neither one has been set yet. I did it on my cat last spring and while no one got hurt I did damage the boat. The one nice thing about my cat is that the boom is well above my head so it's somewhat safer than most monos that I've been on. I do recommend a boom brake and a preventer, especially on multihull. Multihulls tend to be light and not much directional stability down wind which I attribute to the fact that they don't have much hull in the water compared to most monohulls. Even with both then you can still get caught.

You have my best wishes for a speedy recovery.
__________________

__________________
Captain Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 19:21   #47
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Quote:
Originally Posted by gonesail View Post
jibes are always dangerous as you found out.
Always? Crash jibes, yes. Controlled jibes, no.
__________________

__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 19:21   #48
Registered User
 
S/V Alchemy's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Toronto
Boat: Custom 41' Steel Pilothouse Cutter
Posts: 4,576
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

I think I get the picture now. It's difficult to think when you feel as if you've been massaged with mallets "gosh, I'm lucky", but I think that is the case.

Thank goodness you were snapped on. Seamanship trumps bad luck.
__________________
Can't sleep? Read www.alchemy2009.blogspot.com for fast relief. Can't read? Avoid www.volumesofsalt.blogspot.com, because it's just personal reviews of sea books.
S/V Alchemy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 19:31   #49
cruiser

Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Troup View Post
You need to re-read Newt's post a bit further up.

"What happened was with the increased wind the helmsman ... headed to the wind to decrease sail. I assumed he would keep it there. But with the fog he had no reference point, and he wasn't watching the compass. The Boat had so much inertia that it went up threw the wind and back down just about the time I finished rolling the jib. It literally gybed in less than a second."

Fog could confuse just about anyone. Even with the compass it's very disorienting. I'm sorry he had to be our wake up call, but you get familiar with something, it sometimes seems safer than it really is.
__________________
Rakuflames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 19:35   #50
Registered User
 
Ziggy's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: U.S., Northeast
Boat: Contessa 32
Posts: 1,421
Images: 2
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Mark,

I'm sorry to hear about the accident but it's good to hear that you have not suffered any permanent damage. I wish you speedy recovery
It's easy to see how in a foggy night, an inexperienced helmsman could get disoriented and lose track of the wind. I find wind instruments helpful.

Like most others, I've also had several accidental gybes. Luckily, no one got hurt and nothing broke. I used to set up a preventer, but I never found a system that I really liked. A few years ago I got a Wichard boom brake. It works! I leave it rigged all the time and it's very simple to tension up to stabilize the boom.

Z.
__________________
... He knows the chart is not the sea.
-- Philip Booth, Chart 1203
Ziggy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 19:51   #51
Senior Cruiser
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 19,355
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Yes, I sugest the Govt require stickers on sailboats stating: "Warning, sailboats can injure, maim, or kill!"
Hope you mend quickly.... we all make mistakes... once!
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 20:38   #52
Moderator Emeritus
 
Ex-Calif's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Singapore
Boat: Maxi 77 - Relax Lah!
Posts: 11,514
Images: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Troup

You need to re-read Newt's post a bit further up.

"What happened was with the increased wind the helmsman ... headed to the wind to decrease sail. I assumed he would keep it there. But with the fog he had no reference point, and he wasn't watching the compass. The Boat had so much inertia that it went up threw the wind and back down just about the time I finished rolling the jib. It literally gybed in less than a second."
I am not criticising Newt in any way but if the boat was going 4 knots the wind was up. If the boat went head to wind and then another 180* plus to effect a gybe I guess I am curious about missing the many signals on deck like wind direction and the rather quick heading changes...

I usually notice when a newbie helm gets off by as little as 10-20*

Also as the boat went head to wind the main should have been close hauled. Still not sure if they were two or three up.

Close reach/haul, trim main and genny, furl genny, engine on, head to wind, douse main - with this sequence even an accidental gybe after close hauling would not be a drama.

Again sorry about the accident but it seemed pretty avoidable. Of course I wasn't there...

Another rule of thumb I have is that the longer the main sheet gang of rope is laid out the more respect I give it.
__________________
Relax Lah! is For Sale <--- Click
Click--> Custom CF Google Search or CF Rules
You're gonna need a bigger boat... - Martin Brody
Ex-Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 21:33   #53
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,441
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
Yes, I sugest the Govt require stickers on sailboats stating: "Warning, sailboats can injure, maim, or kill!"
Hope you mend quickly.... we all make mistakes... once!
One of the Whitbread boats in (I think) 1981 - Pierre Fehlmann's Disque d'Or, IIRC (the Farr one which was reincarnated as a Maiden !), had in very large letters on the boom:
"Skipper's Health Department: This boom can damage your health" or something to that effect.

It was partly a wry comment on the ructions due to cigarette sponsorship of RTW boats being controversial (Rothmans, Silk Cut etc).

But undoubtedly it was also a pointed reminder: nobody is such a great sailor as to be immune to being hit by the boom (except perhaps in www armchairland)

Just ask Francesco de Angelis, Bruce Farr, Ed Baird, Eric Tabarly, Peter Barrett, Dee Smith, Jack Boye, Penny Simmons, Nancy Griffith, Alain Gautier .. to name just a few
__________________
Andrew Troup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 22:09   #54
Registered User
 
Stu Jackson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Cowichan Bay, BC (Maple Bay Marina)
Posts: 6,385
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
Btw-the idea about running jibs only in this situation(following wind at night) is a good one. Wish I had thought about that 2 weeks ago.
So sorry to hear about your issue and wish the best and speediest recovery possible.


Not only at night. A friend told me a story about the difficulty he had in taking his main sail down while rounding Pt. Conception during the day time. He said even using his engine he couldn't get the boat around and headed into the 25+ knot winds and heavy seas to drop the main.

I was too sensitive to his plight to say what was really on my mind: "What the hell were you doing with only your MAIN up going downwind?"

Lesson learned, albeit the hard way.

Heal fast so you can heel on the boat asap.
__________________
Stu Jackson
Catalina 34 #224 (1986) C34IA Secretary
Cowichan Bay, BC, (Maple Bay Marina) SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)
Stu Jackson is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 22:42   #55
Registered User
 
Captain Jeffry's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Southern California
Boat: 41' Sail
Posts: 420
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Hi Newt! I hope you are on the mend and I hope the delivery of your Valiant went well. Cheers! Jeffry
__________________
Captain Jeffry Matzdorff
100 Ton Master
Captain Jeffry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 22:43   #56
Senior Cruiser
 
s/v Beth's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Boat: Valiant 40 (1975)
Posts: 4,066
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

And from now on, when I enter a zone without landmarks ( for any reason) the sailing goes to advanced and much of the cloth comes down.
As long as I survive, someday I will be a good sailor!
__________________
s/v Beth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 23:12   #57
Registered User
 
ozskipper's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: NSW Australia
Boat: Traditional 30
Posts: 1,981
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Never walk up the windward side of a boat that is on a run!! Old lesson. Else you can walk into a flying boom. Its always smarter to walk to the leeward side, under the boom in rough weather, even though its a little more difficult.
__________________
Cheers
Oz
...............
ozskipper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 23:23   #58
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
And from now on, when I enter a zone without landmarks ( for any reason) the sailing goes to advanced and much of the cloth comes down.
As long as I survive, someday I will be a good sailor!
The pinnacle of this ancient art, sailing, is the ability of a skipper to take aboard inexperienced crew and have them perform their duties safely.

We don't always get to the pinnacle. There are times, for example, when the skipper needs to go forward to handle conditions that were unexpected. At those times, it's often best to hand the helm over to the autopilot, rather than asking crew to perform tasks for which they are unprepared.
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 23:23   #59
Registered User
 
Ironhorse74's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Vancouver Washington
Boat: Ed Monk designed 34' Sloop Second Wind
Posts: 400
Images: 1
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

Mark get better quick. If I can help you bring the boat back down let me know.
__________________
Ironhorse74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 23:25   #60
Registered User
 
gunkylump's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Boat: Stevens 47
Posts: 358
Re: sailboats can injure and kill

QUOTE=s/v Beth;1048697]It's taking me a while to get to where I can talk about this. I am writing with one hand in the hunt 'n peck tradition so please excuse the punctuation.
2 weeks ago today I was sailing up the Straits of Juan de Fuca with a crew of three.All of them were in experienced ocean sailors, but that was behind us and we were coming up on Port Angeles, the beginning of inshore waters according to the USCG.
Fog settled in about 2 hours before as well as an adverse tide. We were still making better than 4 knot SOG however so we decided to hug the Way coast and continue. I was getting tired so I turned the helm over. A sudden gust caught my helmsman by surprise and he headed up into the wind,and I got the large jib in. Beth turned down wind just as I had taken down the preventer in prep to flake. The flying gybe took less than a second. If I had hit the boom I would be dead. Instead the main sheet picked me up and threw me against the radar arch, breaking my right humerus,left ribs left shoulder tear and numerous bruises on my face and trunk. My crew called the CG. And now I am sitting here on a month of forced inactivity...
As captain I take full responsibility. I am glad no one else was hurt. But this brought home to me that inexperience at the helm and bad weather is a dangerous combination, and that our wonderful little dream machines can injure or kill.[/QUOTE]

I wasn't even sailing....it's been 4 weeks and I still am not allowed to put weight on my left leg...broke both lower bones and dislocated my foot stepping off of my boat onto a wet floating dock.......I feel your pain...just a wee bit lower mind you. It happens very fast....over before you know it and then the pain begins. Oh well, like you, I will heal....and this even has given me even more time to do some internet viewing of our next boat....so far I have only "purchased" 1,853 boats......each and everyone a real beauty!<grin>

Take your time and heal well my friend, next year will be so much better!

gunk
__________________

__________________
gunkylump is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:19.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.