I Think I Saw MH370

[SaucySailoress]

Originally Posted by europaflyer

All you saw was a glow, which you guessed was an aircraft.

I realise now that although I have clarified my observations and my thoughts, I haven't done so in one place.

1. I spotted a bright orange glow in the distance. At first I thought it might be a meteorite. I observed it a few times, and it appeared to be getting closer. At this stage I was wondering if it was going to land near us and wipe us out. Which I thought was bloody typical, not that the boat had finally got a bit dry.

2. I spotted what appeared to be black smoke behind it. My instant thought was if it was a missile (a term I have avoided using until now), but then I almost immediately saw the plane take shape. This is when I thought it might be a plane on fire. Yes, I did consider waking the crew at this stage, but i could not see a fire.

3. For the majority of my sighting, I was just staring at a plane that was glowing. I wondered why it was glowing, still couldn't find the light source, and decided it must be a military plane playing with some top secret technology that made planes glow orange, and then when it turned away and headed back towards where we had passed those glowing white lights (we had initially thought was a research vessel) and the buoy (which I had thought was an oceanographic research buoy which had cut loose and had all it's instruments drop off) I knew the pilots were ok at least, and I wasn't surprised.

And I wasn't worried by this all - not at the time anyway - because I thought this was all some top secret experimental military thing. How ironic is that?

As a bit of a background, as a commercial diver in Kuwait I have worked with maintaining such research buoys. Also, As a long term expat in Kuwait, I stayed there (I was teaching at the time) throughout the 1998(?) scud thing and the 2003(?) invasion that caused uproar and panic on the TV, whilst we were just laying on the beach thinking how quiet it was, except for when the sirens went off, and with mates sitting on their apartment roofs just watching the missiles fly over... So no I wasn't in the least bit surprised by everything I saw at the time.

Was I worried about it when I heard what had happened? I guess I was so worried I chose to hide it away and focus on changing what I could in the world around me. Talking of which, the boat's coming along very well, thanks! The guy in charge at the yard we're using has been very efficient, kept a clean shop and and been relaxed, and great with the dogs, which is what matters most, of course!

[europaflyer]

Originally Posted by SaucySailoress

I observed it a few times, and it appeared to be getting closer. At this stage I was wondering if it was going to land near us and wipe us out.

Closer? Wondering if it was landing? New to me...

Originally Posted by SaucySailoress

I almost immediately saw the plane take shape.

I thought you said a while back that you just saw an orange glow, not a plane. This 'plane taking shape' is surely a later embellishment of your memory.

Originally Posted by SaucySailoress

...decided it must be a military plane playing with some top secret technology that made planes glow orange,

Don't think you've said this before either. At least, not in the context of what you were thinking at the time.

Originally Posted by SaucySailoress

and then when it turned away and headed back towards where we had passed those glowing white lights (we had initially thought was a research vessel) and the buoy (which I had thought was an oceanographic research buoy which had cut loose and had all it's instruments drop off) I knew the pilots were ok at least, and I wasn't surprised.

Turning? I thought you said it just flew past your stern? I have never heard anything about turning before. And your 'knowing the pilots were OK'? New, all new...

Originally Posted by SaucySailoress

because I thought this was all some top secret experimental military thing. How ironic is that?

I thought you felt "it was more likely I was going insane".


As we have said before, the more you go over it and hear people talk about it, the more the memory will change and grow to fit the facts. I think your last post proves this beyond all doubt.

I'm glad the refit is going well! Sounds like you need a nice voyage to wash some of this away...

All the best.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by MAP Waves

In this line what I find difficult is actually are there ANY FACTS after 17:19, ...........


17:19 ATC last radio contact.
17;22 Last ATC (secondary) radar fix
[COLOR="red"]Question 2: At a guess is flightradar24 as report says civilian radar confirmation. Is this correct?
IF this is the source;
Question 3- There are 2 versions in regards timing the last contact on flightradar24. I downloaded a video of the flighttrader24.com video that was on you tube and posted this anomaly of the time difference which said 17:51 vs the ATSB 17:22 and as is on Flightradar24 MH370 link.
............

MAPW,

While I am not fully up to speed with the fine detail of Flightradar24 (FR24), I pretty certain that the following info is accurate.

In this region of the world, FR24 gets its data from ADS-B transmissions which are transmitted by the aircraft via it's transponder system. These ADS-B transmissions are essentially derived from on-board GPS data. I can go into much more technical detail but such is unnecessary IMO.

FR24 is a private outfit and has a series of ground stations (either owned by them or that they have access to) all over the place. These ground stations are small affairs and just pick up (and decode) the transponder transmissions.

Air Traffic Control Radar have their own radar system that includes Secondary Surveillance Radar (SSR). This SSR is the method that ATC can interrogate the aircraft transponder system and receive SSR returns from the transponder. Included in these SSR returns are also the ADS-B data.

SSR returns are very basic and really only include an aircraft identifier and aircraft altitude. It is that ADS-B data that contains much more detail.

When we are told that the transponder was deactivated, this info would have come from ATC and is timed by their SSR returns (which occur about every 20 seconds or so).

It would have nothing to do with whatever FL24 was getting except to say they are both receiving the same signal from the same source (ie the aircraft). That is to say, the ground stations receiving the aircraft data are two separate outfits. One is the radar system operated by a government owned ATC, the other is a simple receiver operated by a private individual or corporation.

Hope this is clear but if not, PM me if you wish and I will try to explain better.

[MESSI2014]

Originally Posted by SaucySailoress

I realise now that although I have clarified my observations and my thoughts, I haven't done so in one place.

1. I spotted a bright orange glow in the distance. At first I thought it might be a meteorite. I observed it a few times, and it appeared to be getting closer. At this stage I was wondering if it was going to land near us and wipe us out. Which I thought was bloody typical, not that the boat had finally got a bit dry.

2. I spotted what appeared to be black smoke behind it. My instant thought was if it was a missile (a term I have avoided using until now), but then I almost immediately saw the plane take shape. This is when I thought it might be a plane on fire. Yes, I did consider waking the crew at this stage, but i could not see a fire.

3. For the majority of my sighting, I was just staring at a plane that was glowing. I wondered why it was glowing, still couldn't find the light source, and decided it must be a military plane playing with some top secret technology that made planes glow orange, and then when it turned away and headed back towards where we had passed those glowing white lights (we had initially thought was a research vessel) and the buoy (which I had thought was an oceanographic research buoy which had cut loose and had all it's instruments drop off) I knew the pilots were ok at least, and I wasn't surprised.

And I wasn't worried by this all - not at the time anyway - because I thought this was all some top secret experimental military thing. How ironic is that?

As a bit of a background, as a commercial diver in Kuwait I have worked with maintaining such research buoys. Also, As a long term expat in Kuwait, I stayed there (I was teaching at the time) throughout the 1998(?) scud thing and the 2003(?) invasion that caused uproar and panic on the TV, whilst we were just laying on the beach thinking how quiet it was, except for when the sirens went off, and with mates sitting on their apartment roofs just watching the missiles fly over... So no I wasn't in the least bit surprised by everything I saw at the time.

Was I worried about it when I heard what had happened? I guess I was so worried I chose to hide it away and focus on changing what I could in the world around me. Talking of which, the boat's coming along very well, thanks! The guy in charge at the yard we're using has been very efficient, kept a clean shop and and been relaxed, and great with the dogs, which is what matters most, of course!

I like this new report. It is more complete.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by europaflyer

I feel I should reiterate my point that you should not take this whole episode so seriously as to let it start to have a major impact on your life. I sincerely doubt you watched a 'live cremation'. Burning aircraft DO NOT fly on for hours after a fire visible from several miles away has started. They crash within minutes. Although some workings I did early on in the thread - which unfortunately have been widely reported on - did construct a scenario whereby MH370 could have passed your boat, I should have made it clearer that that is all they showed.

Being made primarily of aluminium, aircraft structures are compromised very rapidly by fire. There is no precedent for an aircraft flying with significant fire damage for a fraction of the time which MH370 flew after your sighting.

Some of the speculation on this thread is really getting very silly, and all in all I am thoroughly glad I post anonymously so as to not be associated with it, and indeed so that the misinterpretations of what I have posted previously cannot be attributed to me.

If I were in your position I would have not further involvement with it other than in any future correspondence with the authorities. You have done a great job in trying to remember as much detail as you can about the event, and perhaps the authorities will find what you have sent to them of use. However, I really hope you don't get dragged in to convincing yourself that you did genuinely see MH370 and that you bear some sort of responsibility, or even ending up trying to defend what you saw. In my mind, your work here is done. Fix your boat up, go sailing!

This is what I was trying to say in an earlier post. It's just plain silly to assume emotional responsibility for something that happened whether a person saw an event or not. Eg. A person saw the twin towers fall and 3000 people perished. In reality the 3000 people perished whether an individual saw it or not. All the attachment to an event does is to charge a persons ego and I only mean the ego as a sense of self and attachment.

As far as the weirdness this thread has taken...an event like this brings out all the conspiracy theorist in the worst way. I wish Star Trek episodes were still running to give them something to do. CF policy is anyone, regardless of owning a boat or not...or even interested in sailing can ply their weirdness at will here. Only a few have brought anything positive to the topic at hand.

Originally Posted by Advocate

Perhaps you should go to Websleuths to read all that was dug up on the plane being missing. As I said; I stopped actively participating to help a family with a missing son; another with a missing sister as well as the unidentified persons I advocate for. I'm also helping to try to pass a law in the US for missing and unidentified persons to immediately be entered into a federal database; so excuse me for not knowing much about the Freescale technology. A cloaking program that would make a plane glow orange would surely contradict itself by drawing more attention to it. Guess I needed more coffee. No need for you to be rude by telling me to grow up. I'm not a young kid

Something happened to the plane. How does a plane go missing like that in this day and age? Malaysia is being very secretive about everything.

Cloaking!...Uh...ok. Please feel free to indulge in all this hookus pookus but it lends itself little to the topic at hand. All it does is to dilute any reality that this thread has to offer.

I have a feeling I am going to be sorry I re-subscribed to this thread...

[MAP Waves]

Thanks for explanation but the issue is that there are different versions and screenshots - which is correct?

From a bit cruising the net it is clear that;

1 - There were indeed different versions in the first 48 hours of MH370's disappearance , not only on flightradar24, but also FlightAware, however it appears most has been "removed"!
Proof Malaysia Airlines 370 Had Clone, Radar Data Retrieved | Events

2 - It would appear there were even 2 MH370's
Proof Malaysia Airlines 370 Had Clone, Radar Data Retrieved | Events

Now I have no idea who / what beforeitisnews.com is or how credible, however i cannot find that anyone has made any demands or threats from the alternative version and cannot understand unless there is irrational behaviour or coercion why they might have been removed

Busted! Flight Radar Caught Changing Flight Path of Malaysia Flight 370! - YouTube

This is yet another version where the guy explains differences and shows different versions proving Flightradar24 HAS INDEED CHANGED THEIR DATA.

3 - Malaysia says there's sealed evidence on MH370 that cannot be made public
Malaysia says there's sealed evidence on MH370 that cannot be made public


Based on "facts" like this ATSB is searching and people are making projected flight paths etc......

This is from just a couple of hours of cruising the net!

I feel for those poor people who have lost loved ones. They will never get true closure!

[SaucySailoress]

A few days ago I enquired about how to get in touch with the relatives and friends of MH370. This morning I received an email from them, and sent a reply. My reply follows:

Thank you for contacting me. I want to offer an apology to the families and friends, but I am not ready to do so just yet. As of now, I do not know whether what I saw was related to the disappearance of MH370 or not.



I firmly believe that it is. If it is, then there is probably nothing I can to to make up for not reporting it sooner, except to explain that I do now realise that I closed myself to it due to fears. Those fears were my mind over reacting to the thoughts I'd had at the time combined with my thought processes when I heard a plane had disappeared. I have described some of my thought processes at the time of the sighting on a very recent forum post, #511. I have copied that post below for your reference.



However, it could well be that the investigating authorities find that my sighting was nowhere near MH370. If that turns out to be the case, then by speaking out all I have done is raised the emotions of those involved again. Anger? Hope? Confusion? I don't know.



I will approach you, the relatives and friends at some stage. I pray for resolution in this matter. And I promise that when the time is right, I will offer an apology, because either way I am sure I must have caused emotional harm, and either way, I am very sorry.




Below is the post I made yesterday, clarifying the timeline of my sighting, and explaining some of my thoughts at the time (ie, how I was interpreting what I was seeing at the time): [link to post #511]

[stewball5]

Originally Posted by Jess928

I have to agree that Stew's theory is the most intense and the most plausible so far. I'm not sure what his background is whether professional pilot or other?
As suggested earlier, the mystery of the actual flight is irrelevant to a certain degree. It's whether Saucy potentially saw something of relevance to the search and if so, establishing the facts surrounding that sighting with a view to locating the resting place of 240 souls.

I am not familiar with the E systems on a 777 but I am familiar with similar assets so ANY theory is plausable (ISS, search plane, shooting star, meteor etc) as to what Saucy saw.

Either way, I can accept that after an exhaustive data mine using forum members, outside agencies and professional bodies, Stew's theory is the most acceptable so far. I congratulate and thank him on his commendable offerings and apologise for pushing the Dornier point.

I also have to acknowledge Saucy's calm, professional and metered responses to this situation. I wish you a guilt free and happy future after your trauma.

Only time, education and tenacity will show us the way now to the whereabouts of MH370 and 240 souls.

Jess, thank you for the kind words. We are still working on the same assumptions, but have updated to the latest Inmarsat rings. More later I hope. Regards, Stew Stoddart

[Gclark8]

They just found a lost aircraft about 2 miles off the end of the runway at Broome WA, 70 years after the aircraft dissapeared, so don't hold your breath, it may be a long time before MH370 is found.

Divers find plane wreckage off Broome's Cable Beach believed to be WWII-era RAAF Beaufighter - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

They are still looking for a Cessna210 in Barrington Tops, near Newcastle NSW after 33 years and it was on radar when it dissapeared.

Has Cessna crash mystery been solved? - ABC Newcastle NSW - Australian Broadcasting Corporation

[europaflyer]

This is all getting ridiculous. Saucy, for goodness sake, don't start apologising to anyone. Even if you did see MH370 - which I firmly believe you did not - you bear no responsibility for anything relating to the accident.

MH370 ditched in the sea thousands of miles away from you and hours later. As I keep saying, this totally discounts a major fire, including an engine fire. Even if MH370 did pass you at 1920 (and it couldn't have done any earlier) that is still two hours after the ADS-B and TXP ceased transmitting. Engines DO NOT burn for two hours. An engine fire is a totally implausible scenario, and in spite of Stew's obvious competence with X-Plane and Google Earth, he clearly lacks the depth of engineering knowledge to realise this.

The only likely scenarios involve a pilot who was suicidal or not of sound mind, or a failed hijacking attempt. Both are entirely precedented and plausible. New evidence is emerging that the captain may have intentionally flown the aircraft to the southern Indian Ocean for reasons as yet unknown.

Don't listen to the pop-up experts Saucy, they appear after every aircraft accident and are rarely much help. Listen to sense. You did not see MH370. You bear no responsibility. Please, do not try to contact the families of the victims, for their sake far more than yours. The image of their loved ones being burned alive as you are claiming is an extremely distressing one, and has no basis in fact. It is totally unnecessary and very cruel to present it to them. The likelihood is that they either slipped quietly in to comas due to hypoxia early on in the flight, or died very quickly when the aircraft hit the ocean. No fire was involved, and neither were you.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by europaflyer

Please, do not try to contact the families of the victims, for their sake far more than yours. The image of their loved ones being burned alive as you are claiming is an extremely distressing one, and has no basis in fact.

+1...Exactly. What would the point be other than self serving.

[Advocate]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Cloaking!...Uh...ok. Please feel free to indulge in all this hookus pookus but it lends itself little to the topic at hand. All it does is to dilute any reality that this thread has to offer.

I have a feeling I am going to be sorry I re-subscribed to this thread...

Perhaps you should do some reading about Freescale. I asked the members of WS to give me a link that explains it; the people following Freescale haven't been on. I honestly do not want to side track Kate's post; I honestly do not have time to jump back into following the plane. I came here to offer support to Kate as well as let her hub know where to find more info. I'll leave you a few links for Freescale. Have to get back to advocating.

Freescale RF Power Solutions for Aerospace and Defense

News release - Freescale Releases Its First 11 RF Power Products Suitable for U.S.-Based Defense Market Applications

This is an article I was given.
Malaysian plane: 20 passengers worked for ELECTRONIC WARFARE and MILITARY RADAR firm A US technology company which had 20 senior staff on board Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 had just launched a new electronic warfare gadget for military radar systems in the days before the Boeing 777 went missing.

[Cpt Pat]

There is an excellent analysis and a very plausible theory posted here: A Startlingly Simple Theory About the Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet | Autopia | WIRED.

Conclusion in short: fire in flight.

What Saucy saw may have been a landing gear tire ablaze, extended outside the wheel well. Tires do catch fire on aircraft. Here's a Boeing document on that topic: AERO - Preventing Wheel/Brake-Area Fires

My deepest sympathies go out to the families. No one should have to endure this uncertainty. Their insistence for answers is a service to everyone who flies. If it's any comfort, there are many many people who share their need for answers and closure.

And Saucy, I for one see no reason that you should apologize. Anyone who is not a pilot could not be expected to apprehend what you were seeing.

[europaflyer]

That 'startlingly simple theory' was nonsense when it was written in March and is nonsense now.

No fire. Not with what we now know.

[kayej1188]

Saucy, I'll try to say this in the nicest way possible, but this thread has progressively regressed into a collection of your personal insecurities and emotional struggles. It's no longer about the incident of a missing plane full of people, it's now about you and your conquest to garner support, sympathy, and pity. It's become quite uncomfortable.