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Old 06-09-2013, 12:51   #16
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

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So have you taken to hanging six to eight foot lengths of 1/4 inch line over the pulpits? You know, because you might need to lash something in a hurry.

I have one ready at the bow and one ready at the stern ...
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:40   #17
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

for 3 years i have nbeen inmexico onmainland living thru tboomers and forming ts and furycames. this year we are already past letter L that means 12 srtorms plus the local stuff.. never discount the local stuff!!!
mazatlan in 2011 was a goopod breaking in place, as we had tormentas sinnombre with 40 kt winds as local stuff.... no problem.
be ready for worst at all times, and then when you have a light lil rainfall and no wind, as modst of these are when they are forming, you willnot have to be surprised when it is a good punch. spiderweb into mangroves or at a dock and keep tarps low and spiderwebbed onto boat. gods will take anything not tightly secured.
when at anchor, keep your spare anchors either deployed so you ae 3 or 4 point anchored with bow into worst wind... if mangroves are available--- back into those and hunker down, with 2 lines astern to the mangroves.

i sleep like the dead before a storm, however, just within a half hour of onset, i am awakened by something -- a change in tarp movement or some little something, and i go thru the checklist and finish just in time for first drops of rain or big wind.
it is all in the planning and readiness in summer. summer is the season to be ready for anything in mexico, especially in golfo de california aka sea of cortez.
you will find that the more storms you experience the better your checklist and sleep will be... funny thing about that--but i do not sleep during storms, as anything can happen even when best prepared for the event--lines snap, anchors drag, dock cleats snap off dock--yes that has happened in mazatlan..
i found that as my prep improved, my ability to sleep well prior to a storm has improved greatly.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:57   #18
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

Next to actually being caught out in a 'furricane' the worst place for you and your boat to be is in a marina. Other boats, docks and pilings become battering rams. Next worse is at anchor, because few anchoring schemes will prevent your boat from dragging in 'furricane' conditions. Best place for your boat is in a location where you can secure multiple lines, doubled or tripled up - some more slack than others - to strong points (trees) on opposite banks. Heavy foilage/trees that help to reduce wind strength is a big plus.

Do the best you can to secure the boat, and then LEAVE for a place safe from the storm.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:18   #19
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

geography is important in choice of remaining in a marina or going into a mangrove area---in a lagoon vs in an open bay---i choose the marina in the lagoon in which both marina and lagoon are protected from wind and swell from any and all directions--i choose that marina or the mangroves nearby.
mazatlan is a scary place when named storms approach as the marina area is falsely protected, in that even though ther ehas allegedly been no damage in 33 years in the marina area, there is a current that is scary for increasing swell an dsurge--i had a mangrove area picked out when i lived in maz for a summer......
la cruz dehuanacaxtle is the scariest placei was in for furycames--ther eis no shelter and is like galveston bay wherein boats are lumped together due to current and wind direction during storms....
barra de navidad has a mucky iffy holding lagoon that is only 10 ft in depth including the foot or two of loose silt between your boat and the solid ground under it with poor at best holding for most anchoring techniques, but the thing most yachties do NOT know is the mangrove area is safer than hiding in the golfo de california, aka sea of cortez--we have no chubascos nor northers and when winds from to be named storms are occasionally up to 40 kts, is none in the mangroves--there are 3 boats there at present and only 2 months left. this marina is sheltered well from winds and swell coming into the lagoon from open unprotected bay--the only complaint from the owners of those boats has been the dengue carrying mosquito population. that complaint is not made when the to be name storms are overhead forming--lol they are happy then.....
it has been stated by those with fully insured boats that if their insurance would allow them to have their boat at this latitude in summer they would be here also-- is unusual for this place to be truly hit by a well formed furycame--jova was in 2011. jova came from the protected side, as they are all going to do , as our unprotected side is facing land, solid land, where storms go to die and weaken. the only damage to town was from the seas striking and crossing over the malecon on and from the open to ocean bay side--lagoon side was fine.
in choice of location for facing furycames and forming named storms, it is a good idea to research history of hits and geography of area in which you plan on spending some possibly unexpected time.
this was a perfectly planned unplanned repair stop, but was in our cintingency plans-my repair guy wanted to go to golfo de california, but this, a sit wa son our way and planned as a provisioning and rest stop, became our summer place---and is perfect! so far--no winds over 50 kts, which is 10 kts above howling wind here, and hurry to remove or drop level of tarps time, and lots of rain, which is very much needed here, and some lightning which seems to avoid this il morro we are nestled up against. i also have 4 pilings and the easiest to exit slip in the marina. sails up--out into mangroves and allegedly safer haven.
before the furycame season starts, if you have a planned hole to hide boat in, make sure you have alternatives, so that if a katrina is predicted, you can hunker down safer and leave boat or not as you see fit. in this marina, if the prediction is for extreme named storm, we are spozed to go into marina free and use hotel for safety--i dont know if they charge a fee or if it is granted as a safety measure--we hope to not find out.
i have a more secure feel in a locale closer to formation point of these great mayhems nature provides us than in a location farther away from that formation point, as the winds are not severe until they leave here to go elsewhere, and are not seriously bad yet.

so far, to say ALL marinas are bad in named storms is false.
to say always do anything is false information --you need to do that which your gut feeling says to do --you wont do yourself harm that way--
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:18   #20
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

Rebel Heart:

You are suffering from responsibility and fear. When you've learned that you've really prepared adequately, you'll have more confidence and less fear. But really, some fear is what keeps you on your toes! It's your friend. And while a constant only 5 hrs of 24 would not be "enough" sleep, for one night, it's really no biggy. You'll have an opportunity within 3 or 4 days to have a long, long, sleep.

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Old 07-09-2013, 09:23   #21
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

Just to comment on some of the comments:

- I stay onboard during cyclones, my family is off. To me the only times I leave my boat is when I'm confident she's totally safe (normal anchoring, marinas in settled weather, etc), or when I'd be willing to write her off completely. Anything in the middle and I'm on.

- When I go on deck I'm usually bare ass naked or just in board shorts. I pop some underwear on down below once I dry off, but it's super uncomfortable no matter how you slice it.

- Regarding tying off to trees and the such, there are places (like here) where there are no trees. It's a desert and unless you had literally thousands of feet of line onboard you wouldn't be able to land tie.

- There are moorings provided in Puerto Escondido that I and another diver have inspected for wear. I'm sitting on one of those (with a 50' 1" hawser), with my own anchor ready to drop.

- It seems that the farther you get away from large concentrations of white people with money, the less accurate the weather forecasting gets. When Sandy hit the east coast, there was tons of coverage, hourly (or better) updates from NOAA, meteorologists reporting in, and high powered doppler radars tracking every rain drop.

Down here you get the general NOAA headlines, but a lot can happen in four hours. A 20 mph cyclone can move 80 miles in any direction in the time it takes for NOAA to report it happened.

Tropical Storm Lorena (the one that is still dumping rain on us this second) passed well over 80 miles from us and still dumped ~6" of rain in 12 hours with the accompanied wind and shitty weather (and it's still going).
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:25   #22
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

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Rebel Heart:

You are suffering from responsibility and fear. When you've learned that you've really prepared adequately, you'll have more confidence and less fear. But really, some fear is what keeps you on your toes! It's your friend. And while a constant only 5 hrs of 24 would not be "enough" sleep, for one night, it's really no biggy. You'll have an opportunity within 3 or 4 days to have a long, long, sleep.

Ann
Thanks Ann. I agree with everything except that last part; I still have two little kids so it will be a few years until I ever get a long, long sleep again.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:38   #23
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

This is where Rebel heart is holed up. IMHO, about the best place in the region.



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Old 07-09-2013, 10:11   #24
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

the desert area, no trees and other problems with golfo de california ar epart of the reason i am where i am , under the formation ara of cyclonic activity, essentially in the monsoonal trough in summer when the ocean is 90 plus f degrees which it gets in summer, about the time sept and oct , hottest times of year, arrive. air and water will both and are both at same temp, so cyclonic formation is a given.
however, the practices here where green happens, and desert are very different--i dislike desert and the winds and dust created in deserts--i am all too familiar with baja and phoenix as examples of the life i didnt want nor wish to have to endure--i like green places and lighter winds at anchor--ours are only running around 30-40 kts, pretty much year round, in afternoons.

the desert environment is why i was extremely pleased when my boat decided she wanted to remain here, where the excellent injector pump rebuilder is.

each of us has differing responses vs reactions to storms and severe changes in weather. we each find our own checklist to perform in the face of advancing bad stuff, whether it is chubasco or pnw storm or various degrees of tropical storm formations.

i remain with my home in storms. i know folks who are not living aboard their cruising boat that go immediately into hotels .
i know folks who have sailed thru them. they aint right in head..lol
there are responses and reactions in different form for everyone, and not one fits 2 souls nor situations....
i have done furycames ion board in gom and in tropical mexico. each one is different. i prefer to be where they are young, still forming and not as damaging to my life.

i also have inconsistently consistent interweb availability and in more than 2 methods, as i have both banda ancha and wifi here---which is so important in storm season. not true in many places in golfo de california. aka sea of cortez.

looking at passage weather, i see another formation potential for next weekend--smaller and stronger--we will see what happens, as it is forming more south of my area than the other 12 have so far---yeah we are already past our 12th successfully named formation this year-- with 2 months left in the season.
predicted path after we see it is unknown as yet. but it is a warning to those in the sea that impending rainwater is on its way, with about a week more prep time than we have here. we stay within readiness parameters in this area, and we are not surprised by anything nature provides, so far.

it is better to befoul an anchor in the roots of the mangroves than to tie to trees themselves, as those may not remain in position during extreme winds(over 80 kts is extreme per noaa,,) my repair friend has befouled 2 anchors he set via dinghy in the roots about 5 trees deep with his primary anchor an secondary are in 5 ft water, he is sitting in 8 ft water, and has 180 ft chain into the lil hill to his leeward in big winds(off bow) with each of 2 anchors in a 60 degree vee. good holding when one lays out 150 and more feet of chain in this mucky murk lagoon....any less---we have saved those dragging past when deltas didnt hold due using poor setting practices.

i know souls who have weathered furycames in southern baja---i was not interested in that scenario--every boat in the protected anchorage you showed, bob, dragged or broke away with only 2 exceptions.
i would imagine that to be rather unfriendly act on natures part. santa rosalia wasnt happy to have received paul last year , either----there are horror stories from everywhere nature creates and sends these impressive and beautiful storms. all we can do is best we can do against these forces, preferably working together with nature to save our hides and homes.
each storm is different.
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:27   #25
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

As long as Lorena doesn't do a loopty loop it looks like y'all down Baja way are out of the woods. Projected to turn N.N.W. away from Baja.
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:51   #26
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

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Down here you get the general NOAA headlines, but a lot can happen in four hours. A 20 mph cyclone can move 80 miles in any direction in the time it takes for NOAA to report it happened.
With all due respect, this is why you can't know with certainty staying with your boat, which can be replaced, is a prudent choice. Is putting your life at risk worth the gamble?
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Old 07-09-2013, 11:03   #27
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

Is this thing past yet? It looks like its well off...
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Old 07-09-2013, 11:14   #28
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

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Is this thing past yet? It looks like its well off...
Looks like it is supposed to turn almost due west by tomorrow. 20 knots w/ gusts to 30 according to N.O.A.A. furricane website.

They can always stall and reform, going sometimes in unexpected directions. But, we can probably safely presume Lorena is no longer a threat to Baja.

It's a good thing too, 'cause CF is awful quiet today with them distracted by the storm...
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Old 07-09-2013, 11:22   #29
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

I'd like to comment on one thing Zeehag wrote, about "hiding out in the mangroves." When I first heard that phrase, it meant little to me. But then one time during a cyclone, a ham radio friend of ours did just that, in Fiji. We stayed in a well protected bay. The mangroves protected them so well, they never even struck their awning! It is truly amazing how very much protection the mangroves can give you, providiing your draft is shallow enough to go up the mangrove streams. One finds them by exploring one's paper charts, then doing dinghy exploration and using a leadline to check the depths, or a portable depth sounder, if you carry one.

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Old 07-09-2013, 11:31   #30
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Re: I Never Sleep Well Before A Storm

Zeehag, your post #24 here: SUPER!
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