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Old 05-07-2010, 04:05   #1
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Furler Problem + Heavy Wind

i can laugh about it now but i had my santana 23 out with my brother, my friend and his girlfriend out for an afternoon sail. we anchored up for a bit and sailed south with a decent broad reach with maybe 11 knots. i had my boom restraint on " just in case " because even though he had sailing experience i didnt trust him enough. so after the wind dies, and i mean dead, we inched toward what little wind we could see, and decided to close haul back north. well on the way back the wind had shifted and started to increase 15 gusting to 26kts. as i went to furl the jib i knew soemthing was wrong so i gave the helm to my friend while i went to check the furler. the line had somehow made it under the drum and was jamming up. as im sitting bowlegged and trying to yell to my brother to cut the knot off the end of the line, my friend was tending more to his freaked out girlfriend than the wind and goes life tacked which means i now am pinned to the lifeline by my throat. he spilled the main and the jib ( which in my eyes made it worse ) so now im thinking to myself just cut the halyard. i have a cdi flexible furler so i was trying to avoid that but was thinking this is really a safety issue. anyway, i get control of the boat again and as everything calms down i run back up to unfowl the octopus of lines that was keeping me from controlling the jib when, of course, another gust comes and all i could do was watch it coming. by this time my friends girlfriend was down below so naturally he was too and we got it under control. but i was thinking that im glad that problem happened then and not when i was solo as i frequently am. lesson learned but i was also able to make a solution for it with a metal O ring to keep that from happeneing again. yeah, we laugh about it now but i was pretty pissed at the "admiral" as his come to be known as.
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Old 05-07-2010, 10:14   #2
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Just my opinion- why a roller furler on a 23 ft boat? Hanked sails would allow for a sail to match conditions and on 23 footer will always come down and can be quickly stowed in bag or with shock cord on deck or to life lines.I can see the roller on a big sail that might be hard to handle by one person but not on a postage stamp. the single hand excuse does not cut it with me I used to single hand a 44 ft J boat with hanks.A hanked sail will last longer and can have a better shape and is ultimately a safer sail(it will come down under stress)-there is much less to snafu
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Old 05-07-2010, 11:27   #3
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Perhaps I'm just dumb but I can't picture how one might have gotten the furling line under the drum unless there are no fairleads to direct the line. If not, you should add a fairlead such then when the furling line is pulled tight, the line's lead is perpendicular to the axis of the headstay at the center of the drum. Even on a 23' boat it would be wise to add fairleads along the side decks of the boat although, given the small size of the head sails you could safely use only bull's eyes with a cam-cleat near the helm to be able to lock the furling line down. Then, just be sure to keep some tension on the furling line as you unfurl the sail to ensure a tight wrap without over-rides on the drum.

As for furling on a small boat, given that the weight of a man forward on a small boat could have a disproportionate effect on the boat's handling and stability, I see nothing wrong with furling at all and it certainly is more convenient. My only dislike of furling is that it does make chainging headsails somewhat of a pain in the neck.

FWIW...
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Old 05-07-2010, 12:45   #4
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As for wt going forward there is always the down hall line to cockpit-I have used this on 19,20,21 foot boats with good results-furling is easy-well done it is reasonable- not always better.Many boats come with furling gear and it is hard to take it off and convert sails to hanks-my present J/100 has a furler and it works well but half the time I leave the dock I wish I had hanks so I could put up the proper headsail instead of the compromise furler.
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Old 05-07-2010, 13:10   #5
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there are pad eyes along the stanchions leading up to the furler. the problem is there is a small gap below the drum and the above the bottom of drum cover. i placed a metal o ring so it cant happen again which was a simple and effective solution. the furler is a good idea in my eyes 90 percent of the time. it is true, the boat is water ballast so im not sure if that has anything to do with it but it will only allow for a few seconds at best before she starts to stray.
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Old 05-07-2010, 14:09   #6
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Perhaps I'm just dumb but I can't picture how one might have gotten the furling line under the drum unless there are no fairleads to direct the line.
It happened to me because I bought second hand and assumed the boat was rigged right. The furling line wasn't routed neatly into the drum, it was too low, and any looseness caused a wrap around beneath the drum. Of course it happened in a strong wind with three novices as crew. Fortunately one followed instructions at the helm while I tried to clear it but then had to drop the sail, a big 150 genoa. All went well, thanks to a sound boat.
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Old 05-07-2010, 15:31   #7
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If you want to go forward or to mast when single handing on a small boat you can tie off tiller to midline with shock cord and also have a running line from tiller to cockpit sides to shrouds or life lines to turning block at bow and back down other side of boat to tiller(a continuous line ) pull or push this line from anywhere on boat and you control the tiller. I have changed out sails on a santana 21(very tender and squirrely boat) in heay air with this rig.
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Old 05-07-2010, 16:33   #8
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Glad it was an easy fix and you didn't have to cut anything. I remember trying out a friend's asymetricl spinnaker for the first time and launching from a sock. Very light winds until the gust came along. What a scramble!!! Always something new each time I go sailing and not know how the thing was supposed to be put back in the sock was kind of frustrating until we pulled on the right line.
regards,
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Old 05-07-2010, 17:54   #9
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Always keep tension on the furling line as the line plays out and the sail unfurls. Two reasons: 1) Keeps the line from jumping the furler (fairleads are also a good idea), 2) The line may get caught under itself and jamb when tensioned when re-furling the sail. A furling headsail is a good addition to a boat frquently single handed.
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Old 05-07-2010, 20:12   #10
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Originally Posted by speciald@ocens. View Post
Always keep tension on the furling line as the line plays out and the sail unfurls. Two reasons: 1) Keeps the line from jumping the furler (fairleads are also a good idea), 2) The line may get caught under itself and jamb when tensioned when re-furling the sail. A furling headsail is a good addition to a boat frquently single handed.
I had this second issue a number of times before someone clued me in. Now my life is much more boring. Once I thought it through it was pretty obvious, don't know why I didn't see it myself. I put a cleat in the cockpit where I can put a easy wrap on to help control the tension when it feeds out, especially if the wind catches the sail and she just spins out, that is not good if you have to rewind in any kind of wind.

And thanks to EYSHULMAN for that idea about the continuous line tiller control. I like it. I'll have to see if I can make it work on my wheel.
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Old 05-07-2010, 21:47   #11
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ive tried all sorts of methods about moving around while keeping a heading. nothing works. again, im not sure if it is because its water ballast but nothing seems to work. thanks for the input.
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:15   #12
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Not sure why you need to leave cockpit if you have roller furling (unless of course it jams) - since you're using two ropes- the foresail sheet and the furling line - both of which you can operate from cockpit. (And of course remember to think of it as a loop, as Speciald says, you need to keep them a little taut so there is no stray line running away. Easily done by a crew.

If you are single handed, then clearly you'll need to let go of the tiller to do this, but are you heading into wind? In my limited experience, boats don't tend to veer off the wind unless they are steered off.

If you don't want to waste a few minutes by luffing up, then could you lash the tiller to help hold your course?
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:51   #13
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If you have problems with your furling line, just stick it on a winch to get the sail back in.





















































(joke!)
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:22   #14
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If you have problems with your furling line, just stick it on a winch to get the sail back in.....
(joke!)
Nope. I thought and thought about this for at least ten seconds, but I just don't get it. Sorry. Please explain to a simple gal.
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:34   #15
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Simple gal: I have had it drummed into me that you should NEVER put the furling line on a winch. If it needs that much force to pull it in, then either
a) the sail is too full
b) there's something wrong with your furler.

Putting the furling line on the winch in either of these situations you're putting too much load on the furler and the line and you could easily break something. This is particularly true if something has jammed and you don't know what it is!

If it's a) then luff up or ease the sheet, if it's b) then go and fix the problem with the furler. If the furler is so broken that it can't be fixed, will it un-furl all the way instead? - in which case do that and drop the sail. If it won't go either way, then you're really stuck - I guess this is why die-hards don't like furlers! Depending on the conditions, maybe you could use the sheets to turn the sail around the furler instead of the furler around the sail?
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