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Old 30-04-2014, 18:58   #121
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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Originally Posted by CarlF View Post
I don't see how the price of a boat has anything to do with a captain's responsibility to the safety of other vessels and their crews. And if it's ridiculous to carry a $500 AIS on an $800 boat, is it also ridiculous to carry a $600 EPIRB? A $250 VHF radio? $100 for charts? How about $50 in flares? $30 for a horn?

And my comment wasn't about whether someone is permitted to leave the dock. It's whether a captain can consider it good seamanship to not equip a cruising sailboat with AIS. Ten years ago, sure. But not today.

I also apologize for this thread drift. This has nothing to do with Taleisin. I'll drop it.
I guess good seamanship would be to never untie your dock lines, then nothing can go wrong! When does the list of expensive crap you have to own to have a "seaworthy vessel" end? I guess it's turned into a rich mans sport.
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Old 30-04-2014, 19:07   #122
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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I guess good seamanship would be to never untie your dock lines, then nothing can go wrong! When does the list of expensive crap you have to own to have a "seaworthy vessel" end? I guess it's turned into a rich mans sport.
Au contraire, You can do pretty much what you want, except for around here.
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Old 30-04-2014, 19:23   #123
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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Originally Posted by CarlF View Post
I don't see how the price of a boat has anything to do with a captain's responsibility to the safety of other vessels and their crews. And if it's ridiculous to carry a $500 AIS on an $800 boat, is it also ridiculous to carry a $600 EPIRB? A $250 VHF radio? $100 for charts? How about $50 in flares? $30 for a horn?

And my comment wasn't about whether someone is permitted to leave the dock. It's whether a captain can consider it good seamanship to not equip a cruising sailboat with AIS. Ten years ago, sure. But not today.

I also apologize for this thread drift. This has nothing to do with Taleisin. I'll drop it.


He uses no EPIRB (personal choice and not a safety issue for anyone but him), you can get a decent used VHF for $50, photocopied charts cost $12 each, and I bet his perfectly functional flares and horn were also acquired for less than you suggest. But an AIS transmitter, not just a receiver? That would price him right out, and I'm sure he's not alone in that.
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Old 30-04-2014, 19:40   #124
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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Au contraire, You can do pretty much what you want, except for around here.
Good point.

On the www, the rules of seamanship are like gambling rules or poker rules: they're whatever the other guy wants them to be.

Here's what I think a good rule would be for the only place it matters:

Keep your boat and crew as safe as sensibly possible, while exposing other people (including other seafarers trying to follow the same rule) to as little risk as sensibly possible.

I'm pretty sure the original owners of the OP boat would be still following that rule if they were still sailing her. I don't think it's thread drift at all. Safety is not ultimately about gadgets and convenience items.

A small boat designed to cope with no engine is arguably safer in extremis for both her own crew and others than a large boat with complicated and vulnerable electrical power systems, plus an engine or engines which are required for safe handling under some circumstances, but which rely on the availability of electrical power.

And that includes ships.


Check out the ten seconds from 0m50sec

The problem with this ship was that everything was perfectly fine until a wave popped a viewport on the bridge, and an electrical distribution panel at the rear of the bridge got a dunking.

Consequently the ship lost all power, and consequently all control.

I would think this would be a sobering incident, to an open-minded proponent of 'modernity' automatically presenting solutions to all our problems.
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Old 30-04-2014, 19:53   #125
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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...

.... I don't think we're talking about a collision risk with a fully manned warship.
If you're relying on them keeping out of our way, you might want to consider their intermittent difficulties keeping out of the way of each other, and even merchant shipping.

It seems conceivable they present more of a risk to others than Taleisin and her ilk.

And I'm not convinced AIS is the answer. Perhaps we should get Google to interface our AIS with our autopilot. Think how much safer that would be.

(Heck, we would't even need to leave home)
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Old 01-05-2014, 05:10   #126
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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...I also apologize for this thread drift. This has nothing to do with Taleisin. I'll drop it.
Too late.
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Old 18-05-2014, 06:15   #127
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Re: Taleisin for sale

I had a n

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Old 18-05-2014, 06:29   #128
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Re: Taleisin for sale

A lot of prospective buyers want to buy the lifestyle as well, a yacht is just an useful thing to sail the oceans in. Ultimately a thing is worth what the buyer is prepared to fork out.
Good luck to them.
As for icons , not sure, I met a number of single handed sailors doing it on a shoe string, sacrificing comfort to prove it can be done is ok, if that's their thing..

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Old 18-05-2014, 07:29   #129
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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He uses no EPIRB (personal choice and not a safety issue for anyone but him), you can get a decent used VHF for $50, photocopied charts cost $12 each, and I bet his perfectly functional flares and horn were also acquired for less than you suggest. But an AIS transmitter, not just a receiver? That would price him right out, and I'm sure he's not alone in that.
He won't get far with photocopied charts unless he becomes a pirate! Many countries will inspect flares and they have to be in date, likewise the liferaft give up while your ahead pal.
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Old 18-05-2014, 08:20   #130
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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He won't get far with photocopied charts unless he becomes a pirate! Many countries will inspect flares and they have to be in date, likewise the liferaft give up while your ahead pal.


What, now you have to leave your country and sail far to be a cruiser? He lives aboard and cruises locally. No need to "get far". And, at least here, a liferaft is not a requirement.
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Old 18-05-2014, 08:45   #131
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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What, now you have to leave your country and sail far to be a cruiser? He lives aboard and cruises locally. No need to "get far". And, at least here, a liferaft is not a requirement.
Are we not talking about world girdling cruisers here?
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Old 18-05-2014, 08:48   #132
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Re: Taleisin for sale

Photocopied charts ? Don't leave home without them. Yaaarrr ! ! !

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Old 18-05-2014, 09:05   #133
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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Are we not talking about world girdling cruisers here?

I don't think the guy who suggested passing a law requiring all boats to have AIS was, no. Did you even read the thread?
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Old 18-05-2014, 09:36   #134
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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I don't think the guy who suggested passing a law requiring all boats to have AIS was, no. Did you even read the thread?
Yes I read it.. did you actually understand it?

The whole I can do it for less than you, more than you, smaller than you, younger than you, older than you, bigger engine than you, no engine, one hull, two hulls, three hulls, no anchors, no stopping etc.. just pisses me off.. This is an international forum where lots of different standards apply... people just need to remember that what works in one place probably doesn't work somewhere else. What is legal in one place possibly isn't somewhere else. What costs pennies on one place costs a fortune elsewhere.. what about insurance for example, that'll probably cost more than 500 US and many countries require it, and some will even check to see if your certificate is genuine!

So lets see there is wooden boat for sale, very nice it is too, but it's not for me I'll stick with my steel hull for now. Love wood, just don't consider it a practical material for world cruising; for me. So I won't be bidding
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Old 24-05-2014, 12:14   #135
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Re: Taleisin for sale

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He won't get far with photocopied charts unless he becomes a pirate! Many countries will inspect flares and they have to be in date, likewise the liferaft give up while your ahead pal.

How do YOU get your charts?
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