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Old 25-09-2007, 05:37   #16
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A cruiser should be able to cruise

Guys, I once thought that the right of navigation was a Federal guaranty. When I did the research, I discovered that this wasn't exactly true any longer. The Federal government transferred many of it's rights on waterways to the states.

This post contains lot's of law and will generally be boring to parties not particually interested...

SUBMERGED LANDS ACT
43 U.S.C. 1301-1315, May 22, 1953, as amended 1986.

Overview. The Act grants coastal states title to offshore lands within their historic boundaries, generally up to three miles from the coastline, as well as the rights to the natural resources on or within those lands. The federal government relinquishes its claims to the lands and resources, but maintains the right to regulate offshore activities for national defense, international affairs, navigation, and commerce.

The whole Act is Here

In fact as the overview above demonstrates, our Federal government vacated it's rights to waterways to the individual States in 1953. However, States have generally upheld the right to navigation.

As to the specific case of Sarasota, Marco Island and other Florida anchoring areas, the new Florida law clearly states:

The 2007 Florida Statutes

Title XXIV
VESSELS Chapter 327
VESSEL SAFETY View Entire Chapter

327.60 Local regulations; limitations.--

(2) Nothing contained in the provisions of this section shall be construed to prohibit local governmental authorities from the enactment or enforcement of regulations which prohibit or restrict the mooring or anchoring of floating structures or live-aboard vessels within their jurisdictions or of any vessels within the marked boundaries of mooring fields permitted as provided in s. 327.40. However, local governmental authorities are prohibited from regulating the anchoring outside of such mooring fields of non-live-aboard vessels in navigation.

Now by definition, the term live-aboard is defined as a person having no land address or a person who's place of business is his boat. Hence the problems with municipalities enforcing anchoring bans.

Remember that this entire controversy is to prevent local waterways from turning into floating mobile home parks. Most of us can agree that this is not desirable. A cruiser should be able to cruise, but a squatter should be made to leave.
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Old 25-09-2007, 07:11   #17
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Originally Posted by rickm505 View Post
Guys, I once thought that the right of navigation was a Federal guaranty. When I did the research, I discovered that this wasn't exactly true any longer. The Federal government transferred many of it's rights on waterways to the states...................................

However, local governmental authorities are prohibited from regulating the anchoring outside of such mooring fields of non-live-aboard vessels in navigation.................................................

Remember that this entire controversy is to prevent local waterways from turning into floating mobile home parks. Most of us can agree that this is not desirable. A cruiser should be able to cruise, but a squatter should be made to leave.
Rickm

Excellent information!!!!

When you state: "A cruiser should be able to cruise, but a squatter should be made to leave", you hit the nail on the head.

We used to visit Beaufort, NC, but that is no longer possible. Individuals put down dozens of "private" mooring balls in a "public" waterway and claimed the anchorage, that used to be available to cruiser, as their own. I would love to see NC enact a law similar to Florida's.

To those who scream fascism. Nothing could be further from the truth. We are capilalists. The vast majority of those that you call "trustfund babies" work their F'n asses off and are now enjoying the fruits of their labor. That's how capitalism works. In a caplitalist society, there are two types of people: producers and takers. The producers can afford $15 mooring balls, the takers.......well the producers get to support them.

Yes, I know the USA is not a true capitalist society, the takers are slowly moving us towards the USSA (United Socialist States of America).

Roger
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Old 25-09-2007, 09:12   #18
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Politics aside

What RickM505 pointed out is the municipality is restricted from regulating the anchorage outside their municipal jurisdiction. My understanding of the Florida law is the municipality may petition the state to expand their jurisdiction to some of the adjacent waters, and that Sarasota Bay is in fact planning to do that, but I have my doubts the state will provide the municipality with authority for the entire bay, which is a part of the National Estuarial Project of the EPA.

Giving a city the right to decide who may use lands not under their jurisdiction is silly. New York would evict all of New Jersey. The land in question is managed by the state of Florida, who may allow Sarasota to control who is allowed to live on it, or not.

In my region it's interesting to note that several efforts to "clean up" bays and waterways have found the problem vessels are not the liveaboards, but the derelict boats owned by adjacent land owners. At least one of these efforts was spearheaded by the liveaboard community after such a vessel (used as a storage shed) became a fire boat in the bay. In that bay they contacted authorities with lists of boats, registration, and coordinates which were considered abandoned, and continue to police their neighborhood themselves.
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Old 25-09-2007, 12:20   #19
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The International Submerged Lands Management Conference, set for Oct. 28-Nov. 2 in Williamsburg, Va., will include the latest information on pending federal water access legislation and other topics.
For more information, or to register, go to: International Submerged Lands Management Conference 2007.
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Old 25-09-2007, 12:43   #20
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If the city of Miami with it's considerable political clout can't expand it's jurisdiction, it's doubtfull that any other town will be able to.

The path to local regulation appears to be the creation of mooring fields. I think this would be a good thing for all concerned parties. However, having said that, paying $13-$18 a day for a mooring seems outrageous to me as this is more than the cost of a normal Florida slip rental, but with none of the amenities. Perhaps municipalities view a brand new (but completely empty) mooring field as a legal gambit to remove all other cruisers? (is there an attorney in the house??)

I do believe that ultimately this entire issue will end up in court and actually be ruled on. It's early in the game yet, and this may take some time as municipalities seem to be avoiding this avenue.
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Old 25-09-2007, 13:28   #21
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producers and takers. The producers can afford $15 mooring balls, the takers.......well the producers get to support them.

Yes, I know the USA is not a true capitalist society, the takers are slowly moving us towards the USSA (United Socialist States of America).

Roger[/quote]

and just who would this $15 mooring ball be supporting? surely now any producers. I make custom canvas and work for a living but still am not paying $15 a day mooring ball. The attitude Im hearing is one that makes me instantly triple my prices when heard from a prospective client.
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Old 25-09-2007, 14:28   #22
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You can debate who is what til you are blue in the face. "They" are trying bleed us dry at every oportunity. I would gladly pay a reasonable fee for a Municipal Mooring if it were just that... reasonable, close in with some services. $5 a day is closer to where it should be. $10 max. Anything beyond that is gouging.

Flordia is well on the way to being off limits for cruisers. It is just as well as it is not a friendly place anymore. It is no wonder people end up in the mountains in shacks full of guns and dogfood.
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Old 25-09-2007, 15:51   #23
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It is no wonder people end up in the mountains in shacks full of guns and dogfood.
Wait one darn minute. How did you know what we have in our shack?
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Old 19-01-2010, 00:18   #24
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rleslie $600.00 a month is dirt cheap in florida? [edited for objectionable content] People like you make me sick to my stomach! What do you know about Florida to start with? I have been Anchoring in Florida for the past 10 years living aboard my boat. We get woke up at 3:00am to Lee County Cops, and Coast guard coming on our boats trashing them, finding nothing wrong, and telling us to shut our mouth or they will write you a ticket or take you to jail. All cause we refused to go on the mooring fields on Ft. Myers beach. So when I finally did go onto the moorings it's $260.00 a month. Marathon Key Florida is $275.00 a month, and $175.00 if you anchor and use their docks, and showers. So you say $600.00 a month is cheap in the state of Florida? You need to stay in the hills in NC ! $600.00 a month for a ball is Crazy. I should have the right to anchor where ever I want to as long as it's not between a Green, And red Buoy, or in front of someones home!
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Old 19-01-2010, 03:28   #25
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Capitalism producers and takers? Big business buys a gov official and take our money and rights. Noticed that you can't tie to a ball in stuart without insurance. Still after the court case its pretty cruiser friendly. 2 free day docks, dinghy tie up in park and room galore to anchor. They're removing derelict vessels in droves in fl. If areas have concerns about sewage supply pumpouts for free like Jax.
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Old 19-01-2010, 05:52   #26
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Quote:
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... I should have the right to anchor where ever I want to as long as it's not between a Green, And red Buoy, or in front of someone’s home!
Greetings Keona.

Notwithstanding any rights you have, or should have; you do NOT have the right to call anyone here, on the CF, a dumbass.

I suggest you peruse our community rules, prior to further indulging your outrage ➥ http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ork&page=rules

To wit:
“... Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Challenge others' points of view and opinions, but do so respectfully and thoughtfully.”
“... We take the "be nice" rule VERY seriously! We do not tolerate ANY rudeness.”
“... The use of bold, large or colored fonts should be used sparingly. Posts containing inappropriate formatting will be removed or modified at our discretion; e.g. all caps or excessive color.”
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Old 19-01-2010, 08:28   #27
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Moorings are coming to St. Augustine and the Salt Run areas. City government will be getting bigger because personnel will need to be hired to maintain the fields and pump our the moored boats. When the boats start by-passing the fields the locals will end up paying higher taxes. What a vicious cycle. St. Augustine has been charging for dingies landing at the municipal docks.
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Old 19-01-2010, 16:07   #28
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Keona--

FWIW you responded to a 2-1/2 year old thread. Sarasota has been attempting to implement this project for years but, thus far, local officials have pretty much proven to be "Keystone Cops" with the effort. The following is a recent report:



The matter is academic anyway as there are a number of nice places to anchor that the City has no control over per state law.
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Old 20-01-2010, 08:17   #29
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Mussolini, Hitler, and Franco were all described as fascists, but their political views had little in common. I have never seen a good definition of fascism.
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