Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 29-11-2010, 05:22   #61
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 23
Thats area is bad for storms, we got cought in a gale storm (65mph gust 10+ waves in our Chrysler C-26 if It wasn't for shreading both sails and being grounded a few hundred yards off shore we would have rode it out. oh that and I was near hypothermic. Hey it was our first time on the coast also.
Mario G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-11-2010, 05:00   #62
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4
The responsibility for the integrity of a boat's thru hulls, keel bolts, rudder, and all other systems is the responsibility of the yacht's owner when she leaves the dock, regardless of whether he/she is sailing it, loaning it to friends, having it delivered by a crew, or chartering it out for a week. The yacht owner is responsible for doing the maintenance and repairs, and /or engaging and supervising qualified professionals to do it, if he wishes to avoid a potential loss at sea. Those who enjoy the vessel whether it be the owner and his family,guests,delivery crews or charterers, are entitled to know that the boat is sound and seaworthy - that a marine survey has been done, and all deficiencies corrected . But as surveys are only done every 2-3 years, complete maintenance records should be available, as well as full insurance for the yacht'r replacement cost,
liability for damage to other yachts and injury to those on board. This is one reason that the charter companies in the Caribbean offer newer yachts, hopefully with less problems.
However, even brand new yachts not built for the high seas, can suffer serious problems and break downs in bad weather. Again emphasing the importance of carrying EPIRBS and sailing along well traveled shipping lanes, versus isolated areas of the South Pacific.
Survival suits (cost $200 & up) are essential for off shore, and while they are bulky, they are not heavy, and will delay the onset of hypothermia.
willieferrell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-11-2010, 05:53   #63
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4
Make sure that all holes through the boat are sound and in excellent condition (thru hulls,stuffing box,rudder post). Critical amounts of water can threaten a boat's stability , steering capability, and upright position in the water, if enough saltwater enters through reverse siphons thro bilge pump hoses or if keel bolts were loose or leaking. Not all of these problems can be fixed at sea, even when a high volume dewatering pump is onboard. Another Cruiser Forum post mentioned the gasoline powered 250 gpm cg-6 ( cost appx $200), but few recreational boats carry this as cumbersome to strap on deck. But this may be carried by "chase boats" in high charter areas like the BVI's.
willieferrell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-11-2010, 09:47   #64
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2
This is now four days since the USCG released the news item of the rescue. There has been no further news posted online as to hull sightings. Can it be assumed that she sank after the rescue, in this is a well traveled area 90 miles east of Norfolk- there are so many boats coming down the Chesapeake and headed either to Bermuda or down through the Bahamas. So it looks like there won't be a "post mortem" on any salvaged hull ! She went down; the USCG rescued the crew. End of story and speculation.
gossip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-11-2010, 09:56   #65
Senior Cruiser
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,584
Images: 2
pirate

Well if she was in the Gulf Stream as suggested I'd say she'll be around
50 - 90 odd miles Ntheast of last known position and heading for Iceland....
__________________

It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-11-2010, 10:05   #66
Registered User
 
YOGAO's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: St. Augustine, FL - an unwilling C.L.O.D.
Boat: Maine Cat 41
Posts: 519
Quote:
Originally Posted by gossip View Post
This is now four days since the USCG released the news item of the rescue. There has been no further news posted online as to hull sightings. Can it be assumed that she sank after the rescue, in this is a well traveled area 90 miles east of Norfolk- there are so many boats coming down the Chesapeake and headed either to Bermuda or down through the Bahamas. So it looks like there won't be a "post mortem" on any salvaged hull ! She went down; the USCG rescued the crew. End of story and speculation.
C'mon now! With a forum name like 'gossip', your post is a bit surprising, eh?

The US recently marked the 48th anniversary of the assassination of President John F. Kennedy and the speculation continues there, so let's give this incident a bit more time to play out.

Also, keep in mind that if the boat was in the Gulf Stream, it could quickly get far away from where it was abandoned. "Shipping lane traffic" isn't what it was 50 years ago. There are a lot fewer vessels out there and they have much smaller crews, so the odds of seeing a small boat are pretty remote.

There was a boat several years ago returning to the Chesapeake from Bermuda that was abandoned with the deck awash. I believe it ended up in Newfoundland about 10 days later.

Fair Winds,
Mike
YOGAO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2010, 01:41   #67
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: The Netherlands
Boat: Beneteau First 375
Posts: 11
I noticed that the life raft is not floating behind the yacht. If I was skipper, I would have put that overboard to inflate and prepare it for use as plan B. Better safe than sorry. If the boat was laid to heave to, one man could pump and one man could prepare the raft.
Herman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 11:08   #68
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Boat: Beneteau First 45f5 - Celadon
Posts: 13
I am the owner of the S/V Celadon (1992 Beneteau First 45f5) and she is still afloat at sea as confirmed early this morning, 18 days after being abandoned...

I can't begin to express how utterly frustrating and sickening it feels to not have been onboard at the time and been able to bring her safely back to port, or continue on to her initial destination in St. Thomas. She's a very solid boat, having been sailed extensively in the Pacific and the last four years in the Chesapeake Bay. On the West Coast, I sailed her in 20-30 ft. seas and winds gusting to 40+, and she handled beautifully. Prior to leaving on this trip, where I had intended to spend five months in the Caribbean, Celadon was nearly completely re-done from stem to stern and everything from the wind vane all the way to the bottom of her keel. I'll be happy to provide some additional details, as there is a lot of speculation in all the posts in this thread as to what may have happened. She was also surveyed (both hull and rig) a week before departure and received a clean bill of health. Most of the running rigging had been redone in the last month. Everything below the waterline had been significantly upgraded in the past eighteen months--Heavy Duty Groco Seacocks all-around and the bottom was stripped, additional layers of fiberglass added and three coats of barrier coat and bottom paint.

As for the comments about Keel Bolts, all of them were inspected by the surveyor and myself and all were in perfect condition--they were dry and painted-over and did not show any signs of rust or fracturing or anything that would signal a potential failure whatsoever.

Celadon had a brand new bilge pump installed a week before departure and it was fully tested along with the manual pump in the cockpit, both of which worked very well. She was always a dry boat--the only water I ever got in the bilge would be a cup or two resulting from rain coming down the mast.

As for safety equipment that I noted some discussion, she had the full complement of flares, lifejackets, etc. and a liferaft that was one week old. There was an EPIRB left onboard (but not activated) and a SPOT tracking device that was taken when the boat was abandoned. Perhaps this is what has proved ultimately the most frustrating to me since if the EPIRB had been activated and lashed to the deck or the SPOT device left onboard, I could have had a vessel tow her in and I'd still have my $300K boat and property rather than facing the reality of not only losing her and extensive gear, but only being able to recover a fraction through insurance.

Hopefully I've been able to answer some of the questions/speculation. I'll probably never really know what actually did or did not happen out there, but you can surely appreciate why it is such a mystery to me given all that was done to keep her in top shape and, in many ways, significantly upgraded from her original specs and equipment.

Fair Winds...
Celadon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 11:23   #69
Senior Cruiser
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,584
Images: 2
pirate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Celadon View Post
I am the owner of the S/V Celadon (1992 Beneteau First 45f5) and she is still afloat at sea as confirmed early this morning, 18 days after being abandoned...

I can't begin to express how utterly frustrating and sickening it feels to not have been onboard at the time and been able to bring her safely back to port, or continue on to her initial destination in St. Thomas. She's a very solid boat, having been sailed extensively in the Pacific and the last four years in the Chesapeake Bay. On the West Coast, I sailed her in 20-30 ft. seas and winds gusting to 40+, and she handled beautifully. Prior to leaving on this trip, where I had intended to spend five months in the Caribbean, Celadon was nearly completely re-done from stem to stern and everything from the wind vane all the way to the bottom of her keel. I'll be happy to provide some additional details, as there is a lot of speculation in all the posts in this thread as to what may have happened. She was also surveyed (both hull and rig) a week before departure and received a clean bill of health. Most of the running rigging had been redone in the last month. Everything below the waterline had been significantly upgraded in the past eighteen months--Heavy Duty Groco Seacocks all-around and the bottom was stripped, additional layers of fiberglass added and three coats of barrier coat and bottom paint.

As for the comments about Keel Bolts, all of them were inspected by the surveyor and myself and all were in perfect condition--they were dry and painted-over and did not show any signs of rust or fracturing or anything that would signal a potential failure whatsoever.

Celadon had a brand new bilge pump installed a week before departure and it was fully tested along with the manual pump in the cockpit, both of which worked very well. She was always a dry boat--the only water I ever got in the bilge would be a cup or two resulting from rain coming down the mast.

As for safety equipment that I noted some discussion, she had the full complement of flares, lifejackets, etc. and a liferaft that was one week old. There was an EPIRB left onboard (but not activated) and a SPOT tracking device that was taken when the boat was abandoned. Perhaps this is what has proved ultimately the most frustrating to me since if the EPIRB had been activated and lashed to the deck or the SPOT device left onboard, I could have had a vessel tow her in and I'd still have my $300K boat and property rather than facing the reality of not only losing her and extensive gear, but only being able to recover a fraction through insurance.

Hopefully I've been able to answer some of the questions/speculation. I'll probably never really know what actually did or did not happen out there, but you can surely appreciate why it is such a mystery to me given all that was done to keep her in top shape and, in many ways, significantly upgraded from her original specs and equipment.

Fair Winds...
So can we assume that this was a Delivery then... as its a mystery to you... and what had the skipper and crew to say about it all...
Were they Pro's... or friends/amateurs doing a favour... sorry to be nosey but it may be of use/interest to someone thinking of having their boat delivered...
__________________

It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 11:26   #70
CF Adviser

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Wherever our boat is; Playa Zaragoza, Isla Margarita
Boat: 1994 Solaris Sunstream 40
Posts: 2,449
Fair winds to you as well Celadon and thanks for the detail. I'm not sure I would have been as good-natured about it as you, in view of the speculative and accusatory comments that were made by some.

Will everyone here by satisfied? Of course not, but that is the nature of arm-chair quarterbacking and, with the news that the boat is still afloat, the benefit of hindsight. None of us are you and none of us were there with you. Others may attempt to suggest that you should have stayed with her to the extent that she is still afloat. But it was you who had to make a decision concerning the safety our yourself and crew and to do so without prescience.

Sorry for the loss of a boat that you so obviously loved.

Brad
Southern Star is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 12:06   #71
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Boat: Beneteau First 45f5 - Celadon
Posts: 13
As I said, unfortunately I was not on the boat and believe that if I had been aboard, I would have stayed with her. I've sailed her in some pretty tough conditions and know what she's capable of and because of my knowledge of all the maintenance and upgrading that's been done, as well as independent surveys, etc. I have no reason to believe any thru hull or keel bolts could have failed.

To answer Boatman's question, yes...it was a hired, [pre-]paid delivery crew with resumes, etc. I was not on board because I was going to need the time to take care of things stateside before heading to the Caribbean for five months. If you want to hear what they have to say, you'll have to find them yourself as I am unable to locate or make contact with them.
Celadon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 12:15   #72
RTB
Registered User
 
RTB's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Home port Kemah, TX Currently in Brunswick Georgia
Boat: Hunter 36
Posts: 1,524
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celadon View Post

I can't begin to express how utterly frustrating and sickening it feels to not have been onboard at the time and been able to bring her safely back to port, or continue on to her initial destination in St. Thomas....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celadon View Post
Hopefully I've been able to answer some of the questions/speculation. I'll probably never really know what actually did or did not happen out there, but you can surely appreciate why it is such a mystery to me given all that was done to keep her in top shape and, in many ways, significantly upgraded from her original specs and equipment.

Fair Winds...
The owner was not on the boat, and seems as puzzled as the rest of us as to why she was abandoned.
RTB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 12:19   #73
RTB
Registered User
 
RTB's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Home port Kemah, TX Currently in Brunswick Georgia
Boat: Hunter 36
Posts: 1,524
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celadon View Post
As I said, unfortunately I was not on the boat and believe that if I had been aboard, I would have stayed with her. I've sailed her in some pretty tough conditions and know what she's capable of and because of my knowledge of all the maintenance and upgrading that's been done, as well as independent surveys, etc. I have no reason to believe any thru hull or keel bolts could have failed.

To answer Boatman's question, yes...it was a hired, [pre-]paid delivery crew with resumes, etc. I was not on board because I was going to need the time to take care of things stateside before heading to the Caribbean for five months. If you want to hear what they have to say, you'll have to find them yourself as I am unable to locate or make contact with them.
Man, that sucks! Sorry for your loss. Too bad you can't post the names. I sure would feel bad for the next guy that hires them to deliver his boat, and something happens again.

Ralph
RTB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 12:21   #74
CF Adviser

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Wherever our boat is; Playa Zaragoza, Isla Margarita
Boat: 1994 Solaris Sunstream 40
Posts: 2,449
Wow, sorry I misread your original post. Now I am especially sorry for your loss.

Brad
Southern Star is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-12-2010, 12:27   #75
Registered User
 
delmarrey's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Philippines in the winters
Boat: It’s in French Polynesia now
Posts: 11,368
Images: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celadon View Post
I am the owner of the S/V Celadon (1992 Beneteau First 45f5) and she is still afloat at sea as confirmed early this morning, 18 days after being abandoned...
The original post and news stated the boat was taking on water from an unknown source. If so, then the boat has sunk by now, wouldn't one think. If someone knows it's a float and where, then a salvage is in order.

And I'm sorry for your loss if that be the case.
__________________
Faithful are the Wounds of a Friend, but the Kisses of the Enemy are Deceitful! ........
The measure of a man is how he navigates to a proper shore in the midst of a storm!
delmarrey is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Crew Rescued from Catamaran catty Multihull Sailboats 7 06-08-2009 19:50
Catamaran disabled, Crew rescued Sunspot Baby Cruising News & Events 8 29-10-2008 22:33
Yacht Abandoned - Crew Rescued GordMay Pacific & South China Sea 64 26-09-2008 06:59

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:01.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.