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Old 27-02-2013, 14:13   #31
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

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Originally Posted by micah719 View Post
Red herring argument. If I catch the fiddler in action, I'll do what's necessary to protect the child. If that means a slightshopsoiled kiddie fiddler getting dumped on the courthouse steps, so be it. If it's a deceased ex-fiddler, so be that too. Mind you, I'll likely be the one getting reamed by the legal system, so the most wise action in this sick world would be to see that the fiddler is dealt with and the child returned to the parents, and run and hide somewhere else on the planet where extradition is impossible.

But, whales aren't people, and I wouldnt kill a whalehunter or even throw stuff at him or act irresponsibly at sea. The problem isn't the whalehunting ship, it's the demand for whalemeat in Japan.
Well no one here or at Sea Shepard has ever advocated killing, injuring or harming whalers to protect whales. I don't have any problem with other actions to deter whalers from what they do.

Regarding demand for whale meat in Japan, see the link in my previous post.


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There are many more and some far worse things than this going on, and better ways of dealing with it or living with it than turning into little dictators making their own rules.
There are certainly many worse things taking place on the planet but that's no reason to ignore things that aren't as bad.
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Old 27-02-2013, 14:23   #32
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

Because you disagree with one side's behavior doesn't mean you approve of the others. This nonsensical connection is exactly what Sea Shepard is trying to make.

I think BOTH are in the wrong - big time - but one doesn't justify the other.
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Old 27-02-2013, 14:33   #33
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

Well, the Japanese also pay literally millios for a really prime tuna. Last time I heard a price on the news, I figured it came to something like $250 an ounce. I suppose that "just" puts it on a par with truly prime caviar?

Nice to know there's disposable income somewhere in the world.

Then again, I'm sure there are places where they say "And in America, they spend TEN DOLLARS for ONE SANDWICH?! Boy are they rich."
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Old 27-02-2013, 15:42   #34
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

I wonder if any of the players involved are masters? Seems like all kinds of COLREGS violations that could be cause for getting your ticket yanked?
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Old 27-02-2013, 15:58   #35
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

Just to remind everyone...I seem to remember the USA was founded on the basis of terrorism...open revolt against the established rule of law.
Never seems to get discussed here in USA. Funny that.
If the Brits had captured George Washington, he'd have been hanged as a terrorist.
Sounds like when enough folks feel strongly about something...it stops being terrorism and morphs into freedom., fighting injustice, blah blah...
Or is it only if you actually win the fight ?
All power to the protesters who are standing up for what they believe.
One man's pirate/terrorist is another's freedom fighter.
When we're at it...let's stop the dolphin killings in Japan.
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Old 27-02-2013, 16:15   #36
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Demand for whale meat in Japan is low. Anecdotally, my "research" consisted of asking every restaurant we visited for whale during 3 trips to Japan. None could offer it. Of course, there must be a restaurant somewhere that does, but I never stumbled on it. I then set out to buy it at the supermarkets. The first two places had none and at the third supermarket I found tinned whale meat.

The Australian Antarctic territory represents a CLAIM by Australia that is not recognized by the rest of the world. So how can Australia forbid whaling in an area that is not clearly theirs? They can try, sure, but it is complex.

The Japanese are legally permitted to kill 1000 (or 1050?) whales per year by international agreement. The agreed quota allows the whale numbers to continue increasing. They are NOT being hunted to extinction. The opposite is occurring.

The Japanese refuse to stop whaling primarily due to face saving reasons. The actions of Paul Watson et al ensure that the whalers dig their heels in even more.

The Sea Shepherds seem to have a lot of fun being pirates. I would join up for that, but not to save the whales. Maybe there are some better targets than the whalers?

Don't ask me for sources, Google is your mate, too.
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Old 27-02-2013, 16:16   #37
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

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Originally Posted by Brogan007 View Post
Just to remind everyone...I seem to remember the USA was founded on the basis of terrorism...open revolt against the established rule of law.
Never seems to get discussed here in USA. Funny that.
If the Brits had captured George Washington, he'd have been hanged as a terrorist.
Sounds like when enough folks feel strongly about something...it stops being terrorism and morphs into freedom., fighting injustice, blah blah...
Or is it only if you actually win the fight ?
All power to the protesters who are standing up for what they believe.
One man's pirate/terrorist is another's freedom fighter.
When we're at it...let's stop the dolphin killings in Japan.
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Old 27-02-2013, 16:19   #38
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

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Originally Posted by Brogan007 View Post
Just to remind everyone...I seem to remember the USA was founded on the basis of terrorism...open revolt against the established rule of law.

blah blah blah blah

why is this a point of view that has something to do with the subject..............unless you think George washngton was a whale?


wait don't answer as it doesn't matter
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Old 27-02-2013, 16:24   #39
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

My understanding of piracy is that it is armed robbery at sea. Sea Shepherd isn't doing this.
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Old 27-02-2013, 16:30   #40
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brogan007 View Post
Just to remind everyone...I seem to remember the USA was founded on the basis of terrorism...open revolt against the established rule of law.
Never seems to get discussed here in USA. Funny that.
If the Brits had captured George Washington, he'd have been hanged as a terrorist.
Sounds like when enough folks feel strongly about something...it stops being terrorism and morphs into freedom., fighting injustice, blah blah...
Or is it only if you actually win the fight ?
All power to the protesters who are standing up for what they believe.
One man's pirate/terrorist is another's freedom fighter.
When we're at it...let's stop the dolphin killings in Japan.
When the Irgun bombed the King David Hotel in Jerusalem they were terrorists. When Israel became a country they were heroes and freedom fighters.
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Old 27-02-2013, 16:31   #41
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

It actually looks more like the whalers are trying to kill the Sea Shepard folks, jamming them in between two ships like that.
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Old 27-02-2013, 17:15   #42
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

I'm all for Sea Shepherd doing their bit, after all if the powers that be had the balls to do their bit Sea Shepherd wouldn't have to and if the US and Oz navy was down there no one would be complaining (apart from the Japanese Whalers).

BUT, I do wonder what would happen if we turned around and told the Japanese that we dont care what they do.
You see, I believe part of the problem is that its is a "Saving Face" issue.
The Japanese don't want to bow to the rule of the Gaijin.

If we didn't do anything would they slow down or stop?
Could reverse psychology work?
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Old 27-02-2013, 17:23   #43
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

The Americans have a thing about guns
The Japanese have Whales
The Brits have Booze!

All plug into the national pysche in ways that are completely lost on others........

BTW the thread was started as neutral (no opinion expressed by me) - although I did guess how it would go!

I just see Sea Shepherd as some form of Cult that simply uses a "good" cause to justify it's own existence, it's not really about the whales it's about own ego(s). If I was the Japanese I would send a Gunboat out with a security zone around it - and when encroached upon they open fire. Seemples.

Personally I think that acid throwing is what really crosses the line (even though claimed to be "nice" acid) - possibly because for me it has echos of use to defend "honour" by the uncivilised.........
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Old 27-02-2013, 17:28   #44
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

may be we should send paul watson down to stop the norwegian trawlers fishing krill in the antartic, i doubt they would be as nice to him as the japs have been so far
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Old 27-02-2013, 17:33   #45
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Re: Pirates operating in Southern Ocean........

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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
The Americans have a thing about guns
The Japanese have Whales
The Brits have Booze!

All plug into the national pysche in ways that are completely lost on others........

BTW the thread was started as neutral (no opinion expressed by me) - although I did guess how it would go!

I just see Sea Shepherd as some form of Cult that simply uses a "good" cause to justify it's own existence, it's not really about the whales it's about own ego(s). If I was the Japanese I would send a Gunboat out with a security zone around it - and when encroached upon they open fire. Seemples.

Personally I think that acid throwing is what really crosses the line (even though claimed to be "nice" acid) - possibly because for me it has echos of use to defend "honour" by the uncivilised.........
Here is the "acid" that is thrown- Butyric acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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